Trusted Traveler Pilot Program

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by Rebecca, Sep 3, 2011.

  1. #1
    In October, the TSA will begin a new pilot program for "trusted travelers." If you're a trusted traveler, you will get to bypass a lot of the security screening. To be one, you have to provide the government with more information. The article says what information, has not been disclosed yet. Personally, I just think flying seems like such a mess anymore. What do you think of the pilot program?
     
    Rebecca, Sep 3, 2011 IP
  2. ApocalypseXL

    ApocalypseXL Notable Member

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    #2
    Vulnerable and hard to implement , as soon as it's put in a terrorist organization can triple it's effort to recruit people accepted in that program or increase it's efforts to infiltrate the program . Unless they'll let in only screened old people (65+) i doubt that it will be a safe program .
     
    ApocalypseXL, Sep 3, 2011 IP
  3. eric8476

    eric8476 Active Member

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    #3
    bad idea, there is a possiblity of vunerability. tsa needs more advanced screening technology to speed up the boarding process.
     
    eric8476, Sep 3, 2011 IP
  4. The Webby

    The Webby Peon

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    #4
    You know, it's a kind of catch 22.

    If you go too easy, you get a 9/11
    If you go too hard, people start to complain.

    I have been to US 4 times now, spent a good time in Europe past 9/11. And I'm a typical brown guy like Kal Penn.
    Out of 20 or so times I've flown back and forth in US and Europe, I'd been frisked 3 times, all in the US. I was really surprised when they didn't bother to frisk me that one time. Do I feel offended? No I don't.

    How will you know that a guy is not a terrorist or a potential hijacker? I don't think the trusted traveler program is a good idea. It can be bypassed or compromised. And when it does, it will put 100s of lives in danger.

    I also feel it will be targeted/accused as a tool for racial profiling..
     
    The Webby, Sep 3, 2011 IP
  5. Spoiltdiva

    Spoiltdiva Acclaimed Member

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    #5
    I do more flying than anyone I know.I'm up in the air at least once a month owing to the type of work I do.Flying used to be an enjoyable experience.Now it's security,security,security.I understand the reasons why but the long lineups and the overzealous poorly trained security personnel are a bit much.This idea you are writing about could help speed things up so am all for it.The've simply got to try something as the present system is just too inconvenient and slow.
     
    Spoiltdiva, Sep 3, 2011 IP
  6. Obamanation

    Obamanation Well-Known Member

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    #6
    Israel has been flying terrorist free for decades at a fraction of the cost. Its called human intelligence and profiling. Know your passengers. Shin Bet, their security organization, actually has undercover officers in foreign airports quietly gathering additional information about "questionable" passengers. Caused a lot of hoopla in South Africa, but again, it gets the job done without groping every single one of your passengers.

    The real answer is to fly private. No lines, no groping, no x-rays, departure schedule set at your whim, and you can fly with a loaded weapon. If you can fill the jet, it isn't that much more expensive either.
     
    Obamanation, Sep 3, 2011 IP
  7. ApocalypseXL

    ApocalypseXL Notable Member

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    #7
    @Obamanation and given the costs and comfort of a small plane it is a viable option even for small business owners .
     
    ApocalypseXL, Sep 3, 2011 IP
  8. Rebecca

    Rebecca Prominent Member

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    #8
    With the nude scanners and groping, they are random, without probable cause, and I cannot understand how they can say that it's not a direct violation of our Fourth Amendment rights. "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." To me, it's saying permission will not be granted for a search unless there is probable cause (evidence the individual is doing something against the law).

    Now, with the Trusted Traveler program, it seems invasive in it's own way. It sounds like you have to give up a lot of your personal privacy, just so you can fly to Florida and visit Grandma. And, I agree ApocalypseXL and The Webby, how's it even going to work anyway? It's crazy. And, why just airports? Do they think terrorists attacks will only happen on planes? Why not install nude scanners at shopping malls? Grope everyone while they're going into sporting events? Make ID cards for all Americans labeling them as "Trusted" "not-so Trusted" "Danger to Society" - we can all present these cards, so we can work, and go in office buildings. After all, there are a lot of people there. I don't know. I realize they have to do something, but it just seems like our civil liberties are being trampled on in the process. O, I like your idea about the private jet, but it's probably not practical for me. My strategy is just to never fly again. :)
     
    Rebecca, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  9. Obamanation

    Obamanation Well-Known Member

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    #9
    I used to fly at least twice a week. I'm down to once a quarter and even at that, I loathe it. Easy to understand how this guy got a lot of sympathy.
     
    Obamanation, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  10. The Webby

    The Webby Peon

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    #10
    How about a microchip implant? It will be cheaper and easier.. :)
     
    The Webby, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  11. ApocalypseXL

    ApocalypseXL Notable Member

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    #11
    The US lack a unified unforgeable ID card and for some reason they oppose it en-mass . Personally I'd start with that when it comes to securing a country .
     
