Tea Party Lawyer wins suit against NSA in Federal Court. Left attacks.

Truth is stranger than fiction. Conservative lawyer Larry Klayman just won a victory for the American People in federal court, where a judge finds the NSA's domestic spying program to likely be unconstitutional.

Instead of celebrating the civil liberties victory, left wing Anchor Don Lemon has Mr. Klayman on his show, and opens up the segment with a former Klayman adversary Brad Blakeman claiming Mr. Klayman has neither the "legal or intellectual ability to take the fight to the finish".

Mr. Klayman then tore into Don Lemon and Jeffery Toobin of CNN, pointing out their obvious biases and the idiocy of opening up a segment on the court battle of the people vs the NSA with a personal attack on the person bringing the fight. Lemon and Toobin then prove Klayman's point by cutting his mike and removing him from the interview so they can provide their own opinions without any disturbing evidence to the contrary getting in the way. Too funny for words.



Mind you this is the same CNN that earlier in the day had put up this tweet, having to delete it later in the day because it was completely false.



Gay left wing reporter Glenn Greenwald, who has worked for a myriad of hard left media outlets summed it up perfectly.

----

Who could have guessed in 2006 that the Democrats would be the party of the Patriot Act? One would figure that, if you were on the fence on the Patriot Act before, Snowden's disclosures of massive unfettered spying on every last American would have helped you make up your mind, and not in the direction the Democrats went.

 

After reading this I had to call an old friend and work colleague. We met Larry Klayman years ago. It was before he began to gain fame in the 1990's. Fortunately my colleague dealt with him far more than me. Here is the thing about this guy. He was memorable for being a complete pain in the arse. In trying to do a business transaction that thousands do every year and have done for decades...he completely screwed it up, got everyone pissed off, wasted everyone's time, and ruined a couple of weeks of my colleague's time. It was a relatively simple business transaction. He is a remarkable douche bag.

According to a WSJ article describing him and quoting him after this court case the article described it as his biggest victory. Klayman described the situation as one where the government has moved away from the "people".

here is an assessment from one who met him years before he ever gained fame in the political world. I actually have no recollection of whether he was espousing political beliefs of any sort when I had to deal with him in the 1980's.

Larry Klayman probably has no idea of what the term "people" means in any context. Seriously. I was brought into this situation because of my experience. He was so extraordinarily demanding, suspicious, mistrusting, completely at odds with every business norm that virtually everyone acknowledges it left a searing memory in my brain. He had a single person law practice at the time. Its not surprising. He couldn't survive with partners or colleagues.

I've seen this guy's name in the press over the years. His history via Wikipedia has references to his many disputes both personal and business. Most data post 1990 when he got fame in the political arena.

But this guy is a whacko wingnut of preposterous levels imho and experience. Of the many folks in the world this guy has the least context of what the "people" want or believe...unless one is referring to the people as a subpopulation of wingnuts.

 

Thanks for providing evidence to support my op (and Greenwald's tweet).

If someone from the right were to get gay marriage through the supreme court, you would still attack the individual and forget the act. Its truly amazing how much the left hates.

The recent flap with Duck Dynasty got me thinking. If one were to swap out things said by those on the left about the Tea Party, replacing the words "Tea Party" with "Homosexuals" or "Blacks", the left would be outcast from all polite company as the hate filled individuals they are.

 

Let's say that this guy is a f*cking son of b*tch that s*cks d*cks all the day long , happy now? How does this justify Obama being a bad copy of Bush and spying on Americans and ignoring the constitution that he has sworn to uphold?

 

O-nation: When I saw the piece referencing Klayman I had to call an old colleague and look him up. It is remarkable that after almost 30 years one person's name can evoke such a strong memory. He was certainly one of the more odious disrespectful completely antagonistic people and "clients" with whom I or my colleagues recall. He stands out for pure odiousness.

Then I looked him up in wikipedia and elsewhere. Here are some of the wikipedia references: Pretty astounding information: He sued his mother in a case about medical care. His marriage ended in divorce, he didn't pay child support, and he was accused of misappropriate behavior and inappropriately "touching his children".

Klayman's suit against his mother was hidden under the name of a collection agency rather than his own but his own brother revealed the story: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/strange_bedfellow/1998/06/nut_watch.html

the report on his divorce, lack of child support and inappropriate actions is outrageous: http://www.noethics.net/News/index....trict-of-columbia-attorney-misfits&Itemid=100

He has been banned from appearing before judges. This guy is way off on some far distant planet.

