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When Foriegners Die

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by david_sakh, Sep 8, 2004.

  1. #1
    It's interesting to see how Americans react to tragedy. Two notable events have occured over the past 2 years, resulting in well over 1000 deaths. First the Earthquake in Bam, Iran, and secondly the series of terrorist attacks by Chechnian seperatists in Russia.

    I remember after the attack on the World Trade Center, everyone was teary-eyed for months, and it was all they could talk about. It was a monumental loss of human life - an unwarrented one. But the general population of Americans don't seem to care when it happens in another country. I remember attending classes after the devastation of Bam and other guys would respond:

    "What?"

    "huh?"

    "yeah, sucks for them"

    "ha ha"

    "o. ok"

    And the same thing has happened with the Russian incident. It's not on anyone's mind. And hundreds of people - many of them children, have died. I don't hang around internet discussions often because of the rampant ignorance and number of kids and political zealots spamming up such places with their stupid ideas, but I was wondering if any of you feel the same way. (Or have I just been hanging around the wrong kind of people)

    I think we, hypersensitive as we are about things that directly affect us, should appreciate human life everywhere - not just within our own borders. :(

    What do you think?
     
    david_sakh, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  2. digitalpoint

    digitalpoint Overlord of no one Staff

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    #2
    I care... I'll be in Russia in 2 weeks.
     
    digitalpoint, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  3. david_sakh

    david_sakh Peon

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    #3
    Business trip eh? I would advise you stay away from Moscow. God forbid a nuclear bomb goes off there in a few weeks. :eek:

    But i'm serious. Indifference for the loss of human life can lead to some big mistakes - it has in the past.
     
    david_sakh, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  4. digitalpoint

    digitalpoint Overlord of no one Staff

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    #4
    Vacation... to Moscow. :)
     
    digitalpoint, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  5. david_sakh

    david_sakh Peon

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    #5
    ;) You're 'the master of the universe'. Just banish your assailiants to hell or something.

    I just hope we all aren't going to take this lightly. I remember bringing up the same kind of issue in public forum before, only to find the same kind of ideas I found in the classroom.

    And that's just scary. :(
     
    david_sakh, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  6. digitalpoint

    digitalpoint Overlord of no one Staff

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    #6
    I wasn't kidding, I really am going to Moscow for vacation in 2 weeks.
     
    digitalpoint, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  7. david_sakh

    david_sakh Peon

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    #7
    well be careful, all i can say. As stable as America is it's easy to forget just how chaotic some regions of the world are - even in classicly 'civilized' states.
     
    david_sakh, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  8. flawebworks

    flawebworks Tech Services

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    #8
    This is because something like this has never happened here before. Nobody ever believed it could.
    I don't believe this is true. Many many americans respond to disasters in other countries; we're usually the first.

    You don't specify how old you are, but I assume college age. I'm not trying to turn this into an age fight; but I remember back when I was "that" age, and personally I could give 2 cents about what happened outside the reach of the length of my arm. Nothing mattered to me but what was going on in my life; my friends and where I was going to get my next drink and line from. Couldn't care less what happened beyond that.

    Middle east? Oh; you mean Middle east Florida :O

    As far as the russian school incident; everyone I talk to talks about it. It's a scary issue: the way Putin is talking is scaring me to death.
    We should be extremely sensitive about what happens within our own borders. Our problem is, despite being the notoriously selfish americans that we are, is that we aren't sensitive enough, hence 9/11. I mean; check out the homeless in any city. We should clean our own house before cleaning others. This isn't to say we shouldn't be concerned with others; we should.
     
    flawebworks, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  9. arestia

    arestia Peon

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    #9
    yeah it also seems to me that us news broadcasts value american lives more than others in the world.

    -Dan
     
    arestia, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  10. david_sakh

    david_sakh Peon

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    #10
    "yeah it also seems to me that us news broadcasts value american lives more than others in the world."

    that may be the primary source of the influence..but whatta ya gonna do?

    history is cyclic for a reason, methinks.

    "Middle east? Oh; you mean Middle east Florida :O"

    my father is an Arabian my mother is an American. I was born in America, and have tired to keep an open mind on Western and Eastern ideas all my life. I think that's why some aspects of the American mindset are so apperant to me.
     
    david_sakh, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  11. GuyFromChicago

    GuyFromChicago Permanent Peon

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    #11
    I've seen the "Americans don't care" discussions before. I think one of the best answers I ever saw to that comment was this:

    I was sent this in an e-mail shortly after 9/11, and have kept it ever since. I don't know if was really ever in a Canadian paper or not, that's not really the point. The point is that despite our shortcomings as a country, America is the most generous and helpful nation in the world. We have our flaws, but our strengths outweigh those flaws 10 fold.

