Anti-War 100,000 - Pro-War 400

Your forgot to mention the biggest national debt of all time. Owing Billions to the Koreans and the Chinese. Spending money we don't have... typical american problem

I think we're also seeing the highest bankruptcy rates (minus the depression) ever. But don't worry about that.. it doesn't matter if the average american is $25,000 in debt as long as they can get a job for $6/hour.

I wonder what the Ave. IQ of half the public actually is

Really.. because I swear I've seen Bush doing that his entire presidency. You know.. whining about education when he can't talk straight himself. Whining about terror when he leaves our borders wide open. Whining about everything until he gets more power and takes more freedoms.

The same could be said about the 9/11 commission report and our "intelligence" on Iraq

I suppose if you want to spend the rest of your lifetimes fighting more unwinnable wars (drugs, terror), bankrupting our country, and loosing every scrap of individual freedom and privacy we have left (not a lot) keep voting for people like George Bush.

Who knows.. maybe by the end of 2006 good ol' Bush will have us occupying Iran and Syria and have the CIA selling nuke plans to 4 more rogue states why he has every citizen's phone call recorded.

 

You want some respect? Instead of listening to what the left tells you, or what you watch on CNN or read in the NYT, why not actually look up this data? It is freely available. That's a typical American problem though, many Americans let others think for them, rather than thinking for themselves.

In actuality the national debt has historically risen year after year, administration after administration. With the exceptions of perhaps (most significant exception anyway) 1835 when the debt was reduced from some 93 million dollars in 1822 to around $33,000.

Other than that, it has always risen. In fact, it rose more under Clinton than it did under Bush, and Clinton had the benefit of the Reagan/Bush years and a booming economy. Go figure.

Clinton took the national debt from some 3.6 trillion dollars to nearly 6 trillion dollars. Almost DOUBLED IT!!! Holy meatballs Batman!

Bush has about 2 trillion and some change yet to DOUBLE it. And let us not forget that Bush had a major attack on the US that cost the US, not just NYC, billions. How many major natural disasters too? 4 back to back hurricanes in Florida, let's not forget about Katrina. Let us not also forget the near defunct economy Clinton left us.

BTW, this data is again, FREELY available. You can get it directly from the US Treasury online. It's a .gov site btw, not a .nyt site.

As to debt owed. Again, something that has always gone on throughout human history. Japan is by far the largest lender of American debt. Just think if the US were not around; the absolute squaller communist countries would live in today, eg., Korea and China. What is the point you are trying to make btw??? The US borrows money, yes... So to do other countries from the US.

Try to picture the US as a person, and other countries as other people, or as banks, or visa versa. I remember borrowing money to buy my house. I remember borrowing money to buy an investment property. I have some debt. Does that mean now that Chase and M&I now own me? Take an economics class at the local community college (collage for those of your north of the US border).

You think? Or you know? Personal bankruptcy or Corporate? Can you be a bit more specific? The truth is there are no more bankruptcies than usual according to the US figures on Bankruptcy Data. What is up, are "personal bankruptcies", but this varies by state. Some are up, some are down. Most of these bankruptcies were brought on by consumer over borrowing or over spending, ie., their own irresponsibility. What is up is the "size" of corporate bankruptcy. Not the number/frequency of them. In fact in 2002, (again according to the US figures on Bankruptcy and ABI - American Bankruptcy Institute) bankruptcies are up 5.7 percent over 2001... Hmm, let's look at what happened in 2001. Anyone? Ah, anyone? I see some hands in the back. You seem to have forgotten..... On the bankruptcy leader board it would appear that personal bankruptcy accounted for most of the 5.7 percent increase. Corporate bankruptcy was and is actually down.

In fact!!! 97.6 percent of the total 1.5 million plus cases of bankruptcy were personal! So while there was a 5.7 percent increase in bankruptcies over that period, business/corporate bankruptcies actually declined by 5.1 percent over the previous year, and continues to do so.

Please don't go screaming Enron, or Tyco, etc... These are things that occurred as the result of someone else's goof, not the current administration. The current admin is actually putting these people in jail, and has instituted new bankruptcy laws to keep others from doing the same in the future.

