See, that's the narrow-minded sort of perspective that prevents real progress on this and many other issues. You seem to take the stance that people either agree it must be all (your way) or they're saying to do nothing. In no way did I say we should do nothing. I said we should address the source of the problem and not waste so much time on the symptoms. If you cure the disease the symptoms will vanish too. Why do border-crossers come over? The vast majority do so for work and opportunities. Sure, there are a small number who smuggle drugs and have various other criminal motives as well, there are bad apples in every bunch, but the overwhelming majority are coming over for the employment opportunities that exist. If you address that problem, make it so unattractive for companies and families to employ illegals that they stop, the well of opportunities will dry up and the number of border-crossers will bottom out. The laws already exist to do this, they just aren't enforced. The mechanism to enforce them already exists, but isn't used. We don't need new legislation or new laughable construction projects like a fence. We need to simply make sure that we--as in Americans--follow the existing laws with regards to hiring undocumented workers and the problem would cease to be. But I understand the opposition to this approach, it would mean having to admit that we've been doing something wrong and we just don't like to do that here in America, it doesn't make us feel good about ourselves. So, instead we'd rather shift the focus to the border-crossers, and twist it into 'if they didn't come over we couldn't illegally hire them', that way it's not our fault.
guys if they make laws to punish employers, those same rich employers will stop contributing to whoever drafts the laws political campaigns
You don't think an open border is a symptom? If I was a doctor of the USA, I would say: Our ports and our borders are all really important. They are our layer of skin. I believe we caught roughly 20 people from the middle east crossing our southern border recently. What were they doing....*shrug* I realize the 9/11 people came from the Canadian border and some came through legal means, but this is where our 'immune system' comes in. The ones that came illegally got fake identities from a 7/11, where police routinual ignore the illegals....whom are in large numbers committing felonies by stealing indenties. I should know, because that's what happened to my sister. Because they get paid $5 dollars a day, but they can get paid $15-25 dollars an hour here. Quite enticing. Plus there's a free baby sitter here, called public school, where there kid might actually have a chance. Plus some want to take their land back. One only had to watch the uncensored LA march to see the prevalence in that belief. The Supreme court will be hearing a case where an employee claiming the Rico act will try to sue for compensation....in other words you're hiring illegals here in order to drive down wages. http://www.forbes.com/columnists/2006/04/25/mohawk-immigration-supreme-court-cx_lsz_0426mohawk.html These illegals would continue to come to areas where safe harbor would be granted e.g San Francisco, LA, New York, etc. San Francisco and LA officials have said outright that they would ignore immigration laws. If they couldn't get employeement there, they would go to Canada. That's what they do...they're everywhere in America now. It's not a hard decesion...hell-hole or some chance? Canada would bend-over. It's not that I don't think what you say is part of the solution, but an open border w/a third world is a problem (for many reasons). The best solution is both and hard pressure on Mexico to reform their government and Constitution. For the better part it isn't our fault. The federal government refueses to obey the laws they've put in place for us. No one is blaming the average American nor should they. All the blame rest on the illegal businesses, and our federal government.
Doesn't it just seem a little bit silly that we keep trying to address the side-effects but not the actual disease here? If American employers obeyed the laws and stopped providing opportunities of prosperity; now that would really reduce the number of border crossings and wouldn't be a short-term band-aid like the fence idea. And while we keep throwing the term "illegals" around, let's remember that American employers who provide them jobs are breaking the law too, start putting some of them behind bars and see how fast the opportunities for border crossers dry up. I have to agree with him here, and I'm surprised to see that his post has been completely ignored while the fence debate continues. And as for the drugs issue, I'm pretty sure that Mexicans aren't sneaking drugs into America so that they can sell them to other Mexicans. I imagine it would be quite a bit easier to simply stay home and do that. So who would be using all of these illegal drugs I wonder? JP
The disease is the Mexican government. Business sanctions will do so much...people aren't going back to Mexico till it changes. Stay in America and work for people on the streets or work for $5 dollars a day? Fairly easy chose, since $5 isn't a lot here. If anything it would make people in Mexico think twice about coming here. I would assume the illegals would venture to Canada.
We do have a reasonably high number of illegal immigrants here in Canada as well. Currently there is a noticeable percentage of the construction trades being populated by Portuguese people who have come over on a visitor's visa and simply stayed to work. The government has started to deport some of them, but some people are complaining about it because they are for filling important trade positions that most Canadians are simply unwilling to perform any more. Bricklaying and drywalling simply isn't something that most second-generation Canadians aspire to anymore, and as a result there is a critical shortage in these trades. I believe that Industry Canada is currently trying to cobble together a proposition for an amnesty in order to better integrate these people into our tax structure. JP
Every modern nation has this problem. My friends a second generation Portuguese, and admantlly against illegal immigration. He said Portugal is turning into a third-world nation...due to government, mass immigration, and the culture. After his last visit, he said he probably wouldn't go back, because he doesn't recognize it anymore. I don't believe that. There's a lot of American people working trades in constrution, as would many Canadians. It's the effect of mass illegal immigration that reduces wages, which makes others chose not to work for such wages....not because they're above it. In America we have a shortage in qualified helicopter pilots, which just means you offer higher wages and you try to get people trained to take the jobs. If anything, you need to immigrate some qualified people. But this is a proven need, not what I consider a fabricate problem. Did those industries experience huge increases in wages and costs?...if not, it's a fabricated issue.
A big Fence sounds good. Side note: And I also think they should enforce the laws against Sodomy... D
You guys know that if you do anything other then intercourse, with your wife, girlfriend its sodomy, right?
Because "we" means being a part of something bigger than yourself. As I recall, you hate America so much, you are planning to leave the country. Just as soon as you can find another country that is as safe, if not safer than America, that has a good economy, where you can get a good job fairly easily. I hear Iran is looking for nuclear engineers p.s. I'm still willing to buy your Ford Escort if it will help you raise the money needed
Actually it was quite effective in it's time. People still got through, but it virtually prevented the destruction of that culture. There's little doubt in my mind that the same would apply to the American culture...when it comes to it's current circumstance. Israel's wall is rather intimiditating, and I'd wager that other than their militant ground diggers...there's no one getting over it. Although most of it is bordered with fences...the one that the minutemen plan to design after. Chinese wall Israeli wall Israeli Security Fence