Shot man not connected to bombing

From couple of posting above, don't you read?

Latest documents and photographs:

1- He did not run from the police.

2- He used his Tube pass to enter the station.

3- He had taken a seat on the train before being grabbed by an officer.

4- He was wearing a light jacket and not padded coat.

5- He was physically restrained when he was killed

6- it is suggested that intelligence operation was botched because an officer watching an apartment believed to be the hide out of one of the suspects in the abortive July 21 attack was "relieving himself"

7- Lethal force was not the only option since a few days later police used a Taser stun weapon to arrest Yasin Hassan Omar, one of the July 21 bombing suspects.

Source: Daily Telegraph

 

Sorry G, I dont buy it.

Police officers are not some bionic creation brought about in a science lab to kill innocent people. How do I know? My brother is a police officer in California and I consider him to be a normal human being who happened to choose a different field than I.

I just cannot buy into a media notion that a police officer approached a person and shot him in the head while he stood or sat in place making no movements at all. Thats just silly.

You can disagree with me, that is the beauty of being free.

 

First he wasn't in California.

Second, have you ever listen to Pink Floyd's "The Wall?" When you listen to it, listen to it, he's talking about the social engineering in England's school system, and the machine. Once you have, then think about what you said, and how it's totally unrelated to the issue.

NOTE: For some reason, I have my best understanding of the world when I'm totally wasted.

tom

 

So according to you London Metropolitan police gives out false information to discredit it's own officers.

Too bad Gtech is not here, otherwise he could have told us that London police is Muslim terrorist sympathizer, the same way that US senate, CIA and other agencies with uncomfortable facts are.

 

Didnt say he was, said my brother was.

Yes, many times. Listened to it while watching Alice in wonderland after a j. Whats your point?

 

Read for yourself. There's a nice photo of the denim jacket. Shame the guy wearing it is dead.
http://www.itn.co.uk/news/1677571.html

 

Moral of the story is:

If you have nothing to hide and you hear "police" dont be a dumbass, stay put and do what you are told.

nuff said.

 

A war monger response to this photo.

Do you think this proves anything? How do you know the dead guy didn't change his jacket after he was dead.
I am sure that the dead guy and photographer and news paper are Muslim terrorists and that is the reason he has denim jacket.
If he has a denim jacket, doesn't matter because he worships moon God and doesn't matter that he was not Muslim and was Christian because I know he got himself killed just to hurt American fight against terrorism and there fore he deserved to die.

It is sad that even after the facts are known, still some people try to blame the victim for getting himself killed.

 

That comment doeant hold much ground considering the fact that in other threads you seem to feel that those who cut off the heads of the innocent are also "victims".

 

Quote from rep with no name.

That is correct, and also a flaw in the system.

Funny how people try to protect those who disobey authority. What has this world come to?

Look folks, if everyone would just stop when told to stop these problems would not exist.

 

How do you stop in a sitting position on a seat?

 

Huh?

Who said anything about sitting in a seat? I am speaking in general.

nothing about sitting in a seat. Oh I see, you are grasping for another "gotcha" arent you?

 

It's ok. I forgive you.

 

Look, guys I am not even going to read anymore 'terrorist threads/ posts'

I have grown up in/ near stockwell tube station, I have known that station for 20 years - if anyone can say the same then feel free to argue.

I REGULARLY wear walkmans with wires sticking out etc... I also have LIVED and SHOPPPED in Tooting most of my life. I have never had political affiliations because anyone that thinks the republicans/ conservatives, labour/ democrats (thats the way it USED to be) are out for anything BUT themselves is fooling themselves...

I have seem the threads get nasty against Gworld - which again is bullshit. I dont care HOW articulate you are..

