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The 2012 US Presidential Election - Who will run, Who will win???

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by Corwin, Feb 11, 2011.

  1. devTastic

    devTastic Peon

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    #61
    I live in Texas, since you ask.
     
    devTastic, Feb 22, 2011 IP
  2. devTastic

    devTastic Peon

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    #62
    Agreed - no argument there - collective bargaining is NOT a right like freedom of speech or anything else. But even as a private sector employee I now enjoy certain things like a 40 hour workweek, etc that were initially won through collective bargaining rights, were they not? Doesn't the proposed plan prohibit collective bargaining for all non-salary related issues?
     
    devTastic, Feb 22, 2011 IP
  3. Obamanation

    Obamanation Well-Known Member

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    #63
    Why would I waste my time digging up more readily available news articles to dispel the non-fact based nonsense you have been spewing since you showed up here? I figured you wouldn't even bother posting again after I presented hard evidence showing the budget shortfall is nowhere near what you presented it to be. Next you will be claiming Elvis is still alive and asking me to dig up facts to prove it is not so. No thanks.

    [Edit]
    No. Read the plan and you will see what it is about. And it has absolutely nothing to do with private sector unions. You need to start educating yourself from sources other than whatever left wing crap you are currently using, because its embarrassing.
     
    Obamanation, Feb 22, 2011 IP
  4. devTastic

    devTastic Peon

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    #64
    Wow, dude, calm down! In my statement, I was NOT implying that it had ANYTHING to do with private sector unions. Perhaps I just didn't word that properly.
     
    devTastic, Feb 22, 2011 IP
  5. Mia

    Mia R.I.P. STEVE JOBS

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    #65
    A right to work state with no income tax.

    My Grandma lives there too.

    That's all we want in WI. Right to Work and No Income Tax.

    We're on our way to getting it.
     
    Mia, Feb 22, 2011 IP
  6. Obamanation

    Obamanation Well-Known Member

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    #66
    Your quote:
    I'm a bit thick headed, but that to me sounds like an implication about private sector unions. The real discussion which is being skirted here is whether public sector unions have the same merits that a private sector union might. After all, private sector unions don't help get their bosses hired(you know, the people who determine their compensation), or help keep them employed. Can you make the case as to why that is not a conflict of interest at the expense of the taxpayers?

    Are you referring to sick days, pension plans, medical insurance, and other non-salary budgetary items, or are you talking about having just cause to terminate an employee? I believe the answer on both counts is yes(collective bargaining is terminated), though in the case of budgetary items, granting excessive pension and benefits is the same thing as paying a government employee more than the CPI so it is justifiable. In the case of termination for just cause, there are already a myriad of state and federal laws that protect employees from wrongful termination. Perhaps you are trying to make the case for that the state should have to keep around non-performing teachers because of stricter termination rules negotiated via collective bargaining rights? Perhaps you can explain to me how that is in the best interest of the taxpayers?
     
    Obamanation, Feb 22, 2011 IP
  7. Breeze Wood

    Breeze Wood Peon

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    #67

    A clear victory for the Administration.

    Whether planned or not the outcome for Emanuel after 2010 is an open path for the future.
     
    Breeze Wood, Feb 22, 2011 IP
  8. Thales

    Thales Peon

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    #68
    I noticed no one has mentioned Barbour yet.

    It'll be tough for him to come ahead of Romney, Huckabee, Daniels or even Pence, but if he does, I am willing to bet some good money he will win the presidency hands down. This guy has some serious money going for him, and his hand is in the pocket of every major republican contributor. He will just outspent Obama to the White House - even if the Dems use the perceived racist card. Quite possibly the most influential GOP man since Reagen.

    He can't use his cash advantage against the other Reps in the primaries, and therein lies his Achilles thumb...
     
    Thales, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  9. Obamanation

    Obamanation Well-Known Member

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    #69
    He's nationally well liked and respected by members of both parties as well. You think his southern drawl is a handicap?

