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Running a Directory as a full time Business

Discussion in 'Directories' started by JamieG, Apr 17, 2008.

  1. Event_King

    Event_King Guest

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    #61
    It depends on what we are talking about here, as this thread seems to be about 'general businesses', so many to choose from, and to say they all don't make daily sales - why you couldn't prove they don't.

    But I walk into businesses on a daily basis, whether they be Pubs, Off-licences, Retail shops, Gyms etc, and I see the public hand over cash - so there's my proof - where's yours to say that they don't. Or how do all these businesses pay for the building rent every month, if they don't take money huh!

    I know one thing, and that's directories don't make daily sales - they don't get enough traffic for the conversions to take place, and people just don't buy services like that, that easily. Search engines, now that is a different thing altogether, and is more of a 'mass advertising' service, with big reputations to draw advertisers in, so they do make daily sales in probably £10,000 units a go, - PPC would be bought everyday with punters adding to their accounts. But directories, no way do they operate in the same way - a totally different service thus don't make daily sales except perhaps with the exception of 3 major players, Yell, Reed, and Haymarket.

    I don't know the publishing industry, yeah whatever.

    Sometimes I think people want to start conflict to make themselves sound important, but they won't be catching me out, I know too much. :)
     
    Event_King, Apr 19, 2008 IP
  2. swedal

    swedal Notable Member

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    #62
    It is easy enough to prove that all businesses don't make daily revenue - mine does not. Not talking about my directory.

    If I had a single sale every day - only counting business days mind you - my annual gross would be somewhere in the neighborhood of $1.8 million.

    I do ok, but I don't do $1.8 mil in gross annual commissions and not sure I want to :)
     
    swedal, Apr 19, 2008 IP
  3. Artifexus

    Artifexus Guest

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    #63
    Certain businesses won't make daily sales, and still do just fine. Some homebuilders don't sell 365 homes a year, or remodelers, 365 remodeling jobs a year. It doesn't mean they're not successful or viable.

    Your point is less about daily sales, I think, and more that a directory is very rarely a full-time income. I would tend to agree with that.
     
    Artifexus, Apr 19, 2008 IP
  4. an0n

    an0n Prominent Member

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    #64
    I've read a little bit of the thread and although you are referring to us 'directory' owners, I've always wondered about the 'script' owners. :evilgrin: (are they claiming business legitimacy or doing naughty IRS things) hehe...

    Things that make you go hummmmm
     
    an0n, Apr 19, 2008 IP
  5. contactusa

    contactusa Active Member

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    #65
    I spoke to PayPal a few months ago and was told that they do not report to the IRS at the end of the year. However I think this information could be inaccurate. In any case, if they do report or they will at some point, those of you guys who do not declare their income from directories or whatever that you are selling using PayPal, at some point might be really f.....d.

    Let's say you made, $10K during the year. They money, most likely, was transferred to your personal accounts. If audited by Uncle Sam, and he finds the underreporting, the penalties and interest will eliminate ALL your net profits. Trust me on this. I have a friend who paid $250K in penalties, interest and had to do 8 months on top of this.

    If you ask me? Not worth it. Declare the income, deduct your expenses and be happy that you're paying taxes - because that means that you ARE making money.
     
    contactusa, Apr 20, 2008 IP
    JamieG likes this.
  6. Event_King

    Event_King Guest

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    #66
    well yeah, I thought that's what this thread was about.
     
    Event_King, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  7. JamieG

    JamieG Banned

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    #67
    I can't speak for others an0n but the phpLynx script owner is definitely legitimate, I do suspect I know where your coming from and where you were aiming, or at least hope I do. :evenevillergrin:

    Here it is in sum total. Every directory owner that sets up their directory as a business and promotes it as such in any way whatsoever as a business, then makes money by selling links or reviews is legally compelled to tell certain authorities such as the IRS what they are up to. (different laws for different Countries have differing laws, I only checked out Europe, USA, Asia, and Canada) for obvious reasons, (deeper papua new guinea) were excluded. They haven't got broadband yet :D

    A few here openly claim to be business's employing X number of staff blah blah blah, a few boast of making a fortune in submissions and for design work etc all thinking they are excluded from paying taxes but they aren't. Some of you might remember the e-bay issue when seller got caught on to, the ones making a killing were soon pulled up and were warned on this http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/6354003.stm. and http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/taxes/2007-03-05-tax-gap-usat_N.htm are simple examples.

