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McDar Experiment

Discussion in 'General Marketing' started by compar, Apr 5, 2004.

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  1. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

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    #2181
    NEW PAGE UPDATE:
    *Google PR/Backlink update
    **33 Active DCs(6 New DC Found)**


    The "New Page" sleeping-bags.htm
    04/07/2004 "New Page" went live

    Search for "Sleeping Bags"
    _____________
    NOTE: Due to size constraints, the entire report can no longer appear in a post.
    You can view the entire report here... Complete Report
    ________________
    Last 10 days

    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/05/2005 [10 DCs #29, 15 DCs #30, 8 DCs #31]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #29 allinanchor: #6 --9/06/2005 [14 DCs #29, 7 DCs #30, 12 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #29 allinanchor: #6 --9/07/2005 [6 DCs #28, 27 DCs #29]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/08/2005 [10 DCs #29, 23 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/09/2005 [21 DCs #30, 2 DCs #31, 10 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/10/2005 [7 DCs #29, 13 DCs #30, 9 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/11/2005 [14 DCs #29, 16 DCs #30, 3 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/12/2005 [5 DCs #28, 9 DCs #29, 12 DCs #30, 7 DCs #31]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/13/2005 [14 DCs #28, 3 DCs #29, 16 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/14/2005 [9 DCs #28, 17 DCs #29, 7 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #11 allinanchor: #3 --9/15/2005 [All DCs #11]**(Allinanchor #3 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #3 --9/16/2005 [29 DCs #10, 4 DCs #11]**(Allinanchor #3 on All DC)
    Postion #21 allinanchor: #5 --9/17/2005 [14 DCs #12, 19 DCs #21]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #20 allinanchor: #5 --9/18/2005 [5 DCs #12, 28 DCs #20]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #5 --9/19/2005 [10 DCs #10, 9 DCs #12, 10 DCs #19, 4 DCs #20]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #3 --9/20/2005 [10 DCs #9, 23 DCs #10]**(Allinanchor #2 on 6 DCs, #3 on 27 DCs)
    Postion #20 allinanchor: #5 --9/21/2005 [8 DCs #18, 18 DCs #20, 7 DCs #21]**(Allinanchor #4 on 10 DCs, #5 on 23 DCs)
    Postion #19 allinanchor: #4 --9/22/2005 [4 DCs #18, 10 DCs #19, 7 DCs #22, 4 DCs #38, 8 DCs #97]**(Allinanchor #4 on 17 DCs, #5 on 16 DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/23/2005 [5 DCs #34, 16 DCs #35, 4 DCs #36, 8 DCs #37]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/24/2005 [4 DCs #33, 11 DCs #34, 18 DCs #35]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/25/2005 [14 DCs #33, 12 DCs #34, 7 DCs #35]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #36 allinanchor: #5 --9/26/2005 [25 DCs #36, 6 DCs #110, 2 DCs #209]**(Allinanchor #5 on 31 DCs, #6 on 2 DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/27/2005 [4 DCs #33, 8 DCs #34, 12 DCs #35, 9 DCs #36]]**(Note: Allinanchor #4 on 8 DCs, #5 on 25 DCs)
    Postion #32 allinanchor: #5 --9/28/2005 [23 DCs #32, 10 DCs #34]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #31 allinanchor: #5 --9/29/2005 [19 DCs #31, 12 DCs #32, 4 DCs #33]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #32 allinanchor: #5 --9/30/2005 [18 DCs #32, 15 DCs #33]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #28 allinanchor: #5 --10/01/2005 [28 DCs #28, 4 DCs #29, 2 DCs #32]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #27 allinanchor: #6 --10/02/2005 [28 DCs #27, 5 DCs #28]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #27 allinanchor: #6 --10/03/2005 [22 DCs #27, 11 DCs #28]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)

    Postion #26 allinanchor: #6 -10/04/2005 [10 DCs #24, 4 DCs #25, 19 DCs #26]** (Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)

    Cache Date: Sept 23, 2005 20:43:17 GMT
    _____________________________________________________
    note: these pages are found using ( site:www.compar.com +sleeping Bags )
    number of Bob's PR6 and PR5 links found:

