Should the motto "In God We Trust" be removed from U.S. currency?

Hey Northpoint,

I confess to going to the extreme, but I think it is a valid point.

St0x can't stop quoting the 10 commandments. We all know the source.

 

This has to be the most ridiculous point anyone has made, ever.

Are you at any point in your life going to have a go at thinking for yourself? or are you going to rely entirely on instructions?

 

I thought it said
"New World Order?"

 

Jazz, if you could provide me your reasoning to help support your statement, that it is impossible to live a moral and compassionate life without god, or Christian theology as established in the Bible, I'd be glad to consider your points in good faith.

I would also say the reasoning should be something beyond leaving a rep with the following statement:

 

DP seems to bring out the best in people.

 

George Washington - "It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and the Bible."

Thomas Jefferson - "The general principles, on which the Fathers (the founders of America) achieved independence, were the only Principles in which that beautiful Assembly of young Gentlemen could Unite... And what were these general Principles? I answer, the general Principles of Christianity, in which all these Sects (denominations) were united..."

Fisher Ames - "We have a dangerous trend beginning to take place in our education. We're starting to put more and more textbooks into our schools... We are spending less time in the classroom on the Bible, which should be the principle text in our schools... The Bible states these great moral lessons better than any other manmade book."

The list can go on and on. Most of the founders were Christians.

The phrase "separation of church and state" do not appear in the Constitution. And, the man who wrote the clause from which the doctrine of the separation of church and state was invented, himself said we ought to teach the Bible in public schools!

I can give you so many examples of laws that were and some still in place that existed because of Jesus teachings. (Abortion, Capital Punishment, Prostitution,etc..)

Peace,

 

Why? You're just a Canadian

There was a time, and still is, when our forefathers had great respect for God:

 

And? Have you looked at exchange rate for Canadian dollar to U.S Dollar?

 

Your "forefathers" may have believed in and had respect for god, and may have even tastelessly crow-bared in a mention here and there, But the constitution doesn't mention it nor respect for it and the founding fathers had no intention of creating a christian nation founded on christian values, As is evident from the treaty of Tripoli.

Some founding fathers were christian, some were deist and some were atheist. it's irrellivant, because america "is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion".

I don't see why theists always have this need to drag their entire country down with them. is it not enough for you that you believe in it? Why is it so important to pretend that the entire country identifies with your religion when it's obviously not true?

 

And? Have you counted how many seeds are in a blackberry?

Our, not "your" country was founded on Christian principles. You are entitled to your opinion, but not your own facts.

I can post the preambles again, if your browser didn't pick them up the first time.

 

Oops, missed the edit. Actually a few years ago, there was a survey done that 77% of Americans were Christian. Atheists from other countries do not represent or speak for "our" country.

So why do people like you, try to bring down the majority, in such a selfish manner? If you can ask that question of Christians, why can you not be asked as well?

 

How are the preambles relevant? it's basically people who have a belief accepting the contents of a document and tastelessly crow-barring their believf into their acceptance speech.

it's amounts to an actor saying "i thank god for this Oscar" and using that as a reason to conclude that the Oscars are based on christian values.

 

And how does that change what the constitution says or what the founders intentions were?

Are you saying you are entitled to rewrite history and display spectacular dishonesty on the grounds that 77% of the nation you live in are equally dishonest and would probably rewrite history too? How very "christian".

 

More importantly, how are they not important? They illustrate my point.

"The people" do not represent an actor. "The people" do represent their Constitution.

How does it not change the Constitution? Where does my country's Constitution say the US was not founded on Christian principles?

Rewriting history isn't necessary. There is no question that the US was founded on Christian principles. Just because you say it wasn't, doesn't make it so. If you are disappointed that 77% of my country doesn't share your views, maybe you ought to change your views, instead of asking them to change theirs. How very "atheist."

 

Why would it list the things it wasn't founded upon? it also doesn't say it wasn't founded on islamic principles. So by your logic it must mean it was. Well done, You, And the 77% christian population, Now live in an islamic state founded on islamic principles. or do you want to rethink that abysmal attempt at an argument?

If america was founded on christian principles it would no doubt have mentioned it in the text of the constitution, And it doesn't.

 

I thought the country was established by Christians also.

I do not think biblical teaching is in the constitution

This is a great point, I am glad you think for yourself instead being lead down a path by anti Americans.

Great post

It seems that special interest minority groups have more of a say than the majority

 

I agree with stOx in principle, but I still don't really care.

