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Which PHP framework do you like most?

Discussion in 'PHP' started by webshore88, Jul 21, 2012.

  1. deathshadow

    deathshadow Acclaimed Member

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    #41
    The real laugh being, that's what the OOCSS stupidity is... and how most every HTML/CSS framework works -- presentational classes -- which again, at that point you might as well go back to writing HTML 3.2!
    SEMrush
     
    deathshadow, Aug 2, 2012 IP
    SEMrush
  2. furqanartists

    furqanartists Active Member

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    #42
    I use CodeIgniter Framework for my PHP Applications/Websites.
     
    furqanartists, Aug 4, 2012 IP
  3. ryogi

    ryogi Peon

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    #43
    I too prefer codeigniter for small size projects. We are now looking into YII. The feature list seems to be good.
    There is a good comparison available here - phpframeworks dot com
     
    ryogi, Aug 4, 2012 IP
  4. lolpasslol

    lolpasslol Peon

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    #44
    No 2 ,Codeigniter,
    I like it most,it is easy to understand and use.
    I have done a lot work from it.
     
    lolpasslol, Aug 4, 2012 IP
  5. kalis_race

    kalis_race Peon

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    #45
    Kindly can any one tell which versions using best in php??????????????????????
     
    kalis_race, Aug 4, 2012 IP
  6. NetStar

    NetStar Notable Member

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    #46
    If a framework is needed I prefer Zend. Zend is basically a toolkit that gives you the ability and pick and choose what you'd like to use in your application. I do agree with the fact that a framework comes with bloat but a GOOD framework will not include every single file..only the dependencies needed to run your application. Using APC or another opcode cache system literally solves most slow execution problems and hardware is absolutely cheap these days.

    Not all projects require a framework. If I'm making a smaller basic web site I generally will utilize WordPress as a CRM and design a custom theme using PHP. I find this approach makes development faster and gives me a front end for on the fly creation of pages and articles.

    As for larger projects. I absolutely recommend using a Framework. Over the years I've always flopped back and fourth and every time I've opted NOT to use a Framework I found myself reinventing the wheel by creating a POOR untested framework that is similar in syntax to Zend. It makes more sense to just use Zend framework. You will cut your development time in half and you won't have to worry about the framework part of your application failing. I use to be the type of programmer that thought he was "all too mighty" to use Modules and Libraries until I learned the valuable purpose of reusable code. It's like outsourcing work... the work gets done just as effective (if not more effective) which gives you more time to focus on other problems.
     
    NetStar, Aug 5, 2012 IP
  7. webshore88

    webshore88 Active Member

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    #47
    If you have enough time to code from scratch and connecting DB on every page.... then defiantly framework is not suitable for you. Otherwise framework gives much freedom that we need often. Some framework like CI provides much frangibility than we desire as if I want to rewrite my url from example.com/home/article/today's to example.com/today's then I will write just one line of code and my work would be done. How many lines of code you need to fulfill this task?
     
    webshore88, Aug 5, 2012 IP
  8. beven

    beven Active Member

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    #48
    Zend framework
     
    beven, Aug 6, 2012 IP
  9. BRUm

    BRUm Well-Known Member

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    #49
    I plan things correctly in the first place so such a task is not needed..
    Like I said in my previous post, it seems frameworks are being used as substitutes for planning.
     
    BRUm, Aug 6, 2012 IP
  10. Eko Sulistiono

    Eko Sulistiono Active Member

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    #50
    i prefer use CI cause the code more eficient for work.
     
    Eko Sulistiono, Aug 7, 2012 IP
  11. velu4php

    velu4php Peon

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    #51
    I will go with Zend and then Yii
     
    velu4php, Aug 7, 2012 IP
  12. jkon

    jkon Member

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    #52
    My favorite framework is the one I am part of it … PWF phpwebframework.com. With that I really continue my OO programming habits (that I also have in other languages). If I hadn’t PWF then CodeIgniter would be a solution but just a solution without enjoying OOP in its natural way.
     
    jkon, Aug 7, 2012 IP
  13. Bhuvan14

    Bhuvan14 Peon

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    #53
    Codeigniter is a good framework becoz it contain good documentations and radip development
     
    Bhuvan14, Aug 8, 2012 IP
  14. deathshadow

    deathshadow Acclaimed Member

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    #54
    Hopefully that doesn't force the idiotic markup of their website on you -- what with the paragraph+strong doing H2's job, non-breaking spaces, DIV and P+classes doing PRE+CODE's job, P+classes doing UL/LI's job, non-breaking spaces alone inside P doing padding's job, whole slew of sandbag DIV for christmas only knows what, tags like CENTER which have zero business in any HTML after 1998...

    Just what WYSIWYG vomits up that trash? That, or we have another wonderful example of PHP coders who don't know enough HTML+CSS to be writing PHP in the first place.

    Though the fixed metric fonts, fixed width layout, and stupid scrollbar trickery also illustrate that whoever did that doesn't know enough about the development to be making websites in the first place either. If that website is indicative of the code underneath it, this is why I say what I do about 'frameworks'.