    143 - 8/29/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    140 - 9/05/2005
    138 - 9/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    140 - 9/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    152 - 9/28/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________
    SEMrush
    note: this page is found using ( site:www.ski-france-ok.com +sleeping Bags )
    Foxy's PR5 and two PR4s
    0 - 4/20/2004
    3 - 5/04/2004
    Unchanged from previous date
    2 - 6/17/2004
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________
    Bob and Foxy added link Sleeping Bags to their sig files on this forum 5/06/2004
    Results for - ( site:forums.digitalpoint.com +sleeping bags )
    Note:Foxy & Bob removed links from Signatures - 6/11/2004
    4060 - highest links reported 6/12/2004
    Note:Foxy & Bob replaced links in Signatures - 7/21/2004
    Note:Foxy & Bob removed links in Signatures - 11/16/2004

    1090 - 8/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1100 - 8/25/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1110 - 8/28/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1120 - 8/31/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1100 - 9/20/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________

    Caryl and Foxy added link Sleeping Bags to their sig files on the SEO Chat forum 5/11/2004
    Results for - ( site:forums.seochat.com +sleeping bags )
    Note:Foxy removed links in Signatures - 11/16/2004

    132 - 8/26/2005
    123 - 8/27/2005
    112 - 8/28/2005
    100 - 8/29/2005
    85 - 8/30/2005
    81 - 8/31/2005
    79 - 9/01/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    91 - 9/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    156 - 9/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________

    *August 18, 2004 - (10) Project Supporters donated Links from 13 different IP addresses to page. Additional info will be added as it comes in.

    Total links found by using site:www.domainname.tld Researched daily by Foxy

    Daily Totals Report (click to see full report)

    606 - 1/29/2005
    457 - 1/29/20052/6/2005[/B](148 lost links from one IP) [/b]
    251 - 2/12/2005
    261 - 3/03/2005
    273 - 3/18/2005
    275 - 3/19/2005
    508 - 4/09/2005
    560 - 5/20/2005
    627 - 6/14/2005
    536 - 6/25/2005
    584 - 7/11/2005
    631 - 7/29/2005
    15,785 - 8/19/2005
    __________________

    Dec 17, 2004 - digitalpoint's "Patient" Added link to 116 different urls
    (Located on 3 different IPs within same class 3 IP address Address - 217.36.188.*)

    Jan 20, 2005 - (moved all urls to dif server - now all 116 are on same IP + changed from Coldfusion to Java)

    Number Indexed by Google

    40 - 12/23/2004
    48 - 12/24/2004
    107 - 12/30/2004
    115 - 1/2/2005
    116 - 1/21/2005
    108 - new urls & 70 old urls- 1/31/2005
    __________________

    PR/Backlink info

    ~ April 22 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    143 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ March 3 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    113 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ February 3 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    260 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ January 1 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    268 Backlinks - see Table of Links reported
    ___________
    ~ December 16 Update ~ (only Backlinks updated in this update)
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR6
    155 Backlinks
    (Details can be found for this and the following in Complete Report)
    ___________

    "A nice tool that Shawn didn't write -" DISCUSSION
    __________________
    Note:Google API has page at #24

    [​IMG]
     
    mcdar, Oct 4, 2005 IP
    SEMrush
  2. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

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    #2182
    Dave,

    Can you be more specific regarding the searches you did.

    Thanx
     
    mcdar, Oct 4, 2005 IP
  3. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #2183
    Sorry I can't spend more time on this. My own business needs lots of time.

    Points I was considering are as follows:

    1. Google made some algo changes this year.
    2. I think the algo changes have included large areas that have to do w/site and bl relevancy. Others define this better and more precisely than I.
    3. Some have observed that the initial bls cited in MSN and/or Y tend to be "more important" or more releant bls. If this is so possibly these "themed/more relevant bls are more important. If that is true than possibly themed bls add more weight to allinachor and serps.

    4. In either MSN or Y the initial bls for the experiment page were ones from the experiment. None of these are themed sleeping bags/camping/ etc.

    5. Some of the other sites listed in the top ten for the search sleeping bags are themed/sleeping bag relevant.

    If I had more time I was going to search to a large extent along these lines...and look at some other factors re: the experiment page being knocked around in G's rankings periodically this year...while other sites have not suffered this.

