What are your thoughts on Islam?

Continued from last post.... (http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showpost.php?p=5055939&postcount=320)

Difference of Authority

Quran Invites - Not Demands

Special Pleading of the Bible

Clear Parts & Difficult Parts of Bible

Bible Does Not Claim Jesus Claimed to Be Son of God

Writers of Bible - Out of Context

Quran Has Internal Evidences

Quran Has Exact Accuracy

Quran Provides Reason

Unique Word Refers to Itself in Quran

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Bible And Quran - Originally Both From Allah

Respect For Holy Books

Final comment from Yusuf Estes (former Christian minister):

 

so you are willing to accept the book that you don't know who wrote as your religion?!

 

I let someone else answer it because I don't see how you can call that a hate thread If that is what you want to call it that is your call. However I still say that is NOT a hate thread. I noticed you didn't try and dispute the facts I was presenting in that thread but instead started this crap about how it's a hate thread. Did I say I want Muslims killed or that I hate Muslims? NO. But you go ahead and insinuate things. Again, I am NOT a big fan of your religion but it does not mean I hate Muslims.

You would get my respect if you came up with some strong positive arguments and not just accuse me that I start hate threads and the like.

 

We don't want the respect of a blind follower of corruption either.

Yes you are a hater, you blame numerous lies upon the Quran in that thread, like rights of women and bombings.

You dont listen, you just change the subject. Then a few pages down the line you come back and say something stupid like 'WHERE IS THE GREAT NEW TEACHING'.

You think God makes a new religion every few centuries? I dont think so!

He gives the ORIGINAL message that got corrupted by man.

The Quran is the final revelation from God and it is thus protected, i have compared it for you very clearly with
the bible and it has never been changed or lost in 1400 years, neither are there different versions!

If you sincerely want to know the teachings read it in its entirety.

[004:171]

172.

173.

174.

175.

 

Ace: the things that you wrote in defence of the Quran and bagging the Bible at the same time do not offend me. I don't call that a hate thread or whatever. You may be a sincere Muslim and may sincerely believe in the superiority of the Quran.

Here's my point though: if I wrote a book today and showed everyone how accurate is that does not make it a special book because it's just another book.

To make it special or BETTER than other books it must contain BETTER teachings or advice, or ways that can help and influence others to the greater good. It is my honest opinion the Quran does NOT do that. Whether or not it has been changed or modified or whatever its teachings do NOT appear to me to be superior. And the fact you can't quote to me something great, something more positive than what's found in the Bible does NOT make me consider it a better book no matter how "unchanged" it may be.

I am not agreeing with what you said about the Bible or with what "appears" to be contradictions. Judas may have hanged himself and then the branch which could have stretched over cliff broke and when he landed on a rock that is how he died. I don't know. the fact there "appears" to be a contradiction should prove the Bible was not changed as you claim. If others "changed" it they would have removed the "contradictions"

Many books in the Bible tell you who the writers are: Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Paul etc. So I am not sure what your point is. Some things I have to believe. I don't know what my real name is. I can't remember when I was born but I believe what my parents tell me or what the birth certificate says. If there was a fire and I never saw the original birth certificate I would still trust my parents regarging my name.

Let me tell you MY reasons for believing the Bible. Putting aside all the opinions expressed by believers and whoever and whatever, MY reason for believing the Bible is because I just cannot conceive anyone could have made up the teachings of Jesus: "Love your neighbour as yourself." "He who is without sin, let him cast the first stone." Should we pay taxes to Caesar??? Whose image is on the coin? Give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar ... To me it's just simply amazing the teachings and wisdom of Jesus Christ. His teachings far surpass the teachings of other great man.

 

Then what's the point of believing in Mohammed if God didn't give him any new teachings? If according to your words God doesn't make a new religion every few centuries how do you explain Islam??? Isn't Islam a new religion different from the Christian one?

 

You think God makes a new religion every few centuries? I dont think so!

He gives the ORIGINAL message that got corrupted by man. The bible is clearly corrupted, God wouldn't leave man to worship from a corrupt book and judge him for it, it has many ludicrous teachings which you so blindly ignore.

I mean proven fabrications by scribes and others that suited them.

