Ministry prepared to send lecturers to allay Islamophobia in the US

I am surprised. I was betting on you these days that at least you wouldn't bring the pride of belonging to some religion to denounce some cheap porn peddler who calls him a devout muslim. Was it necessary? I don't think you will let us believe that in your belief it's okay for non muslims to sell porn blatantly even though I am not the first person that supports pornography per se.

Or if you also believe that its a way of asserting muslim superiority, even if subconsciously, I hate to say it after all these days of following you but, it's wrong on your part.

 

O'Nation was just saying he didnt care to have a group w/ which he's associated represented by a blatant hypocrite.

That sentiment isn't religious in nature, and might be voiced by anyone in a similar situation.

 

Awesome quote -- and very nice use of the flashlight Rob!

 

Despite my agreement with you, I am still not in favor of making the mention of religion even if it is to stress a point as he did. I am sure that it will not change his impression one bit in my mind, but this practice has mostly led the abusers like menj and extremists to pose as holy cows just by uttering the islam supremacy over the rest of the world. example: menj's supporters in other threads.

Edit
* I never used religion inadvertently or consciously to prove anything even though I was sometimes sure that it was going to be condoned. I guess, for the sake of explaining, it's is similar to saying something like 'being a good Christian... or being somebody...' but don't you think that's exactly where the starting point of chauvinism lies in, particularly for those who want to be?

 

Interesting complaint. While Rob most certainly has it right in that I would not want the group I'm associated with to be labeled either hypocritical or hateful in nature(Both labels Menj's words regularly attached to Muslims), I find it hard to disparage any group of people for living a lifestyle they feel makes them better as a person, so long as that lifestyle doesn't impinge on your lifestyle. If your thing is helping the poor, or eating right, or staying fit, or working hard, I would have a hard time for disparage someone for not living up to a set values which are not shared by all(as if any single value was shared by 100% of the population of the planet). I do, however, feel justified in disparaging someone for not living up to the set of values they themselves claim to hold. Its called hypocrisy.

 

Here's a photo of some of the lecturers.

 

Nice ^-^;

This makes it even more awkward that he kept referring to the porn BS as his "porn empire". Lol.

 

Not a problem with it. My voice is against preferring to use religious tags for identification. Although what you said is way too far from being religious assertion, the statement could well have been something like "As an American or As an Indian..." which besides serving the purpose fully well also could help you drive home the values you represent (as a global person) because with that, you are more geographically identified than being otherwise. Plainly, you could say that you feel embarrassed by a hypocritical pornographer that swears by God and religion. Isn't this is the whole point we are debating through this thread?

 

Perhaps. I constantly hear the complaint that no Muslims speak out against this, no Muslims speak out against that. When people do not see publicly self identified Muslims speaking out against hypocrisy and other things that are obviously wrong, originating from would-be Muslims like Menj, it is taken as a silent endorsement of those activities. Tagging my comments with my religious affiliation helps to dispel stereotypes such as, "Muslims all support terrorism", or "Muslims are all hypocrites". I consider Muslims speaking out against insanity being spewed by would be Muslims to be the very best cure for Islamophobia in the US, and worldwide.

I watch people like Moreplayers, who remain silent as my Muslim brothers are butchered and tortured by Hamas, yet dedicate thread after thread complaining about less pressing inequities in Israel and I just cringe. It gives the impression Muslims will endorse, or at least tolerate, any heinous crime against Muslims, so long as they are committed by another Muslim, but any infraction by a non-Muslim will be met with outrage, threats of violence, and violence. Malaysia sends it's minister to allay Islamophobia in the US while people like Moreplayers and Menj are fostering it. As a Muslim, it makes me very sad.

 

They are not my brothers.

 

So you're not a Muslim ?

 

They Muslims murdered by Hamas are not your brothers?

How far are you from getting fitted for a suicide vest?

 

I agree with your first point completely; and understand your frustrations. Let me give you a few prominent muslims who dared fatwas for years against islamic hypocrisies.

Taslima Nasrin
Salman Rushdie

Aside of these two, A. P. J. Abdul Kalam stood for all that is recognized with humanity. he never once thought Islam was superior to other religions. He was equally eloquent and comfortable with Hindu scriptures as he did with Quran. I am all praise for him just because he is the most prominent of all living Indians that never considered religion as something crucial to good living.

There can be many names to add here and life of people like them inspire all of us if we believe humanity stays above all else and uppermost. Particularly APJ Abdul Kalam never took offense of people talking about quran or islam derogatorily because he always put humans above everything.

It's natural for all of us to feel it but that's how the world is now and is going to remain so for ever. We fear for life when muslims commit crimes against us. But defending ones religion either like you did or like the beasts are doing elsewhere hardly matter to an outsider who is at liberty to choose any of those two to react against you. So, can you imagine what you have triggered off? This is exactly why I took the example of Abdul Kalam for his was the best way of dousing off the fire, his was the most exemplary life to emulate in such examples. I am not a muslim but I regard him with highest esteem I had earlier reserved for Mahatma Gandhi.

It pains me greatly when Malaysia is privileged send missionaries to allay islamophobia at a time when it's impossible for Hindus to consider something like this to correct the history of either Swat Valley or Ram Janmabhoomi. But that's life. You've got to accept things in individual capacities and move on.

If I can suggest you, here is one thing that I would like to. Instead of policing menj and his group, take it on you to live a democratic life drawing from your experience, your education, your surrounding, good things from different religions and believe in god.

Added later

Just another example for what I pointed out to initially, right? If muslims elsewhere can become your brothers by default, can I assume that Hindus, Christians or Budhists in India also become your brothers automatically?

 

Ahh c'mon Alevoor you're spoiling all the fun out of Menji's ban .

 

No, not at all. In fact, I was missing all the action as I couldn't come online yesterday for a few hours.
That apart, I sensed how Obamanation was feeling with all that is going on and that was my bit.

 

I don't know enough about the other religions to say, but fwiw, yeah, that actually IS a tenet of the Christian faith. Religions have their good and bad points, but imposing a standard of treating others as you would yourself or a family member isnt one of them. If Christians behave as described in the New Testament they'd make pretty fair neighbors.

On a side-note - Shame so many of the plethora of Christian sects turned hardcore anti-alcohol (can ya tell I was raised "Southern Baptist"?). They'd be a lot more fun at parties if they'd remember that the namesake of the religion reportedly livened up a party by turning water into wine. The Baptist crowd has an aggravating habit of declaring The Book to be the literal and infallible word of God, then ignoring the parts that don't fit with the Baptist doctrine, which has evolved into a higher place in their hearts than the book upon which it's based.

There's a statement in the OT that's referenced again as a problem in the NT (in both of the first two books,Matthew & Mark). The verse in Isaiah tells the people:

Isaiah was talking to Jews, Matthew and Mark were quoting Jesus (talking to his own followers, thus it was directed to Christians), but as pointed out by O'Nation that's a pretty universal problem. Some get a kick outta being seen as bastions of faith while selectively ignoring tenets of that same faith. No religion has the corner on the market with hypocrisy, and I applaud O'Nations point. Nobody wants to be tarred with the brush of hypocrisy, and when one person clearly isnt practicing what they preach it is used against others in the same group.

I'm assured by some Muslims that their faith doesn't remotely coincide with the beliefs of guys that scream Muslim epithets while blowing up innocent civilians. The more moderates speak out against members of their religion that misuse their religion, the better. Can't bring myself to criticize them for doing so.

 

Is it just me or has DP had intermittent availability for the last 24 hours....

 

I do. But that was yesterday.

 

That happens sometimes when you ban Muslims...