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Which framework will be good now a days to start learning php?

Discussion in 'PHP' started by ariyes, Nov 13, 2014.

  1. #1
    Hi as the title says i want to know which framwork will be a good start for a newbie to learn the php?
    SEMrush
    regards
     
    ariyes, Nov 13, 2014 IP
    SEMrush
  2. HolyRoller

    HolyRoller Well-Known Member

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    #2
    Why not just learn PHP without a framework?
     
    HolyRoller, Nov 13, 2014 IP
    deathshadow likes this.
  3. PoPSiCLe

    PoPSiCLe Illustrious Member

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    #3
    Neither. Most frameworks, even if they claim otherwise, demand a bit of basic knowledge already.
    You should start learning plain php. Decide on something you want to make, and make that. Chose something with a database backend, so you can also learn database connections and security. Skip past mysql_, use either mysqli_ or, preferably PDO.
    the point is, frameworks usually add bloat, and most, if not all, use unsafe and plain idiotic practises.
     
    PoPSiCLe, Nov 13, 2014 IP
  4. sarahk

    sarahk iTamer Staff

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    #4
    look at the long game - why do you want to learn PHP?

    maybe you want to work as a developer
    • identify the skill set that most in demand in job ads
    • identify the skill set that the best paying jobs require
    • identify the skill set that local employers require
    Framework A might be the "best" but if there are no jobs then you are wasting your time. Framework B might be flawed but if you can get a fulltime permanent job and start bringing regular money to your family then it might be worth learning how to use.

    maybe you want to build your own sites
    • identify the requirements of your sites
    • identify the framework that best fits those requirements
    again, Framework A might be the "best" but if your sites need the "out of the box" functionality of Framework B, and if time = money, you might be best to get the job done with Framework B

    Having decided which framework (or CMS) best fits with your long term goals you'll then know which you should start to learn.
     
    sarahk, Nov 13, 2014 IP
  5. NetStar

    NetStar Notable Member

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    #5
    No Framework is ideal to LEARN PHP... However, once you learn PHP and would like to use a Framework you have tons of options... Zend, Laravel, Symphony, Cake, Phalcon, CodeIgniter Slim etc. Those are the major ones. Laravel perhaps may be the easiest with the smallest learning curve.

    One thing to consider when using a framework is if you need one or not. I've bounced back and fourth with every project. I usually always recommend core PHP however if you are trying to implement your OWN way of routing, templating, caching, models/views/controllers, etc. You are most likely better off using a framework that has already overcome those obstacles and is well tested and mature.

    There is nothing wrong with using a framework to speed up development.
     
    NetStar, Nov 13, 2014 IP
  6. PoPSiCLe

    PoPSiCLe Illustrious Member

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    #6
    There is something wrong in using a framework if you're using it without the underlying knowledge - or, rather, it CAN be wrong. Based on the fact that quite a few frameworks use old or insecure ways of accessing databases, for instance (albeit, I guess most frameworks nowadays have at least upgraded to parameterized queries and more secure ways than mysql_). It can definitely be a boost to development, no doubt about that, but then again, it usually requires one to be familiar with the framework (to be an actual boost) - if not, just doing it in plain PHP might just be quicker. Again, this is true for smaller projects. Bigger projects can benefit from frameworks, simply because it streamlines quite a bit of reinventing the wheel.
    My personal stand on frameworks is that they're more often a nuisance than a benefit, mostly because they bloat the code, they introduce extra classes and functions that you might not need in your project (but since they're part of the "core" they're impossible to remove) and they might obfuscate some of the background operations (DB-queries etc.) and often provide very little customization without heading fairly deep into the base files. Again, this differs from framework to framework, of course.
    I've heard a lot of good things about Laravel, but haven't really tried it myself. I have friends who swear by CodeIgniter (which at least have fairly decent documentation).
     
    PoPSiCLe, Nov 13, 2014 IP
  7. deathshadow

    deathshadow Acclaimed Member

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    #7
    Frameworks are mouth-breathing idiotic code bloat, the majority of them trying to shoe-horn development concepts into the language that have NOTHING to do with how the language works. EVERY time someone calls a framework -- regardless of language -- "easier" or claims it "saves time" you can pretty much assume they don't know enough about the underlying language to be opening their mouth on the subject; be it HTML, CSS, JavaScript or PHP!

    Boost to development my ass; it's just promoting ignorance and throwing more code at a non-issue... and if you take the time to learn the underlying language, you'll realize just what a bunch of idiotic halfwit mouth-breaking BULL "frameworks" are!
     
    deathshadow, Nov 14, 2014 IP
  8. NetStar

    NetStar Notable Member

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    #8
    It's personal preference. Some people are against frameworks and some people are for them. The last thing you want to do is make your decision around someones personal opinion.

    I've used Frameworks in the past and I even went through a I HATE frameworks they suck and they are just bloat phase. I have even created my own mini framework that I would use for all my projects. After going back and fourth for years on whether or not I should use one this is my final conclusion:

    Frameworks have a place and are not simply bloated crap. Just because you are downloading 20+ MB of code doesn't mean 20+ MB of code is being loaded in to YOUR project. With that said it's also important to note that there WILL be routines and classes loaded in to your project which you most likely aren't using and have nothing to do with your project. THAT is the bloated crap others speak of. Using a framework is always going to make your scripts function SLOWER than using core PHP. However, often that speed decrease is 1. NOT noticeable to a human and 2. ALWAYS fixable with caching. If you want to use PHP with a Model-View-Controller pattern and you want to have built in routing, templating, etc. you are better off using an existing framework than to start from scratch to try to recreate one. They have already overcome some of the tedious tasks and problems that you will soon encounter...like I did. As for the learning curve...some frameworks like Zend will eat up WEEKS of your time just trying to learn how to half ass use it. Other frameworks like Laravel are much easier and you can be developing with in days.
     
    NetStar, Nov 14, 2014 IP
  9. dinwal

    dinwal Active Member

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    #9
    It depends on whether you know the fundamentals of programming or not. If you know how OOPS concepts work and you know how MVC model works, then you can go for a framework. If not, you should probably start with core PHP. If you do know how those things work and have a fair understanding of general coding principles, you will find it easy to learn Laravel framework.

    There is also Symphony, but I would not suggest it unless you know OOPS and MVC concepts like a pro. CodeIgniter is also a good framework but it seems it has nobody to take care of it. The team behind it stopped updating it long time ago and while they have now nominated a new group to look after it, frameworks like Laravel are up to date with changes made to PHP and hence you will learn the most advanced stuff with Laravel.

    Hope that helps.
     
    dinwal, Nov 14, 2014 IP