If its better, (which it most certainly isnt), you think this will be acceptable to the almighty?

---

Anyways, give me some superior and great quotes from the bible please..

 

BECAUSE GOD GAVE MUHAMMAD (pbuh)THE TRUE RELIGION ACCEPTABLE TO HIM!

You cannot just follow something people have made up or edited to suit there needs and expect God to accept it from you.

Nope....

Christian, Christianity never mentioned in the bible.

ADAM, abraham, moses, jesus etc (peace be upon them)

ALL MUSLIMS!

What does MUSLIM mean? ---- Someone who submits to the will of God!

What is a religion? ---- A way of life acceptable to God.

So the religion has always been Islam - submission of your will to the creator!

 

Don't you read my posts???

Same thread my post #22

Ingersoll a well-known atheistic writer referring to Jesus: "With Renan, I believe Christ was the one perfect man. <Do unto others what you would that they should do unto you> is the perfection of religion and morality. It is the summum bonum. It was loftier than the teachings of Socrates, Plato, Mohammed, Moses or Confucius. It superseded the commandments that Moses claimed to have gotten from God, for with Christ's <do unto others> there could be no murder, lying, covetousness, or war"

"He who is without sin, let him cast the first stone."

"But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you"

"For if you love those who love you, what reward have you? Do not even the tax collectors do the same?"

But anyway, read again what Ingersoll (a NON Christian said).

 

Wow, its amazing how you can use the words of an ATHEIST to say that considering he probably views Jesus as a mythical person.

But this is not superior, we believe in Jesus toooo and also the idea of <Do unto others what you would that they should do unto you>

Non Muslims say about Muhammad (pbuh):

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His complete biography has been authenticated and circulated amongst scholars around the world starting while he was still alive and continuing up until today. One of the first examples we quote from is from the Encyclopedia Britannica, as it confirms:

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Another impressive tribute to Muhammad, peace be upon him is in the very well written work of Michael H. Hart, "The 100: A Ranking of the Most Influential Persons in History." He states that the most influential person in all history was Muhammad, peace be upon him, with Jesus second. Examine his actual words:

[Michael H. Hart, THE 100: A RANKING OF THE MOST INFLUENTIAL PERSONS IN HISTORY, New York: Hart Publishing Company, Inc., 1978, page. 33.]

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According to the Quran, Prophet Muhammad was the most excellent example for all of humanity. Even non-Muslim historians recognize him to be one of the most successful personalities in history. Read what the Reverend R. Bosworth-Smith wrote in "Mohammed & Mohammedanism" in 1946:

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While we are reviewing statements from famous non-Muslims about Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, consider this:

[Lamartine, HISTOIRE DE LA TURQUIE, Paris, 1854, Vol. II, pp. 276-277.]

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And then we read what George Bernard Shaw, a famous writer and non-Muslim says:

[The Genuine Islam, Singapore, Vol. 1, No. 8, 1936]

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Then we found that K. S. Ramakrishna Rao, an Indian (Hindu) professor of Philosophy, in his booklet "Muhammad the Prophet of Islam" calls him the "perfect model for human life." Professor Ramakrishna Rao explains his point by saying:

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What should we think about our prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, when someone with the worldly status such as Mahatma Gandhi, speaking on the character of Muhammad, peace be upon him, says in 'Young India':

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English author Thomas Carlyle in his 'Heroes and Hero Worship', was simply amazed:

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And Diwan Chand Sharma wrote in "The Prophets of the East":

[D.C. Sharma, The Prophets of the East, Calcutta, 1935, pp. 12]

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Muhammad, peace be upon him, was nothing more or less than a human being, but he was a man with a noble mission, which was to unite humanity on the worship of ONE and ONLY ONE GOD and to teach them the way to honest and upright living based on the commands of God. He always described himself as, 'A Servant and Messenger of God' and so indeed every action of his proclaimed to be.