Following the most recent litigation he was featured on TV and had this description attached to him: Klayman’s appearance Tuesday night on CNN was preceded by a profile of him that included a quotation from a former George W. Bush staffer saying his lawsuits were about “fighting for himself and his own, in my opinion, delusions of grandeur.”

I have no involvement with him in any way....simply to recall somebody that hit the motherlode of completely objectionable behavior virtually 30 years ago...on a non political issue and left a mark as the worst person to deal with over 3 decades.

Then I go back to this thread you started a while back O-nation highlighting another "hero" of the far right wing extreme: In which an individual, Adam Kokesh called for an armed march on Washington DC on July 4th: https://forums.digitalpoint.com/threads/open-carry-march-on-washington-dc-july-4th.2658113/

There was unsubstantiated reports of over 4,000 people who were going to attend. Except for one thing. They weren't substantiated. Kokesh called for the protest. Then Kokesh called it off without explanation or discussion. He later called for these "people" to march on state capitals with arms on July 4th. I couldn't find any examples of this. Kokesh later appeared alone in DC and filmed himself on what appeared to be dawn hours with a loaded gun, for which he was arrested. He was alone.

What I'm struck by is that the far extreme right wing publicists and media and you, highlight individuals as spokesmen for the right who are certified nuts and provocative and who don't seem to have a following or can't get supporters. But they get a fair amount of publicity even as they seem to be certifiable nuts, dangerous and provocative.

A nutcase is a nutcase. It doesn't matter how one spins it. Its interesting that the far right extreme, and its supporters continue to find and highlight individuals who seem to be misfits in society and are unable to gather followers not because of the correctness or incorrectness of their beliefs but because they are true misfits with distorted perspectives that most people won't touch.

Its actually sad that our society with an overabundness of media tends to highlight these whacko dangerous folks who are personally off on extremes and yet highlighted by an extreme press representing one political view which clearly is unwilling to be accountable for the dangerous directions these maladjusted people can lead others to. Its interesting that many of the worst of these examples keep turning up on the far far right and interesting that you keep highlighting them.

 

I view the entire situation of the NSA, its expansion and the commentary on it as one where the efforts of government and the protections of individual rights as one which has natural conflicts. When it was instituted in 2001 there were reasonable reasons to develop a system that would protect the nation and individuals. It has operated in secrecy. It has been expanded. It is now under attack and review. It is likely that the expansion of surveillance will be curtailed.

If that occurs we will see the ramifications. There will never be a perfect system. If you will note when I made comments about Klayman I didn't comment on the lawsuit. I commented about Klayman himself. There are many who are contesting the expansion of the NSA and all the surveillance on people in the US and around the world.

It struck me that the right wing press and obamanation glorifies this guy who, in my own experience, years ago, left an indelible memory that this is not a guy one wants to deal with in any way. One reference above from the Conservatives themselves describes the guy as delusional. One doesn't need to be political in any way to discern that pattern in an individual.

How does somebody like that get lauded and do his supporters or those that glorify his actions have any accountability at all?

 

In other words, Obama is just another name for Bush and as Bush said, the end justifies the means.

It is too embarrassing to say that Bush and Obama are the two sides of the same coin so I attack the messenger instead of the message.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day. Instead of attacking the messenger, why don´t you discuss the message? Do you agree with Bush that the constitution is just a piece of paper? It seems Obama agrees with that.

 

lol.. "are you ok..."

I cant believe I just sat through that vid.
Nigel

 

GWorld: I don't view the NSA issue as one that is destroying America in any way. It is the natural consequence of 9/11 so many years ago. It was an effort to PROTECT Americans and their rights and safety by trying to find the types of people who perpetrated 9/11 over a decade ago.

When the nation increases security in this manner it is a natural restraint on freedoms. These are not excuses for radicalism. It is how societies work.

It appears that the security measures have been expanded and expanded. Some of the originators of the original NSA legislation are horrified to see how it has evolved. There are reviews now to cut back on its extent. We'll see how they move forward.

If you think its so horrible come here and live here. Experience life in the US.

I'm not saying its good either. Frankly I don't see how its affected me or folks I know beyond making flying more difficult because of security measures. Frankly there haven't been any planes hijacked since 9/11 and flown into buildings as flying bombs either. It started under Bush and its continued under Obama. I don't believe I've been a vocal critic of it over the years.

I'm not attacking the message and not even attacking the messenger. After all there are various people of different political stripes attacking the issue.