 

"Our laws and our institutions must necessarily be based upon and embody the teachings of the Redeemer of mankind. It is impossible that it should be otherwise; and in this sense and to this extent our civilization and our institutions are emphatically Christian." - United States Supreme Court, 1892.


While making certain not to endorse any denomination of religion over another, the founders of this nation made it emphatically clear that the principles upon which this Nation was built are based squarely upon the Bible.

Virtually every one of the 55 writers and signers of the United States Constitution were members of various Christian denominations: 29 were Anglicans, 16 to 18 were Calvinists, 2 were Methodists, 2 were Lutherans, 2 were Roman Catholic, 1 lapsed Quaker and sometimes Anglican, and 1 open deist--Dr. Franklin who attended every kind of Christian worship, called for public prayer, and contributed to all denominations.

George Mason is called the father of the Bill of Rights, for he insisted that the first ten amendments be added to the Constitution. The purpose for such an addition? "The laws of nature are the laws of God, whose authority can be superseded by no power on earth," Mason said.

James McHenry was a member of the Continental Congress, a state legislator, a soldier, and a signer of the Constitution...as well as the president of the first Bible Society in Baltimore. McHenry stated:

Neither...let it be overlooked, that public utility pleads most forcibly for the general distribution of the Holy Scriptures.

The doctrine they preach, the obligations they impose, the punishment they threaten, the rewards they promise, the stamp and image of divinity they bear, which produces a conviction of their truths, can alone secure to society, order and peace, and to our courts of justice and constitutions of government, purity, stability, and usefulness.



Charles Cotesworth Pinckney also signed the Constitution, and served as a delegate to the national Constitutional Convention and an author of the Constitution of South Caroline. Pinckney was a statesman, soldier, planter, a brigadier general and a candidate for President and Vice-President. Like the rest of the signers of the Constitution, he too recognized the Sovereignty of God:

"Blasphemy against the Almighty is denying his being or providence, or uttering contumelious reproaches on our Saviour Christ. It is punished, at common law by fine and imprisonment, for Christianity is part of the laws of the land."



And, for those who fear this sort of Law breeds intolerance or disrespect for others, Patrick Henry boldly declared:

It cannot be emphasized too strongly that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded assylum, prosperity and freedom of worship here.

Likewise, the Constitution of the United States was drafted so as to be in accordance with the Scriptures, to be the legal foundation of a republican form of government based on that model which God had ordained for the children of Israel. Indeed, Thomas Jefferson even suggested that the national seal be a portrayal of "the children of Israel in the wilderness, led by a cloud by day and a pillar of fire by night." Much of the Constitution and our American common law and organic law is also derived from the principles of the Magna Carta, which expressly forbade monarchial tyranny.

In accordance with the spirit of Liberty which motivated those Righteous men of Principle so many years ago,

We the members of the U.S. Taxpayers Party gratefully acknowledge the blessing of the Lord God as Creator, Preserver and Ruler of the Universe and of this Nation...

The U.S. Constitution established a republic under God, rather than a democracy.

In a republic governed by Constitutional law rooted in Biblical law,all life, liberty and property are safe because Law rules. - Preamble, USTP Platform

This material is authored by and expresses the views of Mich. USTP Web Coordinator and is not implied to be the official views of the U.S. Taxpayers Party.

http://www.shalomjerusalem.com/heritage/heritage17.html

 

Not by my read of their philosophies.

(Wiki)

This more or less squares with my understanding as well. People have confused Enlightenment, rationalist deism, for Christian theology, in many instances.

Azizny, the separation of Church and State - the "Wall of Separation" - was espoused by Thomas Jefferson, as I previously provided:

It is interesting to note that Jefferson, as a deist, was known to have excised the parts of the Bible that didn't square with his deist/rationalist beliefs.

At the heart of it, there isn't a single reference to god or divinity, much less the Bible, in the Constitution. The only reference to religion is in the no-establishment clause of the first amendment.

Abortion, capital punishment, prostitution - can you please elucidate your view of how these relate to the historical Christ's teachings?

 

So what, that's not what the topic of debate is about. This isn't about personal religious beliefs, but about the relationship between religion and the state.

One of the fundamental tenants of the American Revolution / Independence movement was the separation between the two because they knew that religion in the hands of the state would lead to tyranny.

Of course it should be removed from US banknotes.

Remember that this didn't appear on US notes until the 1950s.