Speaking on the aspect of equality before God in Islam, the famous poetess of India, Sarojini Naidu says:

[S. Naidu, Ideals of Islam, vide Speeches & Writings, Madras, 1918, p. 169]

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In the words of Professor Hurgronje:

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Edward Gibbon and Simon Ockley, on the profession of ISLAM, writes in "History of the Saracen Empires":

[History of the Saracen Empires, London, 1870, p. 54]

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EWolfgang Goethe, perhaps the greatest European poet ever, wrote about Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him. He said:

[Noten und Abhandlungen zum Weststlichen Dvan, WA I, 7, 32]


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.....Back to proteindude:

Fabrication
didnt exist till like the 12th century or something lol

Bart D. Ehrman http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_D._Ehrman

http://www.veoh.com/videos/v1401540kmr5NmWT

Who knows if he said it... if you believe it tell me you love Bin laden, this countries enemy

Erm dont know whats good about that also who knows if he said it.

 

That's a lot of copy and paste.

All these points above are great. HOWEVER, you have still failed to demonstrate what great teachings Mohammed brought using his own (Mohammed's) words.

Remember what happened when the Pope quoted someone else who asked "What new teachings did Mohammed bring other than..." Remember what happened?

So please for the 100th time PLEASE quote Mohammed's great words of wisdom to me. Not what others are saying about him, but how his teachings (must quote some) are so great.

 

The pope = rofl.

Firstly the Quran is not like the bible, unlike christians, in islam we have stories, sayings and teachings of Muhammad(p) separate (hadith),

The Quran has no teachings from Muhammad (pbuh), it is all God speaking/dictating!

Again i invite you to read the Quran.

All of Gods words are great to me, everytime i post them tho, you reply about a different topic and then a few pages down the line ask for some quotes again.

(13:25)

(28:77)

(90:17-18)

(7:199)

(41:34)

(5:32)

 

Phew...You finally gave me some positive quotes from the Quran. Why couldn't you do that from the beginning instead of trying to bag the Bible? Maybe that is your preconditioned response.

Anyway, I don't mind the last quote. Interesting and positive in a way. I will ponder on it but I am off to sleep now.

 

Your own words sure prove otherwise. Maybe you hate them and you don't even know it, your posts are filled with hate and intolerance.

Not accusing you of anything, you are more than proving it by your own words.

Try looking up, I quoted several posts from just the first few pages. You however like always disreguard anything and everything, as it's not in your agenda. Your agenda is clear, to bash anything and anyone that does not hold your beliefs.

Your anti atheist thread... You claim you don't hate, yet your words prove otherwise.

It was more than once you were proven wrong, that was just an example. You have left a lasting trail of incorrect statements, hate filled messages, intolerance and that's about it. Where is the love that religion should bring, you appear to be devoid of it.

Yes read his posts, they speak for themselves. They IMHO are far worse than what I even have stated in here. Read his threads in the P&R forums

As to your bolded part

 

LOL GRIM, I'm not kidding you. I am shaking with laughter as I am typing this lol I don't know why I find your response so funny but it really made my day hahaha.

I haven't had a good laugh like this in a while.

 

Oh such logic, should we expect anything less from such a good 'cough' christian.

 

Americans are permanently under attack (their culture, their army, their government, their women..............................) and they don't claim that hate/intolerance/discrimination is the cause.

I find this argument not being one. There is a theory that says when you start using it, you have lost the debate.

Note: not being one in a civilized debate. It could be in an exchange of offensive/abusive words between two parties. Using abusive/offensive language is also losing the debate.

 

Have you read his posts? His threads?
They are nothing but hate, as far as losing a debate against proteindude you've gotta be seriously tripping on acid or something. He couldn't debate a monkey.

Our woman are under attack? Really?
People in the US do not use 'hate' as a reason? Do you even know what you're talking about?

---
To quote even our president.
'They hate us for our freedom'

It's one thing to bring up hate or intolerance if it's not backed up, it however is more than backed up in proteindudes own words.

 

GRIM, there is nothing you can say today that's gonna wreck my mood. Your reply to the holding hands thing really made my day. I am not laughing anymore because the moment has passed but I still have a big wide GRIN (thanks to GRIM) on my face.

 

My reply because it was not even worthy of a reply..

I love how you didn't even bother to respond to the fact you were proven to be incorrect yet again. I did post with quotes, a fact you never appear to acknowledge.