The facts are SIMPLE:
1. We CANT have the world being able to find the recipe anthrax/ atomic bomb online or beung held hostage by those that can.
2. We CANT have the whole world stealing every film, song and book that exists (piracy in china is at 90%)
3. The london bombings were BULLSHIT (my bro lives in kings x + my mum travels to stockwell tube VERY REGULARLY) - NO muslim benefitted AT ALL. So dont tell me I am a muslim sympathiser - I DONT CARE - I have my own problems! I know what these areas are like FOR REAL.
4. Explain David Kelly, De mendoza, Flying the binladens home, cheney and rumsfeld, Murchdoch, hamid kahzi. Northern Alliance (the group formally known as the raping and pillaging mujahadjin)
5. Gtech + mia - no offence your arguments are very articulate and conclusive - BUT they are based on people that READ what they hear. - I can clearly see they are US centric and NOT based on what the rest of the world thinks.
6. I do NOT know a SINGLE person in the UK that thinks the war in ANYWAY is legitimate. in France I know 1 person, in switzerland I know NOONE. - You may call me a liberal - but if that is the case you are foolish.
7. My best friend OWNS a shop that sells 10 different papers - I read them ALL daily _ I have seen EXACTLY the same articles across MANY of them. I have seen reports of events I have attended MISCONSTRUED (i actually mean falsified) - Do your research and find out WHO owns the papers.
8. I respect your right to have an opinion - but like you fought against AC. you are UNWILLING to have an open mind - I DO! Gworld wants everyone to live in peace (which cant work either). I am no Leftie either.
9. I dont have anything against ANYONE - I love people in the US, on the whole for their optimistic attitude - hence I want to spend some time there.
10. I try NOT to comment on all the speculation you guys say. I have been watching this situation for 15 years now you really need to see the WHOLE picture.
10. Gworld got slaughtered in the 'other' terrorism thread - I may not be as articulate in typing as you two BUT I know I can SHOW you where this is clearly a mess.
11. My dissertation (at uni in 2000/2001 was based on the future of the world - because these thing were obvious to me then and now have just got worse) -
12. I have 0 polictical affiliation - because for example in th UK: you can decide ANYONE can have ANY role in government (today im health sec. tom im defence) - techincally in the UK you can win parliament with about 700 votes. - WHAT THE HELL IS A CABINET RESHUFFLE - I would NEVER do this to my company as Im sure most of you wouldnt. Holidays for the whole summer for the government???
13. I find ALL your arguments are POINT SCORING - and I tell you what.. if ANY of my family was MURDERED by a US Soldier/ Muslim Fundementalist - then I will do my BEST to wipe whoever's fault it was OFF the face of the planet.
14. As I said before, I have LIVED in tooting and been on the tube MANY times in Stockwell - so I KNOW what its actually like - NOT some News report. If they wanted to stop him they should have Shot him BEFORE he got on the bus. BUT THEY DIDNT - then they LIED about what happened - i have seen the police lie on MANY occasions.
15. MY sister lived less than 2 minutes away from the 'situation' - NOONE in South London trusts the police - as a DEGREE EDUCATED 28 year old I have been thrown on the bonnet AND HARRASSED by the police MANY times (with WHITE skin and DARK family - makes it even MORE common).
16. If ANYONE here knows anything about south London they will know we HATE the police 100% - not in some kind of NYC gangsta way - but just because we have seen SO MUCH corruption. I have evidence of this (ask my US clients (FROM SAN DIEGO) who were in London last month and got harassed by a bunch of jumped up policemen) trying to show their power. In the UK being a policeman is a well paid job that doesnt require too many skills or training...
18. Too many people here are talking like they ACTUALLY know what the situation is - and the truth is this: if you think ANYONEs shit smells different because of their religion then you are unfortunatley mistaken. I know muslim racists and white racists there is NO difference - the reasons the muslims are picked on (and fighting back) is because WE are IN THEIR COUNTRIES. - I would blow up the WHOLE of baghdad if the Iraqi army were patrolling london telling me what I can and cant do ) ken livingston is bad enough!
19. Althogh I am no longer there, I was brought up in the London underworld - I have see everything from yardies blowing each other away, to police harassing innocent people and pretty much everythin in between.
20. i didnt want to get involved in this kind of debate, but reading what I have been reading has ACTUALLY made me angry. _ I understand the need for security, but the way we are going is WAY beyond that - and in a large part thanks to the US Government policies (check when the first WORLD TRADE CENTRE (now known as the 'twin towers") bombing took place. - check binladens + rummy, lockhead and the rest's affiliation with each other.
21. I am 1/2 asian and 1/2 scottish - so BOTH sides of my family have been perscuted for 00000s years by the brits, BUT I am 100% brit and VERY PROUD.
22. I understand the need for STABILITY and as choice kill anyone that could harm my family + life before me, but we have got to the point where "rag heads' are being blamed when infact it is POLITICAL motivations are to blame (check donations to the republicans AND democrats by the SAME people)
21. I didnt want to have to make this kind of statement, but for weeks I have been reading about 'this blog' and that comment from many of you.
22. De menezes is NOT GUILTY of anything and I will now do my best to make sure I play a part in the downfall of those that lied and cheated the situation to suit their needs. I would never have even bothered until it was thrown on my doorstep.
23. The 7/7 bombings (as they are now called) were ALL in ethinic areas (i lived in Hackney, liverpool st and have visited Edgeware rd, russel square thousands of times). - you could NOT find an easier place to kill muslims and ethnic minorites in the UK.
24. Its been easy for you to pick on Gworld who just cares what happens to other - I DONT. - but try any polictical arugeument on the situation with me
(just because I tried NOT to get involved, doesnt meant I dont care or see..)