    I'm having some bumper stickers made up that I am going to put on the bumpers of random vehicles in Berkeley grocery store parking lots, while their owners are inside shopping.
    Palin 2012

    What do you think?
     
    Obamanation, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  10. Mia

    Mia R.I.P. STEVE JOBS

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    #70
    Of course it is. Now we'll have all the liberals in one place.

    Idaho
    Wisconsin
    Ohio
    Pennsylvania
    Indiana
    New Jersey

    The list keeps growing! Lets put them all in once place and hope they all stay there.

    Just think, when the Republican controlled congress starts cramming legislation down Obama's throat, he'll likely defect back to Illinois too.

    Then the circle will be complete!

    Oh and as far as the topic is concerned, the next US President in 2012 will be a Governor.

    Some of the obvious choices are:

    Christie
    Kasich
    Walker

    Kinda amazing to think that the downfall of democrats and unions in this nation will be ushered in by Governors.
     
    Mia, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  11. Thales

    Thales Peon

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    #71
    I'm thinking his affection for the White Citizen's Council days down at Yazoo City edges the drawl... Not by much, mind you...

    Way ahead of you buddy - with pics and horns and bandanas and tshirts and action figures. I'm locked and loaded and ready to go.

    Here, maybe you could use this one...
    [​IMG]

    And a pin to go with it...
    [​IMG]
     
    Thales, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  12. Thales

    Thales Peon

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    #72
    Well to be fair, their national faces have been a disappointment, to put it mildly. So the second liners may very well be given the push by the grassroots.
    Although, I must say, those names are some pretty intensely dark horses...
     
    Thales, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  13. Mia

    Mia R.I.P. STEVE JOBS

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    #73
    If you are referring to the likes of Palin, and Steele and McCain, or whatever other name has been passed around the circle like a blunt, I'd have to say that the liberal news media is the only one running around naming potential candidates. I'd be very surprised if any of those names show up on actual ballots.
     
    Mia, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  14. robjones

    robjones Notable Member

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    #74
    Yeah, getting a Daley candidate elected in Chicago is quite an accomplishment... like sneaking a nude picture into Playboy.
    Before Obama was Pres, the Daley crew didnt have any political pull in Chicago. Clearly Obama is the reason Rahm won.
     
    robjones, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  15. Mia

    Mia R.I.P. STEVE JOBS

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    #75
    I especially enjoyed how the media indicated they had expected there would be LOW voter turnout for the election. When you're running against the machine and the dead, what's the point of casting a vote?
     
    Mia, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  16. Corwin

    Corwin Well-Known Member

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    #76
    It's illegal for a doctor to examine a patient without keeping detailed medical records. Very very illegal, which could lead to their medical license being revoked. Here in Massachusetts my own doctor is not allowed to JUST check my blood pressure without also conducting a short exam with notes.


    There's a difference between a "tactic" and a sincere observation. I made a sincere observation, while you seem intent on asserting some sort of superiority in the discussion. :cool:

    Texas is nice that way. So is New Hampshire. It's a funny thing when a State decides it's best for the economy to let citizens keep their money.

    In Long Island New York, the state of NY takes out more from LI then they get back in benefits. Taxation Without Representation (Yes, I support Long Island Statehood)

    Governors make the best Presidents because their job is a microcosm of the presidency.
     
    Corwin, Feb 23, 2011 IP
  17. Thales

    Thales Peon

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    #77
    Nah. Palin and Mccain are obviously of the 'failed' national brigade. I was thinking more along the lines of accountant Daniels or heartland darling Pence.

    like sneaking a nude picture of McCain into Playboy. That oughta create some sort of a sales record...

    Interesting thought. I'm afraid I'm gonna have to agree with you. However, doing too well of a job as Governor might not be entirely beneficial to a national campaign either - there's your under performing peers to think about...
     
    Thales, Feb 24, 2011 IP
  18. Corwin

    Corwin Well-Known Member

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    #78
    First, let me admit that I haven't really been paying attention to the Republican straw polls and weeding out process for the 2012 Presidential election.