    Just an idea. BTW, the tool I referenced does not seem to rank bls in the same way as Y and MSN sometimes do.

    Dave
     
    earlpearl, Oct 4, 2005 IP
  4. compar

    compar Peon

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    #2184
    Just so I'm perfectly clear, your assumption is that the inbound links reported by Yahoo and MSN are actually listed in the order of importance. Is that correct?
     
    compar, Oct 4, 2005 IP
  5. Smyrl

    Smyrl Tomato Republic Staff

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    #2185
    The assumption is that the inbound links reported by Yahoo and MSN are actually listed in the order of importance looks highly improbable to me. I just looked at MSN. The first listed backlink to a club specializing in Texas Music Concerts was a Beginning Algebra Tutorial Page. Assure you Music Site has better backlinks that an ad on the tutorial page. Links look better ordered according to perceived value on Yahoo but how does a French Antique site show up in position two?

    Shannon
     
    Smyrl, Oct 4, 2005 IP
  6. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

    Messages:
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    #2186
    NEW PAGE UPDATE:
    *Google PR/Backlink update
    **33 Active DCs(6 New DC Found)**


    The "New Page" sleeping-bags.htm
    04/07/2004 "New Page" went live

    Search for "Sleeping Bags"
    _____________
    NOTE: Due to size constraints, the entire report can no longer appear in a post.
    You can view the entire report here... Complete Report
    ________________
    Last 10 days

    Postion #29 allinanchor: #6 --9/06/2005 [14 DCs #29, 7 DCs #30, 12 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #29 allinanchor: #6 --9/07/2005 [6 DCs #28, 27 DCs #29]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/08/2005 [10 DCs #29, 23 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/09/2005 [21 DCs #30, 2 DCs #31, 10 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/10/2005 [7 DCs #29, 13 DCs #30, 9 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/11/2005 [14 DCs #29, 16 DCs #30, 3 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/12/2005 [5 DCs #28, 9 DCs #29, 12 DCs #30, 7 DCs #31]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/13/2005 [14 DCs #28, 3 DCs #29, 16 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/14/2005 [9 DCs #28, 17 DCs #29, 7 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #11 allinanchor: #3 --9/15/2005 [All DCs #11]**(Allinanchor #3 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #3 --9/16/2005 [29 DCs #10, 4 DCs #11]**(Allinanchor #3 on All DC)
    Postion #21 allinanchor: #5 --9/17/2005 [14 DCs #12, 19 DCs #21]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #20 allinanchor: #5 --9/18/2005 [5 DCs #12, 28 DCs #20]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #5 --9/19/2005 [10 DCs #10, 9 DCs #12, 10 DCs #19, 4 DCs #20]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #3 --9/20/2005 [10 DCs #9, 23 DCs #10]**(Allinanchor #2 on 6 DCs, #3 on 27 DCs)
    Postion #20 allinanchor: #5 --9/21/2005 [8 DCs #18, 18 DCs #20, 7 DCs #21]**(Allinanchor #4 on 10 DCs, #5 on 23 DCs)
    Postion #19 allinanchor: #4 --9/22/2005 [4 DCs #18, 10 DCs #19, 7 DCs #22, 4 DCs #38, 8 DCs #97]**(Allinanchor #4 on 17 DCs, #5 on 16 DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/23/2005 [5 DCs #34, 16 DCs #35, 4 DCs #36, 8 DCs #37]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/24/2005 [4 DCs #33, 11 DCs #34, 18 DCs #35]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/25/2005 [14 DCs #33, 12 DCs #34, 7 DCs #35]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #36 allinanchor: #5 --9/26/2005 [25 DCs #36, 6 DCs #110, 2 DCs #209]**(Allinanchor #5 on 31 DCs, #6 on 2 DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/27/2005 [4 DCs #33, 8 DCs #34, 12 DCs #35, 9 DCs #36]]**(Note: Allinanchor #4 on 8 DCs, #5 on 25 DCs)
    Postion #32 allinanchor: #5 --9/28/2005 [23 DCs #32, 10 DCs #34]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #31 allinanchor: #5 --9/29/2005 [19 DCs #31, 12 DCs #32, 4 DCs #33]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #32 allinanchor: #5 --9/30/2005 [18 DCs #32, 15 DCs #33]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #28 allinanchor: #5 --10/01/2005 [28 DCs #28, 4 DCs #29, 2 DCs #32]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #27 allinanchor: #6 --10/02/2005 [28 DCs #27, 5 DCs #28]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #27 allinanchor: #6 --10/03/2005 [22 DCs #27, 11 DCs #28]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #26 allinanchor: #6 --10/04/2005 [10 DCs #24, 4 DCs #25, 19 DCs #26]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)

