US Blame Their Failure In Afghanistan On Pakistani ISI

I can't disagree. People are pretty much set in their ways once they hit age 25. Real change doesn't happen until enough of the folks with old way of thinking die that they become a minority. I used to drink with this German in Central America who, every time he got drunk, would start talking up the glory of Nazi Germany. Given a little latitude, he would digress into a racist rant about Jews and Blacks. Bombing a population into oblivion clearly doesn't do a lot to change deep seated beliefs and opinions.

Nah, its great. New opinions are always welcome, especially if they are informed. Most people generally try and package their thoughts into a single post, rather than making 2 or 3 sequentially.

 

It will be futile as the Taliban will easily take power and allow terrorists to come back to Afghanistan in order to plot terror attacks on US soil. US will find itself back on square 1.

 

I think its more complex then that.

We most remember that the CIA were more then happy to welcome Bin Laden, especially his money, into Afghanistan to fund the mujahedin to fight the russians.

This is not to say that the US created him but it most accept its role in his development.

I do however believe that withdrawal is not the proper course of action. In this day and age you cannot have a lawless country.

I also believe you cannot defeat an idea and when this idea manifests itself in an armed militia then you are immediately on the back foot.

Credit were credit is due, Afghanistani/taliban/insurgents or whatever you wanna call them they sure as hell can fight.

 

There's no other option than a withdrawal, the war is not sustainable. Defeat must be accepted.

They sure can, the coalition forces are mere soldiers, the Afghans are warriors.

 

They have no alternative. When they have nothing to lose, its very difficult to take anything away but their lives.

Somalia already is. Yemen. Libya. If the US stops funding the military in Egypt, then you can add Egypt to that list.

Unless you see a strong economic (Jobs) recovery in the US, you are going to see support disappear for funding the Egyptian military, nation building in Afghanistan, and all the rest of the billions of dollars we send overseas to promote stability. When that money goes, the Egyptian military will feed on it's own people. Pretty much all of those places could easily devolve into civil wars where they will butcher millions of their own people, and despots rise to power.

Embrace the horror.

 

Israel should be worried about the Arab Spring moreso then the Iranians.

I doubt that Egypt will descend in civil war. In comparison to its neighbours its a relatively developed country and its tourism industry is huge.
They also have many of the institutions in place for a transistion to a almost democratic country. But the recent victory in the elections of the Muslim Brotherhood will obviously
undermine such a transition.

Libya on the other hand has no such institutions. Every political decision came from Gaddafi. Libyans have never experienced the machinations of law or free markets.
They do however have oil and lots of it. So i doubt the international community will allow it to descend into chaos.
Also note Libya isnt an overtly Islamic country. If anything its more tribal. So the possibility for break away smaller states is possible.

And yes i forgot about Somalia. That place is a lawless shithole.

 

Tourism is going to suffer when you start making hostages of tourists and preventing employees of US ngos from leaving the country. Let me ask you this. We give 1.3 Billion dollars a year to fund the Egyptian military. Without that money, how are those troops going to feed themselves? The answer is, they will turn into a mafia like organization that shakes down their own impoverished people. When that doesn't pan out, perhaps they will try and attack one of their neighbors (Israel). That ought to thin out their population a bit.

Yah, 30% of the population now controls 80% of the government. It just so happens to be the 30% that doesn't much believe in democratic values.

 

corruption is nothing new in the majority of these one party state Arabic countries.
The grunt on the street is poorly paid and his training is non existent. They take bribes and cut corners all the time regardless of the despot in power.

Its difficult to know how it will pan out in Egypt but the Muslim Brotherhood are now the major players.

Syria on the other hand definitely has the capacity to descend into civil war if it hasn't already. The Iranians are and have been funding/helping the Syrian regime. Which in turn tried to control the Lebanon.
The Israelis would do well to monitor Syria rather then the situation in Egypt.

 

May you one day get the opportunity to experience horror first hand in your neighbourhood rather than on a TV screen, so you can truly be physically involved yourself and experience the joy of flying body parts of children, limbless screaming women and armoured men firing big guns destroying the building you live in. No electricity, no food, no water. May you revel in the litres of blood on the floor. Have a good day.

 

My oh my. There is that compassionate liberalism I'm so familiar with. Listening to this type of banter serves as a constant reminder as to why Democrats are so unpopular in the Governor's and President's mansion.

 

Just wishing upon you what you wish upon the people of other countries. What's a Democrat

 

Actually this is true. Taliban asked for evidence in order to handover OBL on several occasions even after the bombings starts in month of October. They want evidence in order to gave up OBL. US never provided that.

Here is part of the statement given by Taliban Ambassador on September 14, 2001
source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/sep/14/september11.usa29

http://edition.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/central/09/14/afghan.denial/

CNN on September 18 2001
source http://archives.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/central/09/18/afghan.taliban/

Bush's response on October 22 2001
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=582916

http://articles.latimes.com/2001/sep/22/news/mn-48537

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jv5AKw6gwXg

 

Are you guys saying that Obama + Pakistan ISI are the strongest force, and UN + USA + Allies fail to battle them........and they call themselves superpower ..lolz

If US is blaming Pakistan for all this, mean Pakistan is more powerful then USA....Is it a FACT ???

 

I don't care about no statement or no liars from the Taliban. They would NOT have given up OBL no matter what. If you believe they would you are crazy and naive.

 

US only complains about Pakistan, but doesn't take any actions against it, this shows that Pakistan is feared. Is Pakistan more powerful? Of-course not.

 

yeah. right

plain wikipedia. I guess few years later US changed USSR there and failed too.

Israel supporting Afghan Mujahideens, now thats something to be remembered

 

I think Israeli's support was minimal and not needed. As soon as the Mujahideen finished with the Soviets they set their eyes on Israel.

 

or maybe not:

Im glad soviets withdrawn from there, I dont know what did they forget there in the first place.

 

Charlie Wilson, an American congressmen who befriended Pakistan's General Zia ul Haq in the 1980s, claims that the Pakistani army worked with Mr Wilson and the CIA to scoop up tons of weapons from Israel (captured from the PLO in Lebanon) and channelled them to the mujahideen in Afghanistan. “Just don't put any stars of David on the boxes,” General Zia is reported to have remarked to Mr Wilson.

 

You are the one who is naive and the US govt. who think you can fight with afghans with advance weaponry and win. They fought with USSR for three years with the darra made weapons and 303 riffles before any foreign aid. You don't know the area/people. With reason they are your best friends, threaten them and you will have a hard time finding worst enemies than them. People in Afghanistan die for their guests. Taliban asked for solid proof not just a statement that "we know he is the one". Taliban didn't want another war on them they just had some sort of peace after 20+ years. All they want a proof which they can show to their people. Handing OBL over without any evidence would have destroy their credibility in general population.

I think US govt. know exactly what response they will get from Afghans for the statement "Hand him over we know he did it. We will not provide any evidence for it." Warmongers wanted a war not a extradition.