The facts are this:
I have chinese, french, swiss, engish, us, iranian, german, catholic, jewish, agnostic (and much more) friends and family and all of these games have gone FAR TOO FAR - when YOUR sister blows herself up for her cause - then you will see a different side.

I wouldnt like to see ANYONE harmed AT ALL + I dont care WHAT political pesuasion you are. This shit has to stop NOW, because if someone I care about is harmed then payback will be on a scale WAY above and beyond what has been seen so far will happen and I am sure there are MILLIONS out there that feel the same.

All those that think they can stay "out' of the debate as as bad as those that made that blacks sit on the back of busses - to me standing by is as commiting the crime itself.

Show me ANYONE from the UK that disagrees with these principles... I doubt you will find more than a tiny percentage. (if you are from the UK make your point here and now..)

The ONY country that thinks what is going on is right is the US.. and even then only a SMALL %. Africans, Indians, french, germans, dutch, russians, Irish, s americans, canadians, japanese, chinese, danish, finnish, swedish, mongolians, italians - NOONE Agrees with what is going on. The USA used to be THE most popular country in the world by a million miles - now I know Americans are hated the world over - the worst thing is that it is NOT their fault at all..the decision of a few has tainted 250 million people. If you think what I say has personal motivations against the US then you are mistaken (read my other 2000 posts here and you will see).

The rest of the world was holding their breath and praying that Bush didnt get voted in at the last US election and ANYONE outside the US will tell you that.

I DONT want to see payback for the US in 5 years from the rest of the world as they techniclogically catch up. But that is exactly what is going to happen according to the impression I get from people.

 

I am sure in 20 years time when the debate is not as hot as today, the majority of American will say that they didn't know what was happening. The same as people in Nazi Germany or Americans when Japanese-Americans were arrested during WWII, during Joe McCarthy witch hunt against American citizens or Civil liberty violations against Blacks in South. Some of the same people who are quite today, will also later claim that they were fighting against it.

 

I would have been willing to accept the shooting of this innocent man as a tragic mistake before all the other details came to light. I would have thought that if the intial report was true that any sane man who pumped 7 bullets into an innocent man's brain would have enough guilt to carry for the rest of his life.