    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 -10/05/2005 [9 DCs #27, 11 DCs #28, 13 DCs #30]** (Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)

    Cache Date: Sept 23, 2005 20:43:17 GMT
    _____________________________________________________
    note: these pages are found using ( site:www.compar.com +sleeping Bags )
    number of Bob's PR6 and PR5 links found:

    143 - 8/29/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    140 - 9/05/2005
    138 - 9/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    140 - 9/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    152 - 9/28/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________

    note: this page is found using ( site:www.ski-france-ok.com +sleeping Bags )
    Foxy's PR5 and two PR4s
    0 - 4/20/2004
    3 - 5/04/2004
    Unchanged from previous date
    2 - 6/17/2004
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________
    Bob and Foxy added link Sleeping Bags to their sig files on this forum 5/06/2004
    Results for - ( site:forums.digitalpoint.com +sleeping bags )
    Note:Foxy & Bob removed links from Signatures - 6/11/2004
    4060 - highest links reported 6/12/2004
    Note:Foxy & Bob replaced links in Signatures - 7/21/2004
    Note:Foxy & Bob removed links in Signatures - 11/16/2004

    1090 - 8/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1100 - 8/25/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1110 - 8/28/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1120 - 8/31/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1100 - 9/20/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________

    Caryl and Foxy added link Sleeping Bags to their sig files on the SEO Chat forum 5/11/2004
    Results for - ( site:forums.seochat.com +sleeping bags )
    Note:Foxy removed links in Signatures - 11/16/2004

    132 - 8/26/2005
    123 - 8/27/2005
    112 - 8/28/2005
    100 - 8/29/2005
    85 - 8/30/2005
    81 - 8/31/2005
    79 - 9/01/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    91 - 9/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    156 - 9/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________

    *August 18, 2004 - (10) Project Supporters donated Links from 13 different IP addresses to page. Additional info will be added as it comes in.

    Total links found by using site:www.domainname.tld Researched daily by Foxy

    Daily Totals Report (click to see full report)

    606 - 1/29/2005
    457 - 1/29/20052/6/2005[/B](148 lost links from one IP) [/b]
    251 - 2/12/2005
    261 - 3/03/2005
    273 - 3/18/2005
    275 - 3/19/2005
    508 - 4/09/2005
    560 - 5/20/2005
    627 - 6/14/2005
    536 - 6/25/2005
    584 - 7/11/2005
    631 - 7/29/2005
    15,785 - 8/19/2005
    __________________

    Dec 17, 2004 - digitalpoint's "Patient" Added link to 116 different urls
    (Located on 3 different IPs within same class 3 IP address Address - 217.36.188.*)

    Jan 20, 2005 - (moved all urls to dif server - now all 116 are on same IP + changed from Coldfusion to Java)

    Number Indexed by Google

    40 - 12/23/2004
    48 - 12/24/2004
    107 - 12/30/2004
    115 - 1/2/2005
    116 - 1/21/2005
    108 - new urls & 70 old urls- 1/31/2005
    __________________

    PR/Backlink info

    ~ April 22 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    143 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ March 3 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    113 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ February 3 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    260 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ January 1 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    268 Backlinks - see Table of Links reported
    ___________
    ~ December 16 Update ~ (only Backlinks updated in this update)
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR6
    155 Backlinks
    (Details can be found for this and the following in Complete Report)
    ___________

    "A nice tool that Shawn didn't write -" DISCUSSION
    __________________
    Note:Google API has page at #27

    [​IMG]
     
    mcdar, Oct 5, 2005 IP
  7. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #2187
    Some have reported, and I agree with this, that it often appears that the initial backlinks listed in MSN and Y appear to show more important links first.