What I am doing is identifying Klayman as a nutcase. Even as he is a self proclaimed voice of the right, among the comments about him are those from the Conservative Bush administration stating the guy is delusional.

O-nation put this piece out. It highlights this Klayman guy. I look at this article and another one highlighted by o-nation and likewise by the extreme elements of the right wing in which a guy named Kokish was involved. That guy tried to inflame people to arm themselves, gather in mass and were going to be met by armed police of Washington DC ...all on July 4th where thousands of people were trying to celebrate but would have been in reach of certain firearms.

What could be more provocative and dangerous. Kokish also doesn't seem to have a following. He called for the march and called it off and seemingly nobody else was involved. he called for the "marchers" to march with arms on state capitals. It appears nobody did this.

had folks bought into his idea it could have resulted in injury and death. Nobody did. Good for folks with common sense.

I don't see how people like either of these two guys are glorified by the extreme right wing press. It appears its a pattern. Any nutjob can make an extreme claim and if it is in alignment with the teaparty agenda they will glorify this person. There is nothing helpful or educational or honest about that. At its extremes these are the actions that result in dictators and death and destruction. Its the purposeful dumbing down of the public. At its worst example in history it got Hitler elevated to the top of his party and caused the deaths of millions. That is a consequence of anger and whackos and the dumbing down of a population fueled by crazies.

As a business person I'm far more concerned about Google. Its a monopoly on search and has an undue affect on commerce as search often defines economic activity. Europe is questioning and challenging that monopoly far more than the US. The US should follow suit IMHO.

The US govt as an economic entity that helps to support the economic freedoms of its population and contribute to the world has been continuously threatened by this type of craziness.

It would be better if saner voices were heard more often.

 

GWorld: I don't view the NSA issue as one that is destroying America in any way

this is unfortunate
Nigel

 

At least the new American Nazi Party has nothing against blacks which is kind of a progress.

I find it quite interesting that you are not worried how these types of system destroys democracy and probably many peoples' lives and instead you are worried about Google search results which influences which business sells more porn, viagra or get the most number of gamblers.

 

yeah slapping obama's head on Hitler is helpful to getting shit done.

Nice work racist fucktard.
Nigel

 

Comedy isn't it? This is what qualifies as "unbiased" journalism in America. How sad when you can't distinguish the "news" from Jerry Springer.

FYI, pasting Obama's head on Hitler's photo isn't racist. Ridiculous perhaps, but not even remotely racist. When you bandy about words like that for no reason, the words lose their meaning.

Bingo. The entire point of the original post. Instead of focusing on the very important issue the guy is championing, Earl generated a small book's worth of text in his posts attacking the guy who brought the suit. And people wonder why nothing ever changes.

 

generating hate filled pictures is one of the techniques of the fringe that wants to incite anger and ignores realities. The 5 years of hate filled pictures that reference Obama are filled with endless racist attacks.

I reviewed the literature on Americans prosecuted under the Patriot Act. Doesn't look like a lot of people to me. On the other hand I'm neither Muslim or Arabic. It wouldn't surprise me at all if people of those groups have large numbers of complaints about surveillance. I'm not calling it right or wrong...but it would be expected.

I'll keep stating this: I'm astounded at the exercise of the far right wing in which certifiable nut case paranoid malcontents get to be highlighted by the vocal proponents of the right wing. Kokish called for a mass demonstration of armed people to meet an armed police force. He did it on his own. It gained all kinds of right wing publicity. Then he called it off.

He called it off on his own. Never a word or explanation. There was zilch response to his call for armed people massing at state capitals on July 4th. Did 4,000 plus people confront state capitals???? The guy was held out as a freedom fighter by the right wing media.

Since nobody showed up per his call...it would seem cooler reasonable heads prevailed. but he was held up as a "freedom fighter". Reading about Klayman is extraordinary. The guy has alienated his mother his brother, his ex wife, got accused of wrongful acts with his kids, has a history of not paying people, a history of being banned by judges and courts, etc. I can see why his name stuck with me. The boorish arrogant completely anti social behavior he exhibited in the 1980's in a simple business agreement has stuck with him his entire life. The right wing press is extolling him. There is an amazing disconnect there between common sense and craziness.

Why is it that all the whacko deviant crazies end up at the right wing and beyond that become right wing hero's? Its no wonder a world of conservatives are now mounting a large scale effort to diffuse and weaken the tragic power that the extremest right wing crazies have been allowed to have for a couple of years. hopefully people come to their senses.

