Top keyword killing?

Discussion in 'Keywords' started by Sohan, Jul 31, 2006.

  1. #1
    When people like AdSense gold release the key words, I think they are killing them.

    100s of people go makes sites to use that keyword, and the advertisers are starting to lower there prices.

    My cousin made an asbestos site, and from each click he's only got $1! If you look at the prices there around $50!

    I mean whos true passion is asbestos? Who enjoys asbestos?

    I think these keywords lists are killing the market.
     
    Sohan, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  2. timw

    timw Peon

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    #2
    You can't hide things like this forever...
     
    timw, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  3. un_known

    un_known Peon

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    #3
    ya they are but ppl wanna earn money like mad too
     
    un_known, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  4. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #4
    No one is getting anything close to $50 for a click. A lot of those adsense click lists have outdated information or use the maximum bid for the number #1 position. The Google tool estimates that you could get in the #1 to #3 position for $2.59 to $3.89 a click so the payout, even if that ad was shown and wasn't smart priced, you would get about 75% of that. You can get the #1 position on Yahoo for "asbestos" for $2.53. The high value click advertisers rarely use the content network because of click fraud - or set a much lower bid, so adsense sites will never get those high paying ads delievered (they only will be shown on google search).

    Unless your site is considered a well-converting authority site by google, you will also be Smart Priced and get far less per click.

    $1 a click is in the high range for adsense. Many people would be happy with a 25 cents per click average.
     
    mjewel, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  5. YokoOno

    YokoOno Guest

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    #5
    Not only top bids don't mean anything for AdSense (a lot of advertisers choose to turn content ads off), people who sell these keyword lists don't know how Google works. Google doesn't display ads that bid highest. Google displays ads that makes most money for them. For example, an 5 cent ad with 5% ctr will show on top of 15 cent ad with 1% CTR (the same keyword). It means that google may very well choose to display 5 cent ad on your site, rather than 15 cent ad.
     
    YokoOno, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  6. stojan

    stojan Guest

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    #6
    Here are some of the current good ones:

    car insurance $ 42 - $ 53
    debt consolidation $ 25 - $ 31
    home equity loan $ 28 - $ 37
    mortgage refinance $ 27 - $ 36

    These are estimated CPC by this
    for advertisers to be on the top 1-3 position for the terms.

    stojan
     
    stojan, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  7. Sohan

    Sohan Peon

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    #7
    It can't be 25cents on average. I have the keyword proxy on my ads, and I get roughly 7 cents, and on good days $2 a click! Now we get 60% so that means the advertiser is paying more than $4!
     
    Sohan, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  8. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #8
    Those are high paying keywords, but again, you won't get those ads on the content network. Google includes their search network in those estimates - and those ads only show on google search/search network, not adsense sites.

    There is no tool that shows bids for the content network.
     
    mjewel, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  9. Sohan

    Sohan Peon

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    #9
    So what's the highest you should expect for the content network?
     
    Sohan, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  10. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #10
    There is no rule - it could be anything. An advertiser could bid $10 for search and 10 cents for content. Many advertisers don't even run ads on the content network so there is no way to ever get those ads shown on your site. The tool is good for comparing one keyword against another (to get an idea if it is in a high paying sector, but don't pay attention to the prices shown thinking you will get anything close to that per click.

    Advertisers have three options when using adwords for PPC.

    Google Seach (they must use it to participate in the Search Network)

    Search Network (large partners like AOL) Optional - Same pricing as Search.

    Content (optional) Advertisers can set completely different bids than search without affecting their CTR for positioning with google search - or not use it at all. These are the ads that show on publishers sites running adsense.


    Advertisers can also block their ad from showing on individual sites.
     
    mjewel, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  11. valueman

    valueman Member

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    #11
    There is also Smart Pricing to consider. Google doesn't give out as much per click to new sites and site that doesn't covert well in terms of action.

    I think chasing the latest 'hot' keywords is a very short term strategy. It's usually way too competitive. Unless you really want to focus and specalize in that field, it's much easier to go for less valued keywords with high traffic. Just my 2 cent.
     
    valueman, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  12. Sohan

    Sohan Peon

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    #12
    Well what I would of thought is, that if so many people make a site based on these keywords (Such as asbestos) the market would lower their maximum for a bid.
     
    Sohan, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  13. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #13
    It shouldn't lower what advertisers are willing to pay, it just makes it a lot harder for the publisher to get natural search engine results when you are competing against 10,000 sites vs. 1,000. It can actually have the opposite effect - higher paying clicks because of publishers using PPC arbitrage.

    The highest paying keywords generally have the most sites because everyone is trying to get a piece of the action.
     
    mjewel, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  14. MountainLife

    MountainLife Well-Known Member

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    #14
    i do think there is a direct correlation to high return keywords and their payout demise as webmasters abuse the system
     
    MountainLife, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  15. RuDeDoGg

    RuDeDoGg Well-Known Member

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    #15
    It's better to just make a website about something you enjoy. I mean, these keyword prices never last very long, so by the time you develop a new website around the keyword and start getting traffic, the high CPC is gone...
     
    RuDeDoGg, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  16. chachacallis

    chachacallis Well-Known Member

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    #16
    who say you we get %60 of a click Value

     
    chachacallis, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  17. Sohan

    Sohan Peon

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    #17
    I read it here somewhere, that you get 60%.
     
    Sohan, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  18. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #18
    Google financials show they pay out 78% of what they receive, as a whole. They may pay certain premium parties more, and adsense publishers slightly less, but I know for a fact it is in the 70% plus range.

    You have no way of knowing what an advertiser is charged for a click. I run adwords on keywords that show a $15 top bid and I am charged under 50 cents per click because my ad doesn't run in the #1 position. Again, you are looking at google search bids, not content bids which are not disclosed. Content bids can be a fraction of what google search bids are.

    Smart pricing also reduces the amount the advertiser is charged (and conversely what the adsense publisher is paid). If your site is not converting well, the advertiser may only be charged 20 cents for an ad clicked on your site, and perhaps $1 on a well converting site. If the advertiser is only charged 20 cents, then google is only going to pay about 15 cents to the publisher.

    Here is an actual example:

    It is costly me about $2.40 a click for a keyword that runs on google search in the #1 position. I have a bid of 15 cents for the same exact keyword on the content network (and it puts me in the 1.4 position). If my ad gets clicked on by someone using google search or network partner, I pay $2.40. If someone clicks the SAME exact ad on a site running adsense, the MAXIMUM I will be charged is 15 cents.

    If I wanted to be in a lower postion on google search, that same click might only cost me 50 cents. Just because you are the highest bidder for a keyword, it does NOT mean your ad will be #1. You might be #5 even though you are being charged the highest amount per click. Google would rather show a 50 cent ad that is getting clicked, than a ad from a bidder offering to pay $3.00 but which their ad gets clicked much less frequently. Your CTR affects the position of your ad.
     
    mjewel, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  19. stackman

    stackman Peon

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    #19
    I've occasionally gotten extremely high RPC on some ads for certain keywords, primarily financial, but the high payout only occurs for the first click, or first few clicks of the day. Then it goes downhill during the day.

    My guess is that high-roller advertisers are blowing out their daily budget early on and leaving it to the not-so-wealthy advertisers after that. Just a theory.
     
    stackman, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  20. Danny

    Danny Active Member

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    #20
    I remember when this business use to be easy!

    People now see this as "easy money" but it is so like having a full time job now
     
    Danny, Jul 31, 2006 IP