    To say we "don't value human life" or "don't care" is to speak without analyzing everything the United States has done for the world since this great country was formed. We've made out mistakes - as a country we've probably done some "bad" things, no doubt about it. But overall, America has done more good for the world than it has bad. We've demonstrated how much we care tens of thousands of times.
     
    GuyFromChicago, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  12. Dominic

    Dominic Well-Known Member

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    #12
    I don't think we can really comprehend 1000+ people dieing, it's something people even shy away from comprehending because it is so horrible. But when it happens in your own country - you have to pay more attention to it and the media go to town on it for as long as the story will last.
     
    Dominic, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  13. david_sakh

    david_sakh Peon

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    #13
    "But overall, America has done more good for the world than it has bad."

    How can you know this? The number of people America has killed is much greater than the number it has saved - but that is not the issue. And the issue isn't even "was mankind better off without us?" (It probably wasn't better off without us - but who knows)

    I'm not talking about American policy. I'm talking about American sentiments. What a government does and what a people think can be very different things - even in a 'democratic' society.
     
    david_sakh, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  14. GuyFromChicago

    GuyFromChicago Permanent Peon

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    #14
    Are you kidding me? You can't possibly think for a second that is true. If you do, study up on the facts and report back ;)
     
    GuyFromChicago, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  15. david_sakh

    david_sakh Peon

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    #15
    "Are you kidding me? You can't possibly think for a second that is true."

    Hiroshima + Nagasaki + conquest of the 1880s and 1890s + Firebombing of Japan + Supporting warlords & genocide in south america + vietnam villages burned and artilleryed to rubble+native americans slaughtered in conquest

    ...this list goes on

    but again, that's not the point. Every major nation state has slaughtered civilians. It's not like we're doing anything out of the ordinary.

    I'm not trying ot sound like a bad guy but as an american YOU should understand the facts. That is what I have strived to do my entire life.
    You can't live with propaganda and illusions and truly make a difference.

    But America has done numerous selfless things which I am very proud of:

    *Expended tons of resources to save Earth from Soviet Domination
    *Saved much of western civilization during WWII
    *provided humanitarian effort to developing countries

    I only wish that the blood of others wasn't seen as inferior or somehow not quite as human as ours. I see that attitude often. You wouldn't believe how many people I've been exposed to who have suggested that we 'turn Iraq into a parking lot'. Yeah, sure you'd kill a few militants, but exponentially more innocents and people who have a right to life like everybody else.

    and good thing the british didn't have nuclear weapons when we started our little insurgency. :rolleyes:

    Can't we just look at things without bias sometimes? That's all i ask.
     
    david_sakh, Sep 8, 2004 IP
  16. GuyFromChicago

    GuyFromChicago Permanent Peon

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    #16
    No offense, but I'm not going to debate politics here. We could spend the next year posting in this thread and I won't change your mind and you won't change mine. End benefit to anyone = 0
     
    GuyFromChicago, Sep 9, 2004 IP
  17. david_sakh

    david_sakh Peon

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    #17
    good point. But we wouldn't be where we are today without debate. It's extremely hard to turn someone around, but at least as we try to defend our arguments and debunk those of the other guy with facts, we bring more information to light. And there's nothing more precious to sucess than information. :)
     
    david_sakh, Sep 9, 2004 IP
  18. stephfoster

    stephfoster Well-Known Member

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    #18
    I feel for the families of the Russians killed, believe me. I was in tears when I saw how that one ended. OK, so I'm 3 months pregnant and lots of things set me off, but I don't think it made that much of a difference.

    My sister went to the Soviet Union when she graduated high school, very shortly before it collapsed. She's love to go back and see the changes, so Shawn, she'd probably envy you. When she was there, everyone could tell they were Americans because they smiled. First word she learned there (she studied Russian before the trip, so had some vocabulary to work with) was ice cream. She learned a lot by traveling out of the US, and I think a lot of us could benefit from travel.
     
    stephfoster, Sep 9, 2004 IP
  19. david_sakh

    david_sakh Peon

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    #19
    "She's love to go back and see the changes"

    It might be an eye-opening experience. If I ever decide to go to Europe later in life, I will make sure to stop by in Moscow and experience a solid week there, just to get a feel for things. There's a lot of history there too...
     
    david_sakh, Sep 9, 2004 IP
  20. debunked

    debunked Prominent Member

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    #20
    My wife and I were both saddened by the recent dissaster that happened in Russia. We do feel for the loss of life no matter what part of the world, what color, or whatever??!! Life is life!

    I do however, don't mind that America is in Iraq or any other country that we are fighting somebody who would be coming to kill innocent people. (no one is innocent, but you know what I mean.)
     
    debunked, Sep 9, 2004 IP