Since the facts have come to light though, I wonder if this poor man was shot because of his TAN! How ridiculous is that? A brown-skinned man in the subway - OMG! Shoot the bugger! Perhaps somebody had to die in a hail of bloody bullets to ease the pressure? I doubt we will ever know.

Whatever happened, the fault does not really lie with the shooter. It is in poor co-ordination or poor management. But why don't you guys who are defending the shooting of Menendez see that? It is not a question of lynching the man who pulled the trigger but of finding out what went wrong and making sure it does not happen again.

 

Assuming that the officer in question is not a psychopath that just wanted to kill some one, I also feel sorry for him that he made a such a mistake, but mistake does not justify a killing. People make mistakes every day like having one too many drinks but when they kill some one as result then they are punished.
To do nothing and just ignore this case will send a wrong message to the society and justifies further terrorist actions when we show by our actions that is OK to kill a dark skin man but it is wrong to kill whites.
The best solution is to be open and honest about the whole thing, admit the mistakes and identify every one involved and send them to courts to be judged by the law and be punished fairly and according to the law.
Only by showing respect toward the law and advocating that all people independent of race, religion, political affiliation or if they are police or terrorist are equal in front of the law, we can send the right message.

 

I completely agree with the notion "mistake doesn't justify a killing," for obvious reasons: isn't the law system designed to prevent mistakes in the first place? The problem is that we are talking about two different kinds of mistakes here.

One mistake is the ones that is either done deliberately to sabotage the system for one's owe benefit or agenda, including killing for vengeance, or killing for vengeance.

Another kind of mistake would be a design flaw of the law system itself. Like how OJ Simpson got off the hook.

Now this cop in London business gets a bit complicated (for the discussion's sake, maybe), because it is stuck between the two categories above... or is it? Here are some of the clarifications I think we need, some definition on certain concepts.

1) One cop make a mistake doesn't mean the entire legal system is wrong.

I read a lot of the posts concerning how the commonwealth of England is supposedly being suppressed by the government because a policeman has killed an innocent man. Well, I don't see EVERY policeman in England starting any kind of killing spree yet, and I honestly doubt that would ever happen. Come on guys, don't panic.

2) The legal system is good doesn't mean all the cops are perfect, nor does it grant them the automatic rights to justify all of their actions.

Yes it is true that someone might have spoiled the soup quite a bit, and we need to recognize the fact that saying things such as "our laws are there to protect us so let the cops do their job" would be just as ridicules. It has become obvious that the policemen screwed up. I could be backing a car and hit a midget (how am I supposed to see him, really?), but the fact remains that he died not only because he stood there like an idiot, but also because I backed my car on him. And it is just as true that he would still be alive if I didn't back my car. Did he have to die? No. Was he dead? Yes. Then one of us got a problem.

Did the policeman shot that guy to death? Yes. Did he have to die? No. Not to mention this "execution style" thing I kept hearing about. Not only did this cop back without looking, some even suggested that he rammed the dude behind his car several times. and it might have been on purpose!


The moral is, don't lose faith of your government if you want to go through the crisis of terrorism, but keep an watchful eye on it. We all know very well that people on top of the pyramid tend to look at things differently, simply because they have a different, better or worse, view of the world. Plus they eat their food with one extra ingredient we usually lack: power. All these could have turned their head a little dizzy and they might not really know what they are doing. You could be doing yourself a big favor by supporting your government, unite under one banner when the need of fending these terrorists is dire, or you could throw yourself into a pit of trouble by helping your government making stupid laws and increase its power over everything because there is now an excuse.

The bottom line is: Stay in the middle. Cops are not evil, nor are the system. They are merely human. Give them credit for what they do, but have your eggs and tomatoes ready when they bashed the wrong guy.

 

My faith was lost in them, when they couldn't properly cover it up. I mean they had the lies doing their work (even discrediting the eye witnesses), but they forgot to distroy the physical evidence, (camera footage).

I'm guessing they will not make that mistake twice, but then I have no faith.

tom