    Admittedly that it a qualified statement. I haven't seen that universally acknowledged. Also from an observation of the initial backlinks listed by MSN and Y for many sites it doesn't appear universal.

    I'd suggest you test it yourself for your own sites. See if it appears that a high percentage of bls listed among the initial 30-80 are more "on theme" or represent sites with a higher ranking themselves for relevant or related keywords than those 200 or 400 in.

    Remember in the good old days when G reported the bls that had PR's above 4 (or was it 5). That was a clear indication of the strength of bls.

    Y and MSN may! be doing this. Do some analysis and see if this seems to make sense.

    The 2nd point was that assuming there is an importancefactor...then the number of bls w/ specific and tight anchor text, "sleeping bags" may have been somewhat devalued in that probably none of them (with regard to the experiment) were sleeping bags oriented.

    That would take a time consuming look at the entirety of bls for Caryl's site and those of sites that have maintained high rankings and making "judgements" as to the relevancy factor to sleeping bags.

    dave
     
    earlpearl, Oct 5, 2005 IP
  8. compar

    compar Peon

    Messages:
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    #2188
    Earlpearl,

    I don't want to rain on your parade, but I'm afraid I disagree with almost everything you say in this post. Let me explain why.

    If it is not universal or consistent then it is useless as a measure. Beside that you seem to be suggesting that we use Yahoo and MSN data to try and understand or interpret Google's results. And finally only Google call then backlinks everyone else refers to them by the more proper name of inbound links.

    If it is inconsistent then this suggests randomness and random data can never prove anything. If they happened to be on theme for your site it would prove nothing. They either have to be on theme for every site or you have to throw the entire hypothesis out the window. Scientific method depends on reproducibility. Not randomness or inconsistency. I think you are just wishful think.

    No it wasn't! PR has never been a measure of the "on theme" strength of the backlink. And this is what you are talking about here. PR is a measure of the number of links to a page and the PR of the pages they come from. PR is theme insensitive. It never has and never will measure theme or relevance.

    You admit it is not universal. Smryl submitted data that indicates almost the opposite of your assumption. Why would anyone want to waste any time on this unrelated and unreliable set of data?

    If you believe that Google is actually looking at and evaluating a link on the basis of coming from a "same theme" web page then this point may be valid. However your method for determing this is certainly not valid.

    Correct it would. Unfortunately that cannot be done with your suggested methodology.
     
    compar, Oct 5, 2005 IP
  9. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #2189
    Bob:

    Good response for healthy debate.

    I was hoping to do the research on Caryl's site and one or more of the competitors for sleeping bags. I would have to do it by hand. I'm not a programmer. I am doing that for my own business and those of competitors.

    I'm inclined to believe in the "theming" concepts that are flying around. (Theming is my term for more complex terms). As Smyrl suggested the MSN and Y ranking of "important" sites does not seem to be universal but others, (myself included) are seeing it and testing it.

    It was my suggestion and I'm unable to devote the time to it. Even as its application is not universal there are examples of it for certain sites.

    Regardless of whether MSN and Y report "more important" or themed sites at the front of their reports the 2nd point as to overall relevancy of bls (or inbounds) is one that is gaining acceptance.

    As to reporting bls (or inbounds) Y and MSN do a better job of reporting all or most bls. Google simply doesn't provide us with accurate or relevant information. Yeah, I don't know how G evaluates the bls that MSN and Y show but I bet they know they are there...and apply some kind of weight to them.

    In any case I remain curious why the experiment page has twice during this year been jerked around like a yo yo while some other sites competing for the same keyword phrase remain at the top. Does anyone have other ideas?

