The Sarah Palin Thread

Sarah Palin asked nothing; she read a prompter, and apparently has a hard time with the toughie, the word "massive." Nevertheless, the speechwriters' question was an improvement on McCain's lie, that he would be increasing the tax on working families.

Obama's plan will hit the rich, and give tax relief to everyone else. McCain's will simply do nothing to everyone else's tax burden, while easing the burden on the richest in America through a gordian knot of loopholes, from what I can tell.

This is from the Tax Policy Center, evaluating their respective plans:

Probably also important to keep in mind that neither camp has a plan to really end the budget deficit. McCain's notion that he is somehow the fiscally responsible candidate while Obama is the prodigal son is, simply, bullshit.

 

I don't the idea of taking unwarranted pot shots at politicians. I know they will goof words and make mistakes. But I think you summed it up. It is so bad, it looks like it has to be an edit job or combining the answer to a different question. But it is not - and that is what makes it so bad. She truly is out of her league. There are so many really smart conservatives, who hold all her same positions, but could hit the questions out of the ball park. She is clueless under the glare of the lights. I may not agree with her positions, but I can deal with that. What I can't accept is that she is totally out of her league running for Vice President and there is a pretty good chance that if McCain won she would end up being the President. I would rather see an intelligent and qualified person (liberal or conservative) at the helm than an idiot of any stripe.

 

Yes what you are saying is BS. Raising corporate tax and tax on those with higher incomes will increase the cost of goods and services on the middle class.

I hope no one is foolish enough to belief that crap you are trying to spin.

Sheep to a slaughter.

 

Score another one to Couric, with that much-awaited Supreme Court question:

COURIC: What other Supreme Court decisions [than Roe v. Wade] do you disagree with?

PALIN: Well, let's see. There's --of course --in the great history of America rulings there have been rulings, that's never going to be absolute consensus by every American. And there are--those issues, again, like Roe v Wade where I believe are best held on a state level and addressed there. So you know--going through the history of America, there would be others but--

COURIC: Can you think of any?

PALIN: Well, I could think of--of any again, that could be best dealt with on a more local level. Maybe I would take issue with. But you know, as mayor, and then as governor and even as a Vice President, if I'm so privileged to serve, wouldn't be in a position of changing those things but in supporting the law of the land as it reads today.​

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=DRuBdW0yBUY

This is truly pathetic. She can't name a single fricking Supreme Court decision she does not agree with. Only the truly ignorant continue to pretend she is qualified. Again, if it were not so dangerous, there might be some humor in it. Unfortunately this is not SNL, this is what McCain feels is the best qualified person in this country to be his VP. source

 

Picking Palin was also a tactical mistake on part of McCain. He has cornered himself in a position that he has to lie to people. Say stupid things like the russia-alaska episode. Hiding her is not making things any better either, and yet another mistake.

 

Thanks for the video, that portion looked unedited for the most part. She should just say she doesn't know off hand any others. Simple answer. I would bet most on this board wouldn't have any to give as an example without googling one to come back to try and prove something.

Her not knowing any ruling that she would disagree with would in no way make her unqualified for VP compared to others in recent history. She isn't a lawyer, so that wouldn't be her specific field of study.

 

I agree to some extent, but I think she could formulate a better answer. There are issues she could have touched on without naming particular decisions. The Court recently ruled that child rapists are not eligible for the death penalty. John McCain has recently mentioned some cases that he said were some of the worst decisions in history - relating to prisoner rights at gitmo. And Palin herself, just three months ago commented on the Exxon damages case, dealing with Alaska, when she said:

"While the decision brings some degree of closure to Alaskans suffering from 19 years of litigation and delay, the Court gutted the jury’s decision on punitive damages."

Since it is the President to nominates justices for the court I do think some understanding of the issues is not asking too much. Members of this forum may not know the answers - but they are not seeking the second highest office in the land. These are things she should have been prepared to discuss and cases she was familiar with but just kind of blanked out. It is not a once or twice thing, it seems to be her current state of mind. I know she has lost her confidence and it seems she is so scared of saying something wrong she is trying not to say anything at all.

 

Then how is she ready to uphold the constitution if she doesn't know it?

Neither her nor McCain have any education. She has a 2 year degree in journalism that took her 5 years and 4 colleges to get, and McCain graduated on the bottom of his class, and can't use a computer.

Obama and Biden are both lawyers, legal instructors at a University level, with degrees in Constitutional Law, and minors in Economics.

You cannot govern what you do not understand or have an education in.

I can run a bar or nightclub at the drop of a hat, but I cannot run a real estate office.
To run this country, we need someone who understands it. We have enough Generals and advisers militarily, most important is the judgment, education, temperance, and Dedication.

The bottom line is, she is adequate for local government, even Governor of Alaska. Arnold could do it. Ventura could do it. You only need to be popular and have support of the common people.

This is not Governor. This is second in command. She needs to know the country, the law, and have enough education to know what the constitution says. She cannot not "cute" her way through running a country of laws and history.

