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Why list building is a bigger cash sponge than you think!

Discussion in 'General Marketing' started by bamajedi, Jun 20, 2013.

  1. #1
    I have been in Internet Marketing for a while now and recently I have gotten serious in listbuilding as a means to make money online. What I have found for the most part is listbuilding can and will drain your wallet quicker than anything you have ever done. Except maybe media buys.

    1. You have to get some form of link tracking software. $37 - $197
    2. You have to buy solo ads on almost a daily basis to replace people who unsubscribe.
    3. Not only that only a small percentage of your list will actually give a dang about what
    you have to say. These will be the ones that open and click your emails about 2%
    4. It may take you a year to get to the point where you can actually use your list for income. Unless you have money!
    5. You will get ripped off it's your word against theirs.
    6. People who wont rip you off are more expensive because they wont rip you off lol
    7. You really need a lot of money to properly get into listbuilding
    8. Ad swaps cannot be done as often as you think. Your list will stop responding after all
    they see the same swipes day in day out.
    9. The only reason your list sticks with you is because they LIKE you.

    The above is shocking but true. If you have a list of 2000 or below you are really treading water and being pimped by solo ad providers until you have enough people to send to an offer and make a profit. The magic number for that is somewhere in the neighborhood of 70 clicks.
    bamajedi, Jun 20, 2013 IP
  2. Howard Lim

    Howard Lim Active Member

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    #2
    The key to list building and retaining your list is simple.
    1) Give value to your subscribers. Don't treat them like cash cows. Do not always try to sell them stuff. Communicate with them. Share things with them. Give them value and they would naturally buy the things that are useful to them. (Of course with a little friendly persuasion.)

    2) Don't keep thinking of how you can make money with a huge list and you just keep buying solo ads and selling solo ads yourself. You would over-dilute your list and make people doubt your intentions when you are in possession of their email. I'm not saying don't do solo-ads, but try not to sell your list everyday.

    3) Stop spending money on paid traffic if you do not have the means to do it. There are ways to get free traffic as well. No one is forcing you to use paid traffic.

    Key point:
    - Give value, treat your subscribers the way you would want to be treated, do not abuse their trust and email.
    Howard Lim, Jun 20, 2013 IP
  3. mkcookin

    mkcookin Greenhorn

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    #3
    The thing with list building is you do not have to invest in buying traffic to begin with. Actually I think it is wiser to get people to sign up to your list with free traffic first before you even think of spending money.

    Also you DO NOT have to have a large list in order to start making money. Many people make thousands of dollars a month from a very small list. This is because their subscribers are highly responsive.

    For this to happen you want to attract the right type of people to your list -- who are very interested in what you have to talk about.

    Also to have a responsive list you need to actually build a relationship with your subscribers. The money is not in the list itself but...

    The money is in the relationship you have with your list!

    If you treat each person on your list as a real human being - and have their best interest at heart... They will grow to know like and trust you.

    To build this trust, you want to start off by sending massive value to your list that will help them with their current problem. Soon they will grow to trust and like you for this.

    After you have gained their trust... you then want to promote a product that will benefit them even more on their problem -- in between your valuable emails.
    mkcookin, Jun 20, 2013 IP
    Gianni Palazzo likes this.
  4. Khadaji

    Khadaji Active Member

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    #4
    You can start with 'Perfect Link' plugin for your outgoing links. You can get a one site license for WP Solo Tracker for $17.

    You can cheat with free tracking solutions - but if you're serious, yes, you do need good tracking solutions.

    (Ironically, just this morning I got an email from a solo provider providing asking me how many uniques he'd sent me ... he forgot to route my solo through his tracking... and he knew, from the link I gave him, that I was tracking. So I sent him a snip of my WP Solo Tracker screen to show him... at that moment, just 58 sent. The campaign is over now, totals: 100 ordered, 127 sent, 113 Unique, 65 opt-ins... I'm happy! Without my tracking - we'd both be crying...)

    This is dependent on how you got them on your list to begin with. Many IM'ers today use very 'curiosity driven' landing pages - and so they get many people who are not specifically interested in the precise method you show them.

    If your landing page is more specific - you'll get fewer, but more interested opt-ins. I prefer to see if I can convince people...

    Actually, no different from most other online businesses... it's only in sales pages where you start earning money by next weekend.

    There's a lot to learn, a lot to do, and it simply takes time.

    That's why you use good tracking software... then you simply spread the word that so-and-so doesn't provide good service. Your reputation is EVERYTHING online. Far too many people like to look up someone before they do business with them. I know I do. I generally won't buy a solo ad from someone that doesn't have some online references...

    If it sounds too good to be true... it's probably is too good to be true...

    Only if you're unwilling to do the work. Are you spending an hour a day developing traffic? How many articles do you have posted? How many guest posts? How many videos? How many forum signatures floating around?

    And are you tracking all these traffic sources?

    Of course! Many people recommend a three to one ratio of giving to taking... of providing content vs selling or ad swaps. Your list will respond to conditioning... you condition it to see ad swaps day after day, and a month from now you can send an email offering a free $20 bill to all people who respond, and your wallet won't even get opened...

    You send post after post of good, actionable content on a topic that your list wants, and when you do send 'em a link, they'll open and click on it.

    Absolutely!

    This presumes that you believe that you can ramp up your list in a month, and be living in fat city after that... it's not quite that simple.

