What do I need to expand my online shop to US?

Discussion in 'Legal Issues' started by VINC, Feb 6, 2011.

  1. #1
    I am non US and I want to offer my items to US citizens as well. Do I need something in US or is it ok to pay taxes just in my country? Thanks
     
    VINC, Feb 6, 2011 IP
  2. AstarothSolutions

    AstarothSolutions Peon

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    #2
    You don't say which country your in but in general you can sell your goods into the USA from your home country (assuming they aren't illegal or restricted from your country) without any issues.

    When you post them you will have to attach a customs declaration form to state what is in the parcel and their value. Your buyer may be charged taxes etc when the items enter the USA.

    Some companies "help" their customers by lying about the content or its value to avoid them having to pay import taxes but it is illegal to do so and you will invalidate any insurance you have (if you declare the camera your posting is only worth $10 rather than the $2000 its actually worth you can only claim $10 from the insurance if it goes missing or is damaged in transit). Other companies often offer to refund any taxes the person has to pay but it is definitely worth checking the percentages of taxes involved before coming up with this sort of price promise.
     
    AstarothSolutions, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  3. Law-Dude

    Law-Dude Active Member

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    #3
    If you do not conduct any of the business in the United States, including having U.S.-resident affiliates promoting your business, you probably will not incur any extra tax liabilities.

    There are other things you will have to comply with, though, such as certain privacy legislation that states require you to comply with if collecting information from their residents. California's Online Privacy Protection Act is an example of this.
     
    Law-Dude, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  4. AstarothSolutions

    AstarothSolutions Peon

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    #4
    Not convinced that US legislation can be enforced on, for example, a UK based company if a Californian citizen just happens to visit their website site; especially if the sites T&Cs state that the legal jurisdiction is England & Wales (to continue the example)
     
    AstarothSolutions, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  5. Law-Dude

    Law-Dude Active Member

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    #5
    England & Wales might not extradite over alleged infractions of the US legislation, though I think the seller intends to go beyond California residents "just happening" to visit the site. It looks like he's going to be specifically targeting and supplying products to US customers.

    But, even assuming that England & Wales won't extradite, if the UK person in your example violating the US law ignores a summons issued to them, they won't be able to travel to or transit through the US again without there being a risk that they have a warrant issued for their arrest.

    And, as far as any civil liability goes, someone could sue in a US court and domesticate the judgment overseas. A choice of law clause in the T&Cs wouldn't do anything to repeal the statute that the action was launched under. If that were possible, everybody would simply make a choice of law clause for a foreign jurisdiction to avoid having to deal with US privacy laws.
     
    Law-Dude, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  6. VINC

    VINC Member

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    #6
    Thanks for all your answers
     
    VINC, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  7. AstarothSolutions

    AstarothSolutions Peon

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    #7
    But as said, the USA has no jurisdiction over the site or organisation behind it and therefore couldn't call for an extradition because no crime would have been committed (unless the site owner had broken the UK Data Protection Act).

    It is the same within the UK that the laws and thus jurisdiction of Scotland are different to those of England & Wales. If a site is operated from Scotland, states its contracts etc follow Scottish jurisdiction then they could not be prosecuted for breaking the law in England (obviously the reality is that whilst the system in Scotland is fairly different from England the actual laws don't vary that much but in theory it could happen). A classic example is that in England and Wales there is a legal cap of 6 years on a retailers liability where as in Scotland it is only 5 years.

    The only time when cross jurisdiction issues come into play are for those of the resident of the different jurisdiction are trying to break their own local laws (eg buying to import something that is legal in the sellers country but illegal in the buyers country). In that case however it is the buyer that would be facing the legal ramifications and not the seller.

    If what you were saying was true you would have to know the legal system of every single country that you intend to allow to visit your site and I know very few sites (relatively speaking) that do country blocking for visitors. Certainly in the UK basic information that almost every webserver gathers is covered by the DPA and so it does apply to "visitors" and not just buyers. If UK law covers these then I am sure then at least a few more of the 190+ countries that there are in the world do too.
     
    AstarothSolutions, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  8. Law-Dude

    Law-Dude Active Member

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    #8
    Like I said, they might not extradite. The issue is that whether England wants to uphold the law or not, the US courts can issue an arrest warrant enforceable on the owner if he ever tries so much as transiting through the US.

    They can also issue a default judgment in a US court if there's a related civil action and seek to domesticate it in his home country.

    Whether UK law covers the same subject matter really doesn't affect the application of the US statute from the US point of view, under the doctrine of dual sovereignty.

    Here's an example of the FTC's position on the requirement of foreign businesses to comply with US law when collecting information from US users:

    http://www.ftc.gov/privacy/coppafaqs.shtm

    The UK courts may choose not to enforce it, but duck out on an American court's summons, and don't expect to set foot in so much as a US airport without being arrested.

    Regarding the 190+ countries that one would have to comply with: It's up to each country as to whether its laws operate outside of its borders. I don't think that most do--particularly Commonwealth ones. However, the United States often takes a different approach. They have all sorts of laws that cover actions outside of their border as long as there's some sort of an American nexus.
     
    Law-Dude, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  9. AstarothSolutions

    AstarothSolutions Peon

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    #9
    Well the American´s do have a miss guided idea that they rule the world
     
    AstarothSolutions, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  10. browntwn

    browntwn Illustrious Member

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    #10
    Really? You really think their is a serious threat of extradition or arrest?

    Sell whatever you want and comply with the law in your country. When shipping goods to the US, comply with the the laws appropriate to the goods you are shipping.

    As for all this talk of extradition and arrest warrants, while those things may actually occur it is only in the rarest of circumstances.

    In answer to the original question and subsequent posts, nobody is going to be extradited for expanding their online store to sell to the US. Nobody is going to get an arrest warrant for selling goods to US citizens. Yes, there are reporting requirements both for the seller and buyer depending on the type of goods and the value of the transaction. If you are going to be exporting yourself I would suggest working with an experienced export company to learn the necessary requirements. It's just business, people do it all the time. :)
     
    browntwn, Feb 7, 2011 IP
  11. Law-Dude

    Law-Dude Active Member

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    #11
    I don't think there's a serious threat of extradition. I do think that an arrest warrant could be issued if someone ignores a summons. That warrant is enforceable in the United States.

    I'm not talking about what's likely, but about what the law allows for. The fact that something is rare doesn't mean it can't happen. It's not likely that a prosecution will happen if the business doesn't do anything that would upset anyone (every business breaches a law at some point or another but it isn't usually prosecuted if it's not a big deal), but why not make a compliant Privacy Policy to reduce the risk?

    Speeding tickets are kind of analogous here. Go a bit over the limit and the cops probably won't care to charge, but it's still not legal, and I'd still mention it in a discussion about legal compliance when driving.
     
    Law-Dude, Feb 7, 2011 IP