    ApocalypseXL, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  12. Rebecca

    Rebecca Prominent Member

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    #12
    Ha Ha - I remember that story. There was a survey where 25% of Americans said he was justified (which kind of insinuates they would have done the same). lol. Anyway, I'm glad you don't have to fly so much.

    I know, right? Personally I feel that the microchip implant may not be enough. We should all undergo retinal scans, body cavity searches, fingerprinting, and intensive interrogations every time we stop at the grocery store for a gallon of milk. It's a small price to pay for our safety, and of course, prevents us from being violated. :) J/K


    I'm one of those "en-mass." :) But, anyway, is there such a thing as a "unforgeable ID card?"
     
    Rebecca, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  13. ApocalypseXL

    ApocalypseXL Notable Member

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    #13
    Yes it almost is ; right now the only way to identify someone is by their SSN and even that once is easily nicked . A bullet resistant system that would link a Federal ID with a SSN would provide rapid identification and fraud prevention .

    To show how vulnerable your system is let me say this . I have @100 valid SSNs in my possession . In less then 5 days I could obtain a minimum of 200.000 USD by fraud and only loose 40.000 laundering them . This alone is terrifying .
     
    ApocalypseXL, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  14. The Webby

    The Webby Peon

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    #14
    You are just kidding, while I'm concerned..

    *attempts to keep a straight and serious face*
    You know, as they say you can build a bomb using regular household items, I believe a trip to grocery store is a grave concern as far as the issue of national security goes.

    Not sure about "unforgeable" (whatever that means), but a real time DNA scan against the national database will be pretty much forgery proof. Just a saliva swab and you're identified. Easy, huh?
     
    The Webby, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  15. Rebecca

    Rebecca Prominent Member

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    #15
    unforgeable

    1. Unable to be forged

    Examples:

    “New ID cards are supposed to be 'unforgeable' - but it took our expert 12 ...”
    “b biometrics are 'unforgeable' - which is demonstrably untrue.”

    Source: Wordnik


    We don't maintain a DNA database with all of our citizens. It's large, but mainly geared towards law enforcement. When individuals are convicted of a crime, and now arrested, they are subject to DNA sampling in many states. It would be a clear violation of our Fourth Amendment rights if DNA sampling was compulsory without probable cause. There have been few exceptions, as with testing in the military, but mandatory DNA testing for national ID cards would be highly unconstitutional.


    I had my Social Security card stolen. I actually put an alert on my credit. If anyone tried to apply for credit with it, they had to call my verified phone number to confirm. It worked. There are probably lots of ways credit card companies could improve security, without any need for us to get National ID's.
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2011
    Rebecca, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  16. The Webby

    The Webby Peon

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    #16
    Weird, I could have sworn that It wasn't a real English word when I was in school.

    I know, I know, I know...
    But so would be the microchip implant :)
     
    The Webby, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  17. Rebecca

    Rebecca Prominent Member

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    #17
    I know, I know, I know...I don't support the microchip implant either. I won't even get one for my dog. :)
     
    Rebecca, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  18. ApocalypseXL

    ApocalypseXL Notable Member

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    #18
    @Rebecca yes there are ways to protect the SSN but it's something people don't even care about AFAIK , sorry yo hear you had your SSN stolen .

    The way a national id card would work is by having several unique numbers and a photo of the users plus security elements , even if it's forged you can't fake every detail on it and pass even a simple check , for security purposes it would be invaluable .
     
    ApocalypseXL, Sep 4, 2011 IP
  19. Rebecca

    Rebecca Prominent Member

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    #19
    Thanks, Apocalypse. The way it works here - If your Social Security card is stolen, or if you are the victim of identity theft, you can contact Equifax, Experian or TransUnion, and they will report to the other two agencies. They put a "fraud alert" on your credit. It's free. The result is that if anyone tries to apply for credit under your name, it will not be granted until they speak to you at your verified number. It's a fantastic service, but I don't think they offer it unless you're the victim of crime. Even then, it's for a limited time. Credit agencies do offer credit watch services, but I haven't seen anything as nice as the fraud alert. With the commercial credit watch services, you have to wait for your credit report, and fight indiscrepancies after the fact. What if this service was offered for a fee? I would buy it. How about a $7.50 fee each time, for calling me if anyone applies for credit in my name? I don't apply for credit much, it wouldn't be that expensive. For example, they could set up a call center, and pay agents 12 an hour, they could easily make 6 calls an hour (or more). It would produce additional jobs, and would be an optional service consumers could sign up for. I think that would be just as effective as a National ID (as far as identity theft). Besides, it could be completely voluntary, and tax payers unconcerned with the possibility of credit theft wouldn't have to pay the bill. It would also be less likely to infringe upon our civil liberties, and wouldn't involve taking any bodily fluid samples. :) That is just one example, but there are probably many other ways to keep our credit secure without resorting to a National ID.
     
    Rebecca, Sep 5, 2011 IP
  20. The Webby

    The Webby Peon

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    #20
    What's more important? Freedom or security?


    *Runs away before Rebecca hurls stuffs at him*
     
    The Webby, Sep 5, 2011 IP