    List building is like any other business - you actually have to do the work. And in the case of list building (as in so much else online), most of the work is done long before you make a dime.

    Interesting post!
    Khadaji, Jun 20, 2013 IP
  5. binarymetric

    binarymetric Greenhorn

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    #5
    I have made about $3k/month from my list of only 1,000. It's the quality of the list that matters, buyers vs freebie seekers. PM if you want to know more about it.
    binarymetric, Jun 20, 2013 IP
  6. bamajedi

    bamajedi Peon

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    #6
    Thanks for the replies guys. To answer a few questions yes I have heard of Pretty Links and I have used Pretty Links Lite but I have had it to fail on me at least once either that or the person I was doing the swap with tricked me. However he was able to produce a link his QCC control panel and it showed he sent 30 - 40 more clicks than PL was showing.

    Dont get me wrong I am not bitter over what I have discovered. I think I know a truth most marketers are not willing to share and I am grateful but I just want to let the rest of the people considering this know it's not all gravey unless you can quickly get into the 2000+ subscriber range.

    Binarymetric - I am willing to bet you either have a buyers list or your list is not in the IM niche.
    bamajedi, Jun 25, 2013 IP
  7. Khadaji

    Khadaji Active Member

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    #7

    So what you're saying is that it's actually work... and that it takes time.

    And I say, of course!

    List building is no different from any other online method of earning money - in that it takes time, investment, knowledge, and work to succeed at it. It is, however, one of the more reliable ways to earn online. Particularly since it relies on far less resources than many other options.

    But if you get into list building expecting a full-time income next weekend, or even next month - you'll be sorely disappointed.

    But when you're tired of chasing each new shiny toy... keep it in the back of your mind that most online marketers utilize their list... and in many cases, it's virtually the sole source of their income.
    Khadaji, Jun 25, 2013 IP
  8. Khadaji

    Khadaji Active Member

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    #8

    I suppose it's possible... but I've never seen any discrepancies with Pretty Link... perhaps I'll try a simple test... I can run traffic through Adtrackz Gold, then into Pretty Link... and see if the numbers match. It will be interesting if it turns out that Pretty Link isn't as reliable as I've formerly thought.

    I only use Pretty Link for outgoing links though... I use Adtrackz Gold and WP Solo tracker for my incoming links.

    There's clearly a good market waiting for someone here... give me a Wordpress plugin that will allow me to mask & track incoming and outgoing links, set up campaigns, and track actions & sales... along with IP records geotargeted... perhaps I need to sit down and write out some specs and go hunting for a good programmer...

    I like to deal only with solo sellers that have a track record... that other people have commented on. I also keep records of my results, so far I've been lucky and not dealt with any dishonest sellers... I know that they're out there, I just think that they're not all that common.
    Khadaji, Jun 25, 2013 IP
  9. adgaro

    adgaro Peon

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    #9
    I use Safe Swaps and do ad swaps almost every day. My subscribers do not seem tired yet and the list is growing. :)
    adgaro, Jul 6, 2013 IP
  10. mkcookin

    mkcookin Greenhorn

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    #10
    If you do not mind me asking, may I ask how many of those buy the product you promote. Or how many clicks you get?
    mkcookin, Jul 7, 2013 IP
  11. Howard Lim

    Howard Lim Active Member

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    #11
    I buy almost all the products that i promote. Well, that's the only way whether i know it will work. You see, if you sell people something that works, they will stay with you and trust you when you sell them something else. Everything is based on trust and targeted marketing. People trust you, they will look at your product, if they need it, they will consider buying it. The key is to provide a good solution to their problems.
    Howard Lim, Jul 7, 2013 IP
  12. GAdsense

    GAdsense Active Member

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    #12
    Making email lists isn't easy at all. You need to be very smart in planning a complete email collection campaign. Because as others say, the more targeted the list is, the better the revenue.

    Some people can make good lists but they really don't know how to use it the best way.
    GAdsense, Jul 7, 2013 IP
  13. adgaro

    adgaro Peon

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    #13
    Thursday: 439 clicks, Friday: 499 (Didn't send Saturday and Sunday). Today already 9 clicks.

    I have several reliable partners in Safe Swaps. We are sending each other good relevant offers and subscribers are quite happy.

    In any case it is a good idea to send at least once a week.

    My conversion rate depends on Partners swipes.That is why I prefer partners with good reputation (it can be easily tracked)

    Bad swipes cause low clicks, a high unsubscribe rate and spam complaints against you. That's why I prefer Safe Swaps. I can contact trusted partners there. I am not advertising it, just positive experience.

    P.S. It is also very good to grow a list for someone, who is just starting by purchasing solo ads there. Good luck!
    adgaro, Jul 8, 2013 IP
  14. Gianni Palazzo

    Gianni Palazzo Member

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    #14
    Well said brother. You could not said it better than that.

    I agree with you 100%. We should treat our list with respect without abusing it as some internet marketers do.

    By the way, I wrote a massage for you in your profile.
    Gianni Palazzo, Jul 8, 2013 IP
  15. Gianni Palazzo

    Gianni Palazzo Member

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    #15

    I like to provide trust to my customers. Make them feel they are in good hands with me and not with not one else.

    When we provide that sense of trust to them, they will stick to us for longer.
    Gianni Palazzo, Jul 8, 2013 IP
  16. Howard Lim

    Howard Lim Active Member

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    #16
    i cant find it. :(
    Howard Lim, Jul 11, 2013 IP