    But I do admit that I spent a few minutes out of my extremely busy day trying to find the results of the Republican Iowa straw poll. I figured that Foxnews.com or CNN.com would show the results. After a few minutes of searching, I couldn't find the results so I gave up and went back to work.

    But I do watch Jon Stewart. Last night, he showed the results of the Iowa Straw Poll:

    I searched Foxnews.com and CNN.com. Neither website said anything of any significance about the man in bold - Ron Paul. His Wikipedia article is an exercise in boredom. Google doesn't show much of Ron Paul, I had to search using Bing. From the clips I saw, he got approval and applause at the Iowa debates, yet that Fox News hack Bret Bair treated Paul like he was some crazy Democrat. Neither Fox nor CNN have any articles on Ron Paul.

    RonPaul(dot)com is not his, it's a crazy site hosted in Turkey. I finally found Ron Paul's website and I gotta say, I'm impressed. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but this guy wants to end Wall Street's control of Washington!

    As the Tea Party candidate, I think it's very revealing how the Republican party is treating him. It has already been pointed out that while the Republicans are courting the Tea Party vote, the Republican Party refuses to back real Tea Party candidates (the Tea Party doesn't support Sara Palin because she's a Republican prop, but Fox News would like us to think she's Tea Party).

    So, any Ron Paul supporters out there that want to explain this guy?
     
    Corwin, Aug 16, 2011 IP
  19. robjones

    robjones Notable Member

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    #79
    Not sure how you missed coverage of Paul. I watched an interview with him on fox the other day, and he probably has more hardcore devotees on the net than any candidate on the market. I don't mean "people that sorta like him"... I mean people that think anything he says oughta be carved in stone. Heck, there are still people in this forum carrying Ron Paul for president avatars from 2008. Just do a search on his name in DPs p&r forum if you want to find out about him... he hasn't exactly been a closely guarded secret.
     
    robjones, Aug 16, 2011 IP
  20. Obamanation

    Obamanation Well-Known Member

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    #80
    The people who claim to be tea party leaders concern me, including Palin and especially Bachman. Palin is doing her job getting people fired up. Bachman is busy taking government subsidies for her medical clinic and her farm, while speaking out against government subsidies and claiming to be the "leader" of the tea party with her extremely conservative social views.

    Not once has Paul claimed to lead the tea party but, from a fiscal standpoint, the guy is Tea Party through and through. Democrats cant stand him because his libertarian views could have almost every major federal hand out defunded. Republicans don't like him because he doesn't seem to mind if Iran acquires a nuclear weapon.

    With the all around establishment dislike of the man, his close 2nd in that Iowa straw poll didn't even earn him honorable mention in most left and right wing media outlets, while the lunatic Rick Santorum who finished a distant 4th, was considered "part of the field".

    [video=youtube;6XEmWpDJu5w]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XEmWpDJu5w[/video]

    Regardless of what you might say about Paul's "kooky" ideas, there are a few things that I find interesting:

    1) The man has values that he sticks to. He has been preaching the same mantra without wavering since he first started running for the presidency.
    2) The man was anti-establishment before anti-establishment was cool, and in this election, I think the pols have no idea how far anti-establishment the voting population has gone.
    3) As Iowa shows, he has STRONG support from the party faithful, including social conservatives.
    4) His support is bi-partisan based on his anti-war positions. I've seen more than a few forum members(other forums) talk about abandoning the Democratic party to register Republican and vote for Paul in the primaries. A lot of the crazy Ralph Nader people, but also quite a few mainstream liberals.

    Romney and Perry are a lot less credible on the fight against cronie capitalism, Bachman is a self promoting hypocritical extreme social conservative lunatic, Santorum is extremely conceited despite the fact he is not a smart man, and Cain is not a politician(which is painfully obvious every time I watch him talk). IMO, that leaves Paul as a strong contender, despite the fact he might be OK with Iran obtaining a nuclear weapon. New Hampshire will tell us a lot more.
     
    Obamanation, Aug 16, 2011 IP