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STOP promoting ClickBank until you read this!

Discussion in 'ClickBank' started by thedanielsolution, Nov 5, 2009.

  1. Dan Bainbridge

    Dan Bainbridge Active Member

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    #81
    Maybe not criminal, but just a bit.... daft... why go to the trouble of giving 75% and shouting about your conversion rate, then dissapointing affiliates with a poor conversion rate because you've wiped their cookies? If a program isn't converting then regardless whether an affiliate knows they've been duped they will stop promoting it.
    SEMrush
    Just seems a bit short sighted to me really - will probably make a bit more $$ in the short term, but it isn't a practice that has the long term interests of the growth of the company at heart - be nice if more vendors saw it like this, but I guess a lot of people are in it for the short term profit over a couple of months then go and setup a new product :(
     
    Dan Bainbridge, Nov 26, 2009 IP
    SEMrush
  2. alexa_s

    alexa_s Peon

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    #82
    I hear you, but this is what often happens, especially with all those high-gravity products that have a "professional launch" where 100 disposable accounts are used to make 1 sale each (privately refunded). These things start off with a gravity of 100+ after only a week or two and that attracts huge numbers of real affiliates who struggle and struggle and struggle and eventually make 1 or 2 sales each, by which time the gravity has reached 350 and a few hundred sales have been made, though the conversion-rate is still absolutely nowhere. It's self-perpetuating, because a gravity figure like that continually attracts affiliates who eventually drop out when they make hardly any sales. Sometimes products that are a few months old and have a high three-figure gravity are just impossible to sell because their conversion-rates are so appallingly low. Beware! And don't let people tell you that a high gravity figure is "evidence that a product is selling well". All too often it's exactly the opposite! :eek:
     
    alexa_s, Nov 26, 2009 IP
  3. GeorgR.

    GeorgR. Peon

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    #83
    alexa, you know your ***t, respect!! :) A lot of BS going on. And "big names" are often the worst offenders.

    Add: There are outright "scam" products on CB with very high gravity, for example there is a nr. of utterly ridiculous "pyramide scheme" scams products on there where you can only shake your head. Since those products are borderline criminal ALREADY i am not the slightest surprised that those vendors also use such methods to fake their stats.

    But then..there are also "established" vendors with halfway ok products which use those methods.
     
    GeorgR., Nov 26, 2009 IP
  4. Dan Bainbridge

    Dan Bainbridge Active Member

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    #84
    Crazy, didn't know the corruption ran this deep! They could make a series of The Wire about this.. but a bit more boring / geeky :)
     
    Dan Bainbridge, Nov 26, 2009 IP
  5. digi1

    digi1 Peon

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    #85
    Good stuff, Alexa !
     
    digi1, Nov 27, 2009 IP
  6. HankL

    HankL Peon

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    #86
    So the organization which allows the "criminal" activity is ultimately responsible for this theft.

    That organization also promises it's affiliates a (xx) day cookie which is meaningless if it allows this type of activity, thus violating it's own TOS.

    But with no real competition, and no Law Enforcement, they will continue to do what they do.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2009
    HankL, Nov 27, 2009 IP
  7. dmisev

    dmisev Peon

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    #87
    Guys I promote PS3 Magic. can someone see if it is some of that product. i have so much hops but no sale. if someone can tell me?
     
    dmisev, Nov 27, 2009 IP
  8. Dan Bainbridge

    Dan Bainbridge Active Member

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    #88
    I can't even see if PS3 magic have an opt-in list??

    There is an easy way to tell - with ANY clickbank affiliate. All you have to do is use your own hoplink to access their sales page. Then click on the "Buy Now" button - at the bottom of their order page it will tell you which affiliate will get the commission if you buy - i.e:
    [affiliate = submp3s]

    This will be your affiliate ID - then to make sure you're not being cheated just opt into their list, receive a couple of emails from them, and click the links - then go back onto their ordering page and see if your affiliate link is still at the bottom, or if it has changed to theirs / another one.
     
    Dan Bainbridge, Nov 27, 2009 IP
  9. alexs464

    alexs464 Well-Known Member

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    #89
    ... if the cookies with your affiliate ID is not set you won't get the commission?
    Are you seriously surprised about that?