Now, if the "Average American" is in debt $25,000 and only makes 6 bucks an hour, I would say the average American is spending too much. Wouldn't you agree? You're so worried about the US government spending more than it takes in, while you find it perfectly fine for the "Average American" to do so? Talk about irresponsible. The truth is the "Average American" can get a job for any amount they desire. Not just 6 bucks an hour.

Anyway, I am not going to spout "Average American" DTI's. You can go look it up.

Nationally, around 100.

You really are ignorant aren't you? Truman was a plain speaker too. That's what kept him in the White House. What is talking "straight" anyway? Oh, because a few morons on the left decided to label the president as dumb because he does not talk with the Silver Spoon, wanna be, elite Kerry tongue?

These are real convincing points btw. Way to go. You're on your way man!!!

btw, I like your "straight talk" use of the word "unwinnable" below...

Whining? No. Doing something about it? Yes. I think you are confused. Our borders are "wide open" where? What do you suggest we do? Put up a wall between Canada and Mexico? Last I recall both countries were friends. I've yet to see Canadians invading the US, outside of bad signers and bad boobs. I have seen Mexicans "invading", but not to kill us. They come here seeking a better life, and are a bit more productive and appreciative of that "Average American" lifestyle.

Takes away what freedoms? Man, you have done nothing but listen to leftist propaganda and mainstream media fluff. I swear I am reading an Al Fraken comedy sketch here, or Michael Moore script. Ok, so Bush is taking Freedoms away, but still allowing us all to cross borders. That makes sense.

No offense man, but this will likely be the last time I debate you. There's nothing here. It is not even remotely engaging. At least with Gworld it is a bit entertaining.

What? That the intelligence was comical? Are you ok? It was anything but comical. The bungled Clinton era intelligence (or lack there of, he and his wife still prove that to this day) was anything but comical. It cost thousands of lives. It was deplorable.

Back to the war on drugs again eh. Looks like drugs is winning that war for you buddy. Bankrupting the country? Do tell.... Please, where? Loosing every scrap of freedom? What freedoms have you lost?

Let me say that again so you can see that I would really like to know.

WHAT FREEDOMS HAVE YOU LOST??? Once and for all, can one of you lunatics on the left actually display for me and individual freedom you have actually lost, and once you show me, please tell me how it has affected you adversely.

You said "(not a lot)" as in, we do not have a lot of freedoms left. Like? WHAT FREEDOMS HAVE YOU LOST??? Seriously?

See its ignoramus things like this that help explain more and more what your mental state is right now. Stick with it, hang in there, there is help.

"CIA selling nuke plans to 4 more rogue"

You do realize that the nuke plans that you are referring to were given to Iran by RUSSIA, not sold by the CIA? Clinton and the CIA during the CLINTON admin, knew Iran was working on a Nuclear bomb. Why is this a Bush issue? Because Risen's bunk book told you so.

Or perhaps because you read in a internet forum (http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showthread.php?t=49068) that posted a link to a site called "prisonplanet", which as we all know, is a reliable and trusted, 100% fair and balanced news source. Come on, give me a break!

Come on man, can you actually talk about something factual? Why not pose a question like, why didn't Clinton do anything about Iran and their nuclear program? Because, he did not do anything that would affect his approval numbers during his presidency, aside from shag some child in the oral office.

Have a nice weekend!

 

I'm in awe! Mia, that was truly poetry in motion!

I'm 40 years old, almost 41. I was serving my country when yo-yo was in diapers. I have hair on my ass that's older than he is. In all my years, I've never lost a freedom that I was aware of. No men in black suits parked in a lincoln continental parked outside my home. Never been arrested. No aliens have come to visit me.

I've served my country, worked for my country, worked for the man, worked for myself. I've been so poor (in between jobs where a startup failed) that I had to go to a local community shelter to get food for my family, been comfortable, been rich, been poor, lost it all, recovered.

The real joke is on yo-yo and his type. At 21, if he continues to put his faith of reality in the likes of Alex Jones and websites that have "prison" in the url, his life will be absolutely miserable. So locked up in the pimping of fear to young angry white males with low IQs, he'll miss what life is really about, always worrying about some pimped out fear that doesn't exist. Anyone that would buy into that garbage deserves to live a life of misery and always looking over their shoulder for some perceived threat.