    Of course, modifying the php.ini just for a framework? That's not encouraging...

    Let's take a look at the code... wow, that array.php (first file in there) is some pointless idiotic bloat -- just what is the point of making a class that just wraps EXISTING FUNCTIONS -- overhead of a far call and a return for what exactly?

    If you don't know what's wrong with this: (comments removed)
    
    <?php
    class _Array
    {
    
      public static function containsValue($array,$value)
      {
        return in_array($value, $array);
      }
    
      public static function containsKey($array,$key)
      {
        return isset($array[$key]);
      }
    
      public static function size($array)
      {
        return count($array);
      }
    
      public static function joinValues($array,$glue = "")
      {
        return implode($glue, $array);
      }
    
      public static function reverse($array)
      {
        return array_reverse($array);
      }
    
      public static function removeLastElement(&$array)
      {
        array_pop($array);
      }
    
      public static function isValid($array)
      {
        return is_array($array);
      }
    
    }
    ?>
    Code (markup):
    Do the world a favor and back the **** away from the keyboard now!

    Let's see... next file:
    
    class _Exception extends Exception
    {
    
    }
    Code (markup):
    Oooh, that's useful... Whiskey tango foxtrot?

    Every single file I'm opening seems to be wrapping static functions in methods for christmas only knows what -- that is some of the most IDIOTIC asshat code I've ever seen!!! What legitimate reason is there for self::exists instead of just saying file_exists?

    I was going to say at 32k at least it's lightweight, but really from what I'm seeing it's around 24k of pointless bloat that's like driving with the parking brake on.

    Poster child for EVERYTHING wrong with frameworks... and the obsession with throwing objects at everything for no legitimate reason. Objects have a point, this isn't it.

    BTW, love that the code is so unclear you need five to eight lines of bloated comments for each and every 3 line function, so the initial parse if it's not in your bytecode cache (assuming you're running one) takes four or five times longer than need be. Remember, this is an INTERPRETED language. I'm reminded of looking at old code written by Cobol developers where they would add comments between every line just to overcharge since they were paid by the K-LoC.

    Just more proof that frameworks are written for people who don't know what they are doing, BY people who don't know what they are doing!
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2012
    deathshadow, Aug 8, 2012 IP
  15. Bhuvan14

    Bhuvan14 Peon

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    #55
    Codeigniter is nice framework for PHP developer..It is well documented and it follows MVC architecture....
    It has lot of functionality
     
    Bhuvan14, Aug 8, 2012 IP
  16. setyp

    setyp Member

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    #56
    CodeIgniter, because it is easy to write code.
     
    setyp, Aug 8, 2012 IP
  17. MagnetiCat

    MagnetiCat Active Member

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    #57
    CodeIgniter and YII are my preferred ones. CodeIgniter is super lightweight and it is just a thin layer at the base of your application that can be used to enforce also a minimum of structure to your code or the code of your co-workers. YII has many fantastic features like auto-generated admin areas and models, which can save a lot of time on developing complex applications with a lot of data management involved; it is also lightweight, and not that complex to work with once you have read a couple of docs.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2012
    MagnetiCat, Aug 8, 2012 IP
  18. BRUm

    BRUm Well-Known Member

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    #58
    Great post DeathShadow, I always appreciate educational amusement :D
     
    BRUm, Aug 8, 2012 IP
  19. jkon

    jkon Member

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    #59
    I will not respond with judgments for the words you chosen. I have no reason to start a pointless disagreement. Just some clarifications on what you wrote.

    Yes the pages main content of the site that presents PWF ( http://www.phpwebframework.com ) are generated through WYSIWYG editor , although I believe that this is the way to go with dynamic content this has nothing to do with PWF. The layout of this site chosen to be simple and focus in what PWF is, it may change on the future, but again this has nothing to do with PWF.

    I hope you know what utilities classes are, out of 27 classes that this version of PWF has, 4 of them are utilities classes as the _Array class you mentioned. More over the _Array class is the only that has only wrapper methods, and is there only to help with PHP function naming inconsistence. _Exception class is empty for now, also the classes that inherits of it, and are used to indicate the type of the exception.

    I don’t think that PWF has any obsession with throwing objects; it’s just made for object oriented programming. Also thank you for noticing that every method in PWF has comments, although I believe that I can write better comments, this is a start.

    I will keep one observation that you made, ‘Of course, modifying the php.ini just for a framework? That's not encouraging...’ . In this first tutorial of PWF (that I hope to make it also better) I explain a way without modifying php.ini. There is a third way also that we might have as default in next versions.

    Thank you for that comment; I will give a lot consideration on it. For me, when you create a framework you can’t think that you have the one and absolute truth. I am just sharing PWF , because other people may find it useful in what drove me to create it; A really lightweight PHP MVC framework for clean object oriented programming
     
    jkon, Aug 9, 2012 IP
  20. deathshadow

    deathshadow Acclaimed Member

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    #60
    Only partly explains why it's an accessibility train wreck filled with javascript for nothing... just explains the nonsensical use of paragraph tags and non-semantic markup.