    Most affiliate networks rely on cookies... how do you expect to get paid if your cookie is not there?

    In most cases people use the same browser. So even if they close the page and come back to it days later - your cookie will still be there and you will still get the commission, even if they went through a link in the e-mail (unless the publishers cheats and sets his own affiliate link)...

    I really don't get the point of this thread...
     
    alexs464, Nov 27, 2009 IP
  10. zigzag007

    zigzag007 Active Member

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    #90
    my clickbank name is zigzag67

    Here's the last part of the Opt- in email link for the pay page I got:

    price_group=10&product_id=1&hide_paysys=clickbank


    It was changed right?


    Thanks
    Jeff
     
    zigzag007, Dec 12, 2009 IP
  11. alexa_s

    alexa_s Peon

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    #91
    Well, you'll have to ask the OP that; but to me it looks like he'd just realised for the first time (with perhaps a touch of shock and melodrama) what any experienced CB affiliate already knows: that if your potential customers are in direct email contact with the vendor, you'd be naive to imagine that you'll necessarily be accredited affiliate commissions for their subsequent purchases. Not exactly "breaking news", I agree - but some people haven't quite worked it out, you know? ;)
     
    alexa_s, Dec 12, 2009 IP
  12. jobfree77

    jobfree77 Peon

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    #92
    The only way you won't get your commision is if the vendor is shady and puts his clickbank hoplink in their autoresponder emails.
    Other than that you will get your sale because of the cookies.
    Most vendors send you directly to the main url and not a clickbank hoplink in their emails so the best thing to do is sign up and check the emails yourself and if it's not a clickbank hoplink to steal your commish then your fine.
    Sometimes the autoresponder sales sequence is needed for better conversions.
    Don't be so paranoid, I've never bought a product without signing up to thier mailing list first.
     
    jobfree77, Jan 4, 2010 IP
  13. alexa_s

    alexa_s Peon

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    #93
    First, according to Clickbank that isn't "shady": vendors are allowed to do that - Clickbank's view is that if the prospect puts his email address into the vendor's opt-in, from that moment onwards he "belongs" to the vendor and the affiliate has absolutely no protectable rights to him. They told me this themselves.

    Secondly, there are many other ways you can not get your commissions, all of which are fairly regularly discussed in this forum.

    There are nearly 30,000 products on Clickbank.

    You have absolutely no way of knowing what "most vendors" do.

    And neither do I. The difference is that I'm not pretending to. Like many professional affiliates, I'm just side-stepping the potential problem, with no difficulty at all, and choosing another product instead. There's no shortage of them, you know? ;)

    This is a hugely important decision for affiliates. For many (including me) it was the difference between earning very little at all and earning several thousand every month.

    That's why affiliates need to use an autoresponder sequence and build their own list.

    The point here doesn't relate to "follow-up or no follow-up": it relates to "follow-up by the vendor" or "follow-up by the affiliate" whose work, skills, time, effort, energy and money have produced the prospective customer.

    I don't think I've ever bought one that had a list to sign up to.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2010
    alexa_s, Jan 4, 2010 IP
  14. Patchkaa

    Patchkaa Peon

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    #94
    DO you make much money on CB? All I see you doing on this forum is write conspiracy posts against CB!
     
    Patchkaa, Jan 4, 2010 IP
  15. floodrod

    floodrod Well-Known Member

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    #95
    Since affiliates deem this important, I am happy tp say that:

    The Unexplainable Store Now offers a linking option for affiliates who do not want to display our Opt-In box. See here for more info. http://www.store.unexplainable.net/options.php

    These are the kind of threads that should be valued by vendors. Thank you DP members for telling me what you guys want..
     
    floodrod, Jan 19, 2010 IP
  16. alexa_s

    alexa_s Peon

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    #96
    If you're asking me, I make between $5,000 and $6,000 per month from Clickbank now, after about 16/17 months. I had a rough start, though, it took me about 4 months to earn anything at all. Another 2 or 3 months after that, I learned the realities of Clickbank that I now sometimes post about, and just like many others, that was when I started making a living from it.

    I don't understand what you mean by "conspiracy" at all. When I see people posting here that Clickbank's a scam and they're dishonest, I'm always the first to jump in and correct this information. Many aspects of their service are mismanaged and incompetent, but I have absolutely no reason at all to imagine that they're dishonest.