Agree 100%! If it were not for gworld, probably wouldn't post much here at all. Gworld is entertaining! When I argue with gworld, I have a sudden desire to shout out "Hey Moe! Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk!" It's funny, and I laugh a lot

Yo yo, man, I feel for you! Young, hormones raging, bound and determined that you will make your mark on the world and that you truly have something enlightening to offer the world. I've been there. I've been through it all. I've been through the adults that tried to tell me I didn't know a thing, that I didn't have life experiences, yada yada ya. It's nothing unique. I hope some day you can break out of that shell. That some day, you'll say "hey, what ever happened to that fear Jones pimped out about xyz back in 2003 and why did nothing every come of it? And what about the other xyz fear he pimped out, what about that?" For until you do, the daily fear pimping he puts out will just run from day to day to day to day, always putting a seed in the mind, and always moving on to something new, because the previous never had any merit to begin with.

What a way to live life

 

I have respect for any soldier around the world who joined the military to "protect their country", But i hate these faggets who joined for $$$ and now they claim to be the shit "we are protecting you" etc... thats BS.

 

Here you go, discuss

 

Maybe a section for the 12 and under that get their news from cartoons?

 

The medium of the satire is not important cartoons have been major forces in public opinion for hundreds of years, it the content that matters

You guys are making appeals to authority, I am old, I have wife who kicked out a few kids, therefore I am more correct, its very weak form of argument you can read more about it here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_authority

There are all kinds of dumbass old people in the world, and there are all types of idiots who have kids. Neither is a criteria that adds any credibilty to your arguments.

 

The Outstanding Public Debt as of 07 Jan 2006 at 08:13:21 PM GMT is:
$8,213,280,732,038.01

The estimated population of the United States is 298,187,453
so each citizen's share of this debt is $27,543.97.

The National Debt has continued to increase an average of
$2.83 billion per day since September 30, 2005!



Hey I see both the Bush's in the red above, and clinton in the blue... it must be liberal propaganda! :

This is coming from wiki - so god knows it's deffinently liberal propaganda to!

President | Increase In Debt | Annual Increase | Debt % of GDP
George H. W. Bush | 46.2% | 9.9% | 65.9%
Bill Clinton | 13.7% | 1.6% | 57.7%
George W. Bush to 2004 | 26.0% | 5.9% | 64.8%
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._public_debt

So if you look right at the %'s in increased debt, bush 1 is 46% , Clinton is only 14% and Bush 2 is 26% .... somehow these numbers don't agree with you MIA. In fact - the Bush numbers are HIGHER IN EVERY CATEGORY!

No points to be made here...

U.S. Treasury statistics indicate that, at the end of 2004, foreigners held 44 percent of federal debt held by the public. [1] About 64% of that 44% was held by the central banks of other countries. A large portion was held by the central banks of Japan and China. This exposes the United States to potential financial or political risk that either bank will stop buying Treasury securities—or start selling them heavily.

I was talking about personal debt -I think this explains it well.

Families is where our nation finds hope, where wings take dream." —LaCrosse, Wis., Oct. 18, 2000

"I know how hard it is for you to put food on your family." —Greater Nashua, N.H., Jan. 27, 2000

"I hear there's rumors on the Internets that we're going to have a draft." —second presidential debate, St. Louis, Mo., Oct. 8, 2004

"You work three jobs? … Uniquely American, isn't it? I mean, that is fantastic that you're doing that." —to a divorced mother of three, Omaha, Nebraska,

"I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully." —Saginaw, Mich., Sept. 29, 2000

"Rarely is the questioned asked: Is our children learning?" —Florence, S.C., Jan. 11, 2000

"Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." —Washington, D.C., Aug. 5, 2004

If terrorists are as bad as George Bush would have us all believe, we damn well better be closing our borders. You think blowing shit up in Iraq is going to stop terrorsts from walking across the mexican border?

BTW: letting illegal mexicans come here and work for $3/hour isn't helping the middle class either

Yeh, back on it. How do you justify it? I know the war on drugs was lost from the start. In fact, right now drugs are just as (if not more) easily available to anyone who wants them than ever. I just came out of HS 4 years ago and I can tell you drugs are all over teens like old guys on porn.

What does it cost to put a single drug dealer in jail?
The cost to put a single drug dealer in jail is about $450,000, composed of the following:

The cost for arrest and conviction is about $150,000.