 

You forgot to mention that he f*cked his mother, sister and brother and directly afterward engaged in an orgy with a dog and a pig. Again what all this got to do with a subject of a discussion that he believed that the constitution was more than just a "paper", went to court to fight what was wrong with the system and a Judge agreed with him that this system was Orwllian and against the constitution.

Before you start digging dirt on this judge, I make it easy for you and agree that he is also a son of b*tch, c*ck s*cking bastard that f*cks his sister and brother and engages in an orgy with a dog and a pig. Now, can you tell us how that makes his opinion wrong?

 

Its no wonder commentators of all stripes get disgusted with you GWorld. You go off on grotesque commentary with everyone.

Here are the points I've made.

1. I have no commentary on the merits of the discussions and arguments about the Patriot Act and the acts of the NSA. Its currently under review. Much of it has been exposed recently. In fact one of the original sponsors of this legislation now feels that acts of the NSA have gone too far.

The process of democracy works best with intelligence and reasoned discussion. I'm startled by the lack of it.

2. Of the voices on this topic is Larry Klayman. Seeing his name struck a memory bubble for me. Read about the guy. One doesn't need to go into your world of histrionics, Gworld to see he is a well known nutcase. Its astounding that he is glorified from the Right Wing. Even conservatives have called him delusional. I'm simply commenting on how the extreme right wing...the teaparty chooses to extol and glorify people who are crazy, provocative in a dangerous way, or delusional.

3. Despite your grotesque commentary, Gworld: Klayman has sued his mother, obviously pissed off his brother who revealed the information, been sued by his ex wife, been accused of inappropriate behavior with his kids, been consistently late with payments on all sorts of cases including child support, sued the organization that he once started, been banned from courts, etc. He has a long history of being a maladjusted human.

4. Nevertheless he used the term "the government has moved away from the people" in describing his court victory. I said it above and I'll repeat it. A guy with his history has no concept of what the term "people means".

5. His suit won the case. Despite that he merits no credibility. Moreover political movements that glorify him are glorifying a miscreant in every way possible. Nothing good ever comes from that. It spreads ignorance.



There are many ways to analyze and comment on current events. The Patriot Act has been around since 2001 and been increasing its surveillance for years. It has a lot of publicity because of the leaks by Snowden. Before Snowden moved to Asia and started leaking that information he worked for Booze Allen Hamilton.

Booze Allen Hamilton (BAH) is a perfect example of the misdirection of much of current American politics. Consider the following:

This fiscal year BAH made $5.8 billion. 99% of its revenues were government contracts.

That means taxpayers paid for virtually everything. BAH had an average of 24,500 employees for the year. That means taxpayers paid that company well over $200,000 per employee for doing work that govt employees could do. The average govt employee makes around $80,000 year. Taxpayers basically are paying BAH $3 for every $1 they would pay a government employee...yet the BAH and govt employees do the same work paid for by the same taxpayers. Six executives at BAH got paid about $20 million.

Tax payers paid for that. What other govt employees get paid that money? BAH paid its dominant stock holder, the Carlyle company, about $1 million/year in fees. Carlyle is a private equity fund primarily a wealthy investment vehicle. Tax payers paid for that. In order to be a private company BAH pays huge fees to corporate lawyers and accountants. Its all for govt work that could be done by people working for the govt. Taxpayers are paying those corporate law firms and accountants.

Its an enormous tax payer rip off. Why aren't politicians dealing with this? Why aren't all the screamers about govt costs screaming about this? BAH is only the 14th largest govt contractor. Its easy to see that using BAH costs tax payers twice what it would cost if their work was done differently and the work was done by govt employees rather than a profit making private contractor.
If you wanted to save billions of dollars/year in taxpayer money review the contractors and turn them into govt employees. It would save possibly around $30, 40, 50 billion a year.

Then look at our current political mess and the issues that get publicized and brought to the public by the crazed extremist political forces. Take a recent one:

The senate passed the recently negotiated budget compromise. First it went to the House and they passed it. With the Senate getting it second it gave GOP Senators an opportunity to mouth off, for a large number of them to vote against it, and to have a theme around which they could complain. The complaint centered around a cut in military spending that specifically has to do with retirement benefits. Its total is $6 billion spread over 10 years. $600 million/year. On a dollar basis its small potatoes. On an emotional basis its a way for the GOP Senators to vocalize about supporting vets.

But seriously one could review contracting and effectively cut many billions every year simply by cutting the profligate spending of the military industrial complex which is a pure money give away of tax payer money to private businesses.

No politicians are looking at that. Its a waste.