    In short, the reason I asked is as I was doing reviews of directories, (I've got some almost ready to post) I had someone do two types of checks on them to help me, one did a full SEO check the other does background checks on them) I was going to use this info to give a detailed analysis which no other review bothers to do. I saw this problem of the potential business and tax issue etc and decided against posting that kind of thing at the moment, instead choosing to consult you guys first.

    Hope that clears the reason for my question.

    @SilkySmooth; Your phone number isn't working, or when the girl answered she then turned it off?

    @Mhamdi; I found it interesting that the corperation number you gave led me to http://sec.edgar-online.com/2000/05/15/16/0000950152-00-004172/Section2.asp and on checking your other details they all appeared to be false?

    Where exactly did you say you were registered as a business? I can find out but you can make it a whole lot quicker for me. ;)
     
    JamieG, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  8. Event_King

    Event_King Guest

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    #68
    Quote from BBC site


    The VAT threshold for the UK is now £64'000, so you don't have to pay VAT, unless profits have reached £64k.

    BTW, everybody in the uk has to pay national insurance - period. That means if you make no profit, it has to be paid every 3 months - it's illegal if it's not paid!!!!! I found this out last week, when I applied for Self employed status:

    My Contributions account letter reads as so:


    What happens if NI isn't paid:

    A debt collection agency is sent out to collect the contributions
    Court Action can be taken
     
    Event_King, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  9. pipes

    pipes Prominent Member

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    #69
    In the UK, if your earnings are low you can apply for a certificate so that your exempt from NI payments, less than $4k something, around about that figure, and you just notify them once your earnings increase to the point of needing to pay.

    It is suggested though to carry on (if you can) contributing voluntarily to keep it topped up.

    I hope that anyone making a fuss about tax, NI and vat, considering that it varies from country to country are actually above board theirselves, otherwise you look like a fool pointing the finger at other people.

    Also what has this got to do with the directory forum, shouldn't it be discussed in general business or something else?

    Once again everyone poking their noses into other peoples business, why not just take care of your own?

    For the record and any big talkers ready to get excited and reply with nonsense, im in the UK, received my pack on 10th April from HM revenue and Customs and im registered as self employed and my work and earning are full time online, not that its anybodys business frankly.

    Il be completing mine online as its easier.

    If your in the UK its the Inland Revenue, not the IRS so it sounds weird talking about US tax terms when your a UK citizen.

    Honestly, does anybody just work on their sites anymore? why the constant bickering? will it ever stop?

    Its sunday, the day of rest, lets give it a rest now.
     
    pipes, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  10. enQuira

    enQuira Peon

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    #70
    Your detective skills are not that good after all.
    Here is a more credible link than the one you gave
    http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/cgi-bin/sc_mrksv/corpdir/dataOnline/corpns_re?company_select=6889867

    Do I need to prove anything else? :eek:
     
    enQuira, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  11. SilkySmooth

    SilkySmooth Well-Known Member

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    #71
    Not had any calls today and the wife (the only girl currently in the house) hasn't taken any either so not sure you have the right number.

    Which number are you using and where did you get it?

    I could walk into several myself, such as my local web designers office, or my local auto repair garage and know for a fact that they don't make daily sales. And I know this because I have worked in both, so there is my proof.

    Again your talking based on your own inexperience and not on the market as a whole. To claim that no other directories make daily sales is just flat out wrong because you can't possibly know that. I am no Yell, Reed nor Haymarket yet I have made daily sales in the past through my directories.

    I am not currently making daily sales, because the market is flat at the moment so I had to go back a few months to find a week where I made sales on every day from Saturday - Friday...

    [​IMG]

    Or maybe it's because your to arrogant to admit that there are just people out there who know a tad more than you. Take the above evidence how you like, but the fact is that you don't know this market as well as you think you do.

    I'm not in the UK at the moment but I got my pack from HMRC too :(

    Like you I will be completing it online... I did my first three on paper and then moved to Brazil so the online version became the easier option. When it came time to do my fourth (the first online) it was like a totally different system, couldn't beleive how easy it was.

    Jamie, if you are reviewing any of mine then please get in touch via PM as there is a lot going on with my fringe projects, changing hands, etc. So please get in touch for the correct info if required.

    Otherwise let me know on that contact number.
     