The cost for an additional prison bed is about $50,000 to $150,000, depending upon the jurisdiction.

It costs about $30,000 per year to house a prisoner. With an average sentence of 5 years, that adds up to another $150,000.

The same $450,000 can provide treatment or education for about 200 people. In addition, putting a person in prison produces about fifteen dollars in related welfare costs, for every dollar spent on incarceration. Every dollar spent on treatment and education saves about five dollars in related welfare costs.

Freedom of expression and protesting. People who protested PEACEFULLY in NY were sent to a concentration camp filled with asbestos and oil.

A prominent civil liberties lawyer and a Transportation Workers Union raised questions yesterday about asbestos and diesel oil contamination at Pier 57, the former bus depot at 17th St. serving since last week as the N.Y.P.D.’s holding pens for people arrested in Republican National Convention protests.

More than 1,700 people arrested this week at demonstrations aimed at the Republican National Convention, Licht gained his freedom on Thursday morning. A judge, frustrated at the city's pace in moving protesters through the criminal justice system, ordered the immediate release of nearly 500 of them.

I'm also seeing photo-radar cameras going up on every street corner and the highways - leaving with me no privacy from big brother any time i travel.

Cell phones have satellite tracking in them MANDATORY from the government.. I wonder why?

The list of freedoms being supressed day in and day out gos on and on.

Actually it was a CIA spy that defected from Russia. The CIA gave the Russian the nuke plans and told him to go deliver them to Iran officials.

 

But that's not going to stop him from trying. Maybe if he repeats it often enough...

 

It's called age and life experiences. No one suggested having kids added credibility. Perhaps you got that from a cartoon?

 

I am older (47) than you and unlike you, never used the welfare system, so what?

If some one is right, it doesn't matter if he is 60 or 6.

 

I have to admit, I didn't anticipate you wouldn't have had the foresight to see the point. The point being, one gains knowledge through many trials and tribulations in life, gaining life experiences along the way. I'm continually amazed by you, gworld!

With age comes experience. For some Perhaps you have been visited by aliens, no?

 

It is clear that your statement is wrong because you have some how avoided to gain any knowledge during your life time.

I have sympathy for your children since according to you, you will be always right, no matter what. Your children can never grow older than you, can they?

 

Not everyone has the opportunity to go to collage like you

 

what going on with the oil these days?

 

Wouldn't it be nice if we were importing all that cheap oil the liberals say we're there for? Man oh man, $.50c per gallon gas! But alas, reality sets in...

Maybe there's a supersecret NSA/CIA plot to take over world wide carrot crops. Let me check some sites with "prison" in the url

 

This is not about providing cheap oil for Americans, it is about generating profit for OIL COMPANIES.

Number of barrel of oil produced in USA: 5,000,000 /day

Price increase per barrel because of Iraq war: $45

Extra cost for oil production in USA because of war: 0

Extra profit for OIL COMPANIES / day because of Iraq war: $200,000,000

Extra profit for OIL COMPANIES/ Year just on DOMESTIC production: $ 90,000,000,000

You can also add the profit from forigen oil production on top of the above number.

Profit /loss for American people: - 300,000,000,000 in tax and over 2000 dead.

 

And all this time I though it was about getting a few extra colors in every box of fruit loops

Oil goes up, it's Bush's fault. Oil comes down, <sounds of crickets chirping>

What's up, doc?

 

I got my data from the US Treasury's website, not wikipedia... Hmmm..

My thoughts exactly.

Kinda hard to have a draft when there is no draft. Even harder when we actually have a all voluntary military service already. Don't ya think?

See the Patriot Act. Nuff said. Kinda takes care of that.

It is when they are being taxed. Besides, those in the middle class as your obvious inexperience in life have shown, do not want those jobs.

What is it with you and the war on drugs?

YAWN...

WTF are you talking about? Are you one of those teens that drugs are all over?

Blah, blah, blah, and Elivs is still alive...

Hmm, not commenting here, you have no idea what you are talking about and are shouting to the wrong person about RF based technologies. I really do not think you want to go there.

Which are???

And I'll just bet you were there.

You crack me up..

 

You live in Canada. You use the "welfare system" everyday!