 

Oh please spare me the faux outrage Dave. You live in the DC area, you make your living off those taxpayer dollars. Its a city awash in cash, and it trickles down to every last ma and pop corner store in the area and we both know you don't run a ma and pa corner store, but rather cater to the very people you accurately disparage as blood suckers in your post. You no more want to see any real cuts to wasteful government spending than you want to be forced to skip your next meal.

It reminds me of one of my Canadian relative's last trip's to California. He brought along a friend of his who runs a business related to Canadian oil sands. The guy had lots of money, lots of opinions, lots of hatred for the American "right wingers", and lots of hatred for blacks and gays. Not exactly a coherent political message, but hey, when your geographical location puts you in the path of enormous wealth, do you really worry about whether or not you make sense? It certainly has no bearing on how much money you will make.

 

I was just trying to describe the worst ever you hope to find about this guy or the judge so you won´t waste your time digging about the judge that once in a time he kicked his dog or was rude to his mother in order to avoid discussing the subject.

What do you do instead?

1) Try to discredit my post.
2) You decline to comment on the actual subject which is patriot act and acts of NSA
3) Repeat your attack on Larry Klayman
4) Give enforcement to point 3 by stating that even this has nothing to do with the subject, people should not forget this guy is bad.
5) He won the case but lets forget about it because he is a nut case
6) Let´s change the subject and discuss government waste and how they pay too much to private contractors to spy on Americans and let´s make all these people who are getting paid to spy on people to government employees so the spy program will be cheaper.

I just have one question:

Do you see any difference between Obama and Bush on this subject and in your opinion who is the worst?

 

@o-nation: since you did not disagree with a thing I said but twisted the conversation that suggests you agree totally with the argument. Why don't you follow up and start calling for trimming the govt contractor budget. Go after them, o-nation: there are billions and billions of easy fat to attack. If you do that you become more of a budget cutter rather than a political hack who changes tunes on every issue with your real agenda invariably being political power for your fave pols of the moment.

@gworld: I've articulated what I think about your claims. I believe they are exaggerated. This thing about the Patriot Act and the revelations about the NSA are the natural ebb and flow between security from actual enemies and political rights and freedom. It changes over time. The US overreacted in WWII and sent an entire population of Japanese Americans and Japanese into restricted remote camps. (they didn't do that to Italian or German Americans). I don't think the US found an appreciable number of Japanese spies (but I haven't checked on it to be sure). Later the US apologized. But in that period an entire population of people were removed from freedom.

We don't have anything near that. Not even remotely close. We do have surveillance and it appears its secretive nature has pushed the boundaries of protections and its been advanced beyond the concepts that was originally conceived. Its being reviewed and debated now.

Review and debate. That is what occurs in a healthy society. Hopefully the debate is healthy....but in many ways its not. Too many extremists are using it for their own agendas.

1. your attacks and exaggerations are tiresome
2. I commented on it above and again.
3. klayman is an astounding example of a delusional character. Its pretty astounding that I recall him from about 30 years ago. That was because of a combination of amazing offensiveness way beyond the norm of anyone else. I find it fascinating that people who are generally whacked out get highlighted in the press by the extremists on the right. Conservatives acknowledged Klayman as delusional. The teaparty promoted Kokish who independently tried to get a lot of people to mass arms and meet an armed police force on a day with thousands of innocent people in the area. That is the extreme of danger and stupid. Only extremists with a political agenda and not the slightest iota of responsibility would push that kind of cr@p on the population.
4. Klayman is a whacko. But I also didn't attack the decision. I think the process of review is moving forward. It still makes Klayman a person undeserving of attention. He has demonstrated complete maladjustment on a human scale over decades.

Its actually a statement about our freedoms that this guy continues to operate and periodically get fame. We are a very resilient and forgiving society. In Russia he would have been jailed decades ago. In China he might not now have a head.

5. I've commented on this enough.
6. In that I'm not that concerned about the NSA I find the extremist points irrelevant and absurd. If the right wing, who supported the Patriot Act in the first place, is now on a massive attack on it..because its now tied to Obama...then its an example of the misadventures of extreme politics in the US.
7. I view your points as extreme. The US is still an amazingly free nation that defends rights. Currently it is reviewing the innately conflicting elements between national defense and the full scope of rights. That is healthy in my mind.

 

LOL. Do you even notice the irony in your statement? If the left wing, who attacked the Patriot Act in the first place, is now on a massive support on it..because its now tied to Obama...then its an example of the misadventures of extreme politics in the US.