This is not a popularity contest. Likability and appealing to a demographic of people does not make a VP or Commander in Chief...that is how we get in trouble...voting for people we like, instead of who can do the job effectively.

It is amazing that a conservative cannot name a specific Supreme Court Case that they disagree with, conservatives by nature disagree with the Supreme Court Everyday !

Unacceptable.

 

This is absolutely appalling for you to insinuate that McCain and Palin are uneducated. McCain graduated from the Naval Academy and it does not matter if he was 1st or last. Their degrees are non issues. Obama has a a minor in economics and has proposed a plan that will cause major inflation for all classes of US Citizens. He has a degree in economics but is an idiot and/ or does not understand economics or just does not give a crap.

Obama and McCain are just 2 dumb_ss's with degrees. I have seen plenty of people like that. We have a few like that in the forum.

 

There is nothing dumb about Biden or Obama. You may not like them personally, but this is not a personality contest. To say that they are not well educated men, just proves that you are not willing to concede anything regarding them based on personal feelings.

You honestly can sit here, given the current state that we are in economically. the worst it has been in 50 years, because of the policies, tax breaks and deregulation of the current administration, and say that we do not need to do something different and have everyone treated equally ?

You don't have to agree with me on my choice of candidates,, but you have to be pissed right now, and you cannot in good conscience sit here and say all is well and lets continue down this path.

McCain is full of double talk. If you honestly believe that he can have 31 lobbyist run his campaign, an issue that George Bush himself attacked him on in the 2000 election (even called McCain a Washington insider with ties too close to special interest and lobbyist) , and not continue to sell us out to those very same people that he is close to, and that are running his campaign, and not take care of his buddies at the top, then I have a bridge in Alaska to sell you.

McCain is a puppet. There are 31 lawyers running his campaign that are still employed at lobbying firms in Virginia, Maryland and Washington. Lawyers who have made millions lobbying for the very same companies that have either folded in recent weeks, or are now asking for a bailout.
Lobbyist who have received $30k a month for 5 years, from Freddie and Fannie even as they were going under.

Do you really want these guys in charge of the cheese ? they have already raped and pillaged the system.

How much more can you take ?

I don't care if your issues are racist in nature or you are just a die hard Republican no matter what, but I cannot understand anyone who would still continue to trust this party.

Can you even recite any of Obmas tax plan ? The one you say is going to cripple the economy. Cripple it from what ? Its in the shitter now! The only thing left is for banks to start closing...oh yeah, they already have.

So he wants you to start paying your fair share in taxes again...what a horrible , horrible man. If you don't think it's your responsibility to pay your taxes and not hide under shelters and loop holes, then I hear Costa Rica is nice this time of year and you can go ahead on give up your U.S. citizenship.

If making large business actually pay their taxes is going to cause some kind of ripple, then we don't need those businesses. they can close down, and those of us that can actually run one, and still pay taxes and keep people employed will take their place.
If we are cleaning up the system, we may as well clean that up too and get those businesses out of here, and let new ones take their place who can pay their taxes. Their time is done.

This retribution type rhetoric that if you make me pay my taxes , I'm going to raise my prices and cut back on my employees is ridiculous. If not paying taxes is the only way that you can stay in business, then maybe the economy doesn't need you leeching off the system.

The bottom line is, as we have seen, tax breaks do not create jobs, they only pad pockets of top executives. This is greedy country. People only care about themselves, so stop giving them a break while the rest of us pay our fair share. It does not work.
Jobs have still moved overseas.
You can't even get an American on the phone anymore for customer service. Oil companies have reported record profits. More than any company ever in the history of the United States of America. Ever !

This has all happened in the last 8 years under the current tax structure.

They have done it to us too many times. Regan deregulated everything, and the Savings and Loans collapsed, (I am sure McCan remembers that, those were his buddies). Clinton came in and stabilized everything and restored Gov oversight and consumer protection, and G.W. came in a deregulated everything again, stripped the Gov oversight and took away consumer protection, and it happened again, but worse.

..and now you want to go in for the third time ? The next time will completely destroy our country.

When we start recalling carrier groups and subs because we can't afford to run them, I guess you will be happy sitting there with you tax break.

So you are not going to vote for someone just because he is black, or a Democrat ? That is such a ridiculously insignificant hang up to hold on to with so much at stake.
You would sell out your country, just to keep someone out of office based on personal feelings ? Maybe you should move to Costa Rica.

 

Harold, Biz is about to attempt college for the first time, as I understand it, so we can forgive his pontifications on "dumb asses with degrees," as the concept, the very idea of valuing higher education, is apparently entirely alien to him. If his volumes of simplistic propaganda here are any true indication of his mindset, I see only bitterness and abject fear, nothing more.

 

Well, you would've hoped that our last few presidents would have even bothered to look or read it at some point.... Yes, she should know it, but to recall every case??? come on. At least Browntwn makes sense when he commented on this.