    SilkySmooth, Apr 20, 2008 IP
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  12. an0n

    an0n Prominent Member

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    #72
    @contactusa:
    And that my friend, is why I report all earnings. Ha! We've spoken about this a few times on the phone. ;)

    @JamieG:
    :evilgrin: yes :evilgrin: ... (hint)the penalties would put it out of business. trust me! I know the figures.
     
    an0n, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  13. Event_King

    Event_King Guest

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    #73
    Exactly my point - you even admit you had to search for a week where you made sales every day. So you don't make sales every day, yet many directory operators think their Richard Branson - you don't make that much judging by your paypal records. But it's probably about the correct level for a general directory and I'm shocked you made even that much - so, it's not bad.



    I don't make sales every day, but I did say that directories don't, didn't I......


    Well, just some of my figures look more impressive than yours:


    17 Dec. 2007 Payment From******* Completed Details £40.00 GBP -£1.56 GBP £38.44 GBP

    9 Nov. 2007 Payment From ******* Completed Details £40.00 GBP -£1.56 GBP £38.44 GBP

    20 Jul. 2007 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    12 Jun. 2007 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    4 Jun. 2007 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    26 Mar. 2007 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP




    30 Mar. 2006 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    29 Mar. 2006 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    21 Mar. 2006 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    21 Mar. 2006 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    21 Mar. 2006 Payment From ******* Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    28 Feb. 2006 Payment From ****** Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    27 Jan. 2006 Payment From ****** Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP

    27 Jan. 2006 Payment From ****** Completed Details £20.00 GBP -£0.88 GBP £19.12 GBP



    looks like I made more than you.... but then again I'm not an amateur webmaster, so that's why I do better than most. That's not arrogance, just a fact of life. :)

    Good luck with your directory ok :)
     
    Event_King, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  14. Spider-Man

    Spider-Man Banned

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    #74
    They don't look more impressive. I'd much rather have SilkySmooth's income shown from the paypal screenshot where revenue for 7 days was only slightly behind what you made in over an entire MONTH.

    Really, why make claims then post stats to contradict yourself?:confused:
     
    Spider-Man, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  15. JamieG

    JamieG Banned

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    #75
    Who said I was a detective? I'm smart though, I got you to show me what I couldn't find. :D I can now work on that with the relevant IRS departments and see if you've been a good boy. ;) Kidding, but you get my point.

    @SilkySmooth, The phone number attached to your domain details. Is it wrong?

    @An0n; LMAO; sold three copies if I'm right. :D

    @Event_King; No disrespect here but you many not be amateur, but your stupid on this occasion, I'd never have shown my details to others. Why boast?> Not that those figures are that impressive.
     
    JamieG, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  16. Event_King

    Event_King Guest

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    #76
    2007 Paypal profits:

    Silkysmooth made £170.86

    EventKing made £153.36

    -- a difference of £17.50 woohoo lol, and that's your victory is it, a mere £17? :rolleyes:


    Silkysmooth only has 2 decent sales of £57.76, the rest are all under £7, and that's very poor for these amazing general directories. He may have just pipped me to the post, but I average £19.00 per sale, every sale, and he doesn't.

    My PayPal figures aren't my entire income, as I have many cheques for £100 and £450 per entry too. What he's made in profit is likely average for a general directory with few links and zero exposure, and with the fact he's competing with 100's perhaps 1000's of others - it's probably a pretty good result. But nothing compared to what my company takes so don't be so eager to ridicule others okay :eek:
     
    Event_King, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  17. Spider-Man

    Spider-Man Banned

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    #77
    HaHaHa. Sorry, I just rolled over and fell off my chair, so apologies for the slight delay in making a spontaneous reply.

    So you're telling me you'd rather have a business that does one £36500 order once a year than have a company that makes £100 a day? In the end, it gives the same result, but making much more consistent revenue gives the feeling of greater success.

    And, you don't think SilkySmooth makes earnings other than Paypal?

    Such public stupidity deserves to be ridiculed.
     
    Spider-Man, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  18. enQuira

    enQuira Peon

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    #78
    I suggest you don't waste your time and invest it in something worth it for you, your own projects may be ;)

     
    enQuira, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  19. Event_King

    Event_King Guest

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    #79
    Jaime G,

    He was the one who thought his Paypal statement would 'gut me' severely, but he underestimated me. Probably didn't think I could match him or something lol.

    It's all so serious isn't it lol.
     
    Event_King, Apr 20, 2008 IP
  20. Event_King

    Event_King Guest

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    #80
    SpideyMan,

    I don't care how the cash comes in, sorry but is that supposed to bring me down or something roflao. £100 per day is way more than most make doing a day job, that's £2000 a month and £24k a year. Yeah, I'll take that and thanks!

    What makes you think I give a stuff :confused: :D :rolleyes:
     
    Event_King, Apr 20, 2008 IP