    Quite frankly, I'd stop reading my posts, if I were you, since you obviously don't like them. ;)
     
    alexa_s, Jan 19, 2010 IP
  17. Ripped

    Ripped Well-Known Member

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    #97
    What you've achieved is great, and you're in the top few percent among the clickbank marketers. Keep it up.

    What you need to understand is, this is a public forum, and everyone has different opinions. You have to be a little open-minded and be aware that people might always not agree with you.

    I agree with patchkaa about the conspiracy theories. Your posts sound paranoid at times. Which I understand to some point, since there are many dishonest people in this business, but I believe you're a bit too paranoid. Not everything can be explained with a conspiracy theory. Often times, the the simplest explanation tends to be the best one.

    For example, we've had the high gravity - low gravity debate many times. I've provided actual facts from my experience as a vendor, data from my experience as an affiliate, and gave you my point of view.

    Your counterarguments were a conspiracy theories, sounding something like this: Greedy vendors magically raise their gravities, and create a misconception that their product sells. You were also saying how they had crated hundreds of affiliate accounts and they bought their product using different accounts and then went to refund them later. Again, this is very paranoid and conspiracy-like. Similar story with the opt-ins: Greedy vendors override the hoplinks and steal all your money.

    I do also not agree about the opt-ins with you. Opt-ins can very often increase the conversion rate of the page. So would you rather promote a page without an opt-in that converts worse than the same page with an opt-in (considering that the opt-ins are legit and there is not overriding of the cookies). Also, if anyone was overriding the hoplink, it would not be worth it, and he wouldn't last, the vendor would be exposed sooner or later. Yes, there are vendors doing it, but it is not that common.

    Do whatever works for you. Low gravity and no opt-in seems to be working for you, than keep doing it, it's cool. You've found your winning formula, keep doing it!

    But you have to understand, there is no 'right way'. Many people promote products with opt-ins, and are making huge profits. No it's not a conspiracy theory, there really are, I'm sure there are a few people on this forum like that.
     
    Ripped, Jan 19, 2010 IP
  18. jaykou

    jaykou Active Member

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    #98
    But I think the majority of affiliates who are new and intermediate don't know anything about these commission leaks with vendor, and would be shocked to find this truth one day. It took me lot of months to find this. And Alexa's posts did help me....though they were discussed thousand times....it's a known truth for all of you experienced marketers...but not for newbies. And I think Alexa is just trying to teach those majority of people who can learn a lot in this forum. And her opinions are useful to anyone who're in the initial and intermediate levels of IM

    And this is what makes DP good too, a mix of experienced and newbie marketers. Though many experienced AM'ters don't care to share their knowledge....there are really some good people like Alexa who really cares.
     
    jaykou, Jan 19, 2010 IP
  19. alexa_s

    alexa_s Peon

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    #99
    I have never suggested any "conspiracy" at all.

    This is ludicrous.

    Do you want to see what the word "conspiracy" means, in a dictionary? ;)

    I have never tried to explain anything with a conspiracy theory, so we agree there. ;)

    And I accept it as your point of view, and don't doubt your experience as a vendor, and have never suggested otherwise.

    I've also said that many people have other, different experience.

    And for some reason that seems to give you a problem.

    That happened to me with 6 of the first 7 products I promoted. (I know they didn't "conspire": they all did it independently). That was my fault for being gullible. I know better now and that's why I'm making a living where I wasn't for the first few months. I didn't do anything else different at all: just switched to low gravity products without a vendor's opt-in (as many others have found before me). Just like you, I'm giving my own direct, personal experience. I hope that's ok with you.

    I've never suggested otherwise.

    Like most professional affiliates, I use an opt-in for anything I promote.

    If my work, time, energy, money and skills produce the customer, I want him on my list, not on yours. Sorry about that. :eek:
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2010
    alexa_s, Jan 19, 2010 IP
  20. cam345

    cam345 Peon

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    #100
    As a newbie after one week reasearch today i decided to go with clickbank and start promoting,then i saw this thread tonight.
    Would love to have a mentor if anyone interested please pm me.
    tahnks
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2010
    cam345, Jan 19, 2010 IP