You really are that brainwashed to believe you can only understand those things you have a formal education in? I had to work with guys like you. The ones that know-it-all who actually knew all they would. Very frustrating to work with those who refuse to learn because they were "educated" and I "was not". Part of why I got tired of working for others.

nuff said.

You may be right, but lets look at the next part..

And exactly why are people voting for the big O? You nailed it right on the head with that on.

You are probably overly confused by drinking and thinking - conservatives for the most part disagree with legislating from the bench - in other words they are not following the law. If you were for the constitution you would agree with that. But it seems many "liberal" don't like the constitution to begin with.

 

Debunked, just a couple of things. Firstly, he didn't say every case. He said a single case.

I think it's a legitimate point. The only case the Governor can apparently recall is Roe v. Wade.

I think wisdom can come from everywhere. It's the deliberate dismissal of formal higher education as "elitist" and virtually "un-American" that is a problem, in my opinion, something I've seen creep into our national discourse too much.

 

You seem to see something others don't. "Elitist" or "un-american" isn't attached to those with formal education, it has to do with everything else, such as attitude, treatment of others not as wealthy as you, etc...

If you have seen someone state that just because of a specific education makes one an elitist, you can show me, because I have not seen that.

 

I think hmansfield's view on education is elitist. Book smarts aren't all that important for the president. That's what advisors are for.
And Palin could have came out and wowed us all with her brilliance, regardless of her education, but that hasn't happened.
Palin isn't coming off as an idiot because she doesn't have an ivy league degree, and Joe Biden wasn't chosen for the ticket because he has a degree in foreign policy, but because he has experience in it.

 

Well, just recently, Bill Bennett adopting folksy tone, when dismissing the opinions of the "intellectuals" David Brooks and George Will, two conservatives who have raised a legitimate, serious issue with Palin's candidacy. On the Today Show, when asked by Meredith Veira about their views, Bennett replies, sneering and snickering,

Now - this is a guy who was the Secretary of Education under Bush, Sr., who attended Williams College, has both a J.D. from Harvard Law, and PhD in political philosophy.

It is the timbre of the debate I'm talking about, not the credentials. Bennet's easy dismissal of "intellectuals," though he's one himself, is the kind of populist chant that has been employed for far too long, in my opinion, in dismissing pure thought as somehow "effete," and therefore, impliedly so, "un-American." Palin exemplifies it - a cynicism that says "don't let those Harvard snobs fool you - I'm as real as your next door neighbor."

When I don't want my next door neighbor at the reins of power. He's an idiot.

Edit: Just saw your post, Logic. Let me clear up something. I've said it elsewhere here, but maybe not this succinctly. I do not think book smarts or higher education makes for a good leader.

Neither do I think their absence does. The culture that values the latter is what I'm speaking to - the culture applauding loudly to a President's proud declaration before an audience of college students, "grades don't matter, hell, I got C's, and look what I did!" I may be completely off - it's just a gut perception, and rests in 1000's of snippets that I've never assembled into one source. I may be on to something, or not, but it's what I feel.

 

Now you are talking about "intellectuals" as if being intellectual has to do with having degrees.

I thought the discussion was on "elitists" - those who have never experienced (or forgotten) what it is like to actually have not. Being born with a silver spoon and because of their specific "education" they are better than all. They deserve everything because they are like god. All knowing, all powerful, all wealthy.

 

I am talking about an association of higher education, usually, elite education, with knowing nothing, really. "Eggheads," "intellectuals," whatever one wants to call it, the kind of dismissal of such achievement as meaning nothing - as exemplifed by Bennett's comment, or Bush's comment before the college students. Well, here - I said it earlier:

 

Here's my thought.
Elite education is lessened in value because of the inherent flaws of the education system. A businessman without any education who has been around the world and has seen and interacted with a lot of people knows more [Or knows more useful things] compared with someone who merely has had higher education. Sometimes life teaches us more than education ever can. Not that higher education means nothing, but it isn't as meaningful as it should/could be.

 

I'd say that any imbalance is a deficiency. Anyone believing that all that matters when going to college is a set of business courses, and to hell with those damn classes in the humanities, etc., or avoiding formal education altogether, is a deficiency. Anyone believing that the amount of words one has read supplants the experience of being in the world, is living a deficiency. Again, neither thing - education or experience - is a necessary and sufficient condition for leadership in a political life. But neither is their absence.

This isn't new. And please - everyone - no, I am not comparing what I'm saying to the "little corporal," Hitler. But it is also true that he expressed some of this disdain for educational achievement, while praising "Will" as the only thing of import. From Mein Kampf:

Food for thought. It's important to note that Hitler saw any kind of formal education as merely a means to confirm his previously held convictions, his "instincts" provided by Divine Will.

Basically, I see a vital intellectual culture as necessary to the health of a nation, and it's too easy-dismissal as a call to laziness and complacency. Bennett's sneering disdain for "intellectuals," Bush's dismissal of academic achievement, Spiro Agnew's condemnation of "effete corps of impudent snobs" and all the rest, all speak to a bad trend in American life, in my opinion.