    Except you don't have dynamic content... correction, you might have "dynamic content", too bad you don't have dynamic LAYOUT.

    It's just indicative of what was to come when in finished downloading.

    Yup, and 99% of the time they are pointless bloat and overhead built out of some weird noodle-doodle paranoia about namespace conflicts. No offense, but they are quite often EXACTLY what I mean by throwing objects (and their overhead) at nothing.

    "only" -- yet the majority of them HAVE them, and for no good reason... The only reason you can come up with:

    Wah, wah, I don't like how the existing functions are named... -- so your adding the overhead of more code to parse, a class structural block, a far call, extra copies of the variables and/or their pointers, AND a return and/or copy of the return values... Because you don't like PHP's naming conventions? Just sit and think on that for a moment. Might be time to consider another language.

    These aren't macros and this isn't a compiled language.

    Much like how George Carlin said "Not every ejaculation deserves a name" -- Even OOP, not everything deserves to be an object or method... and you seem to have EVERYTHING as a object or a method... even things that have NO legitimate reason to be a method. Just because objects are available, don't shoe-horn everything into them for no good reason, or make extra methods and extra code that is LITERALLY just bloat.

    Just remember PHP is an interpreted language that if the code is not in the bytecache, it has to be re-parsed... This means if you have a small bytecode cache, or don't have a bytecode cache like APC or eAccelerator installed, Every one of those comments is costing you execution time. I actually had a friends system I just went through that I was actually able to cut 15% off the CPU load across the entire system just by deleting the 20 lines of comments they started each PHP file with that was just licensing info. (though once I convinced him to install APC, CPU use was cut in half and the comments had far, far less impact).

    It literally reminds me of back in the 80's where you'd go into programs "professionally" written in COBOL or BASIC on mainframes, and be able to speed up those programs 200 to 300% or more just by deleting all the comments, that the coders typically used to double what they got paid for the job... since at the time many developers were paid by the K-LoC. (thousand lines of code).

    In an interpreted language, your best bet is to use meaningful names on your variables, functions, classes and methods, and then make a SEPARATE documentation file for each code file. 1) it gives you a base for your real documentation, 2) most people aren't going to be looking at the library code for docs, and 3) it gets all those extra characters the parser is wasting time on out of the way.

    See why even that steaming pile known as jquery has a 'stripped' distribution in addition to it's 'verbose' codebase.

    I'm also not convinced MVC in the conventional sense has ANY business being done in PHP. Sure, everyone is jumping on the bandwagon like it was a sick fad akin to "web 2.0" or platform shoes, but how PHP receives user input, processes it, then handles output is simply not conducive to the type of coding and user interface system MVC was created for.

    Kind of like objects in C++, it feels like a kludgy hack instead of a legitimate coding method designed for how the language itself works... as evidenced by most implementations calling all sorts of files for no good reason and using two or three times as much code as should be necessary to build the same thing.

    Not that I'm one to talk with my strict cop-miner-formatter method -- Traffic cop parses input, then feeds that to the appropriate data-miner, who returns the result to the cop who then calls the formatter in to generate the output -- which is very close to MVC, but is strictly linear without any of the sub-code being able to pass data directly to each-other, and instead having to go through the 'traffic cop' (index.php). Biggest problem is the overhead of large result sets being held in memory, but really if you're getting massive result sets, you're probably sending too much data to the page anyways. Keeps things completely isolated so that the data gathering code isn't allowed anywhere near the output code, and vice-versa. It also can be a bit faster, since as a rule I don't allow ANYTHING to be output until the formatter is called -- removing things like gzip's overhead and the hung-open response from being inside the data gathering loops.

    I dunno, I used to program MVC in TPW 1.5 and Delphi ten to fifteen years ago, it made SENSE there. It still makes sense in the FPC stuff I'm doing with SDL and OpenGL... but in PHP? It's a confusing, nonsensical needlessly complicated mess...

    Maybe it's like visual programming, I have this weird mental block where I just can't seem to learn it or use it... I can hand assemble my own 6502, 6809, Z80 or x86 machine language, but I can't learn visual programming.

    It does kinda feel like that same sort of block -- MVC in PHP just seems like a confusing, disorganized random mess, instead of the clear, clean concise and usable code I've gotten used to working with the past... 34 years. Wow, it would be almost 34 years to the day since I finished building my ELF.

    Maybe I've just been at this too long.

    She's supposed to have transwarp drive.
    Aye, and if my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon.
    Come, come, Mr. Scott. Young minds, fresh ideas. Be tolerant!

    Excepting of course, these aren't new ideas... they're 40 year old ideas meant for a multi-threaded and/or multi-process message queue based GUI being shoehorned into a single threaded post-response system.
     
    deathshadow, Aug 9, 2012 IP