    BTW my reference to PR was meant to refer to the strength of sites, not its theme.
    Dave
     
    earlpearl, Oct 5, 2005 IP
  10. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

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    #2190
    NEW PAGE UPDATE:
    *Google PR/Backlink update
    **33 Active DCs(6 New DC Found)**


    The "New Page" sleeping-bags.htm
    04/07/2004 "New Page" went live

    Search for "Sleeping Bags"
    _____________
    NOTE: Due to size constraints, the entire report can no longer appear in a post.
    You can view the entire report here... Complete Report
    ________________
    Last 10 days

    Postion #29 allinanchor: #6 --9/06/2005 [14 DCs #29, 7 DCs #30, 12 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #29 allinanchor: #6 --9/07/2005 [6 DCs #28, 27 DCs #29]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/08/2005 [10 DCs #29, 23 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/09/2005 [21 DCs #30, 2 DCs #31, 10 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/10/2005 [7 DCs #29, 13 DCs #30, 9 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/11/2005 [14 DCs #29, 16 DCs #30, 3 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/12/2005 [5 DCs #28, 9 DCs #29, 12 DCs #30, 7 DCs #31]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/13/2005 [14 DCs #28, 3 DCs #29, 16 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/14/2005 [9 DCs #28, 17 DCs #29, 7 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #11 allinanchor: #3 --9/15/2005 [All DCs #11]**(Allinanchor #3 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #3 --9/16/2005 [29 DCs #10, 4 DCs #11]**(Allinanchor #3 on All DC)
    Postion #21 allinanchor: #5 --9/17/2005 [14 DCs #12, 19 DCs #21]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #20 allinanchor: #5 --9/18/2005 [5 DCs #12, 28 DCs #20]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #5 --9/19/2005 [10 DCs #10, 9 DCs #12, 10 DCs #19, 4 DCs #20]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #3 --9/20/2005 [10 DCs #9, 23 DCs #10]**(Allinanchor #2 on 6 DCs, #3 on 27 DCs)
    Postion #20 allinanchor: #5 --9/21/2005 [8 DCs #18, 18 DCs #20, 7 DCs #21]**(Allinanchor #4 on 10 DCs, #5 on 23 DCs)
    Postion #19 allinanchor: #4 --9/22/2005 [4 DCs #18, 10 DCs #19, 7 DCs #22, 4 DCs #38, 8 DCs #97]**(Allinanchor #4 on 17 DCs, #5 on 16 DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/23/2005 [5 DCs #34, 16 DCs #35, 4 DCs #36, 8 DCs #37]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/24/2005 [4 DCs #33, 11 DCs #34, 18 DCs #35]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/25/2005 [14 DCs #33, 12 DCs #34, 7 DCs #35]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #36 allinanchor: #5 --9/26/2005 [25 DCs #36, 6 DCs #110, 2 DCs #209]**(Allinanchor #5 on 31 DCs, #6 on 2 DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/27/2005 [4 DCs #33, 8 DCs #34, 12 DCs #35, 9 DCs #36]]**(Note: Allinanchor #4 on 8 DCs, #5 on 25 DCs)
    Postion #32 allinanchor: #5 --9/28/2005 [23 DCs #32, 10 DCs #34]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #31 allinanchor: #5 --9/29/2005 [19 DCs #31, 12 DCs #32, 4 DCs #33]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #32 allinanchor: #5 --9/30/2005 [18 DCs #32, 15 DCs #33]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #28 allinanchor: #5 --10/01/2005 [28 DCs #28, 4 DCs #29, 2 DCs #32]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #27 allinanchor: #6 --10/02/2005 [28 DCs #27, 5 DCs #28]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #27 allinanchor: #6 --10/03/2005 [22 DCs #27, 11 DCs #28]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #26 allinanchor: #6 --10/04/2005 [10 DCs #24, 4 DCs #25, 19 DCs #26]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --10/05/2005 [9 DCs #27, 11 DCs #28, 13 DCs #30]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)

    Postion #11 allinanchor: #4 -10/06/2005 [29 DCs #11, 4 DCs #26]** (Note: Allinanchor #4 on 29 DCs, #6 on 4 DCs)

    Cache Date: Oct 4, 2005 13:31:07 GMT
    _____________________________________________________
    note: these pages are found using ( site:www.compar.com +sleeping Bags )
    number of Bob's PR6 and PR5 links found:

    138 - 9/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    140 - 9/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    152 - 9/28/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    155 - 10/06/2005
    __________________

    note: this page is found using ( site:www.ski-france-ok.com +sleeping Bags )
    Foxy's PR5 and two PR4s
    0 - 4/20/2004
    3 - 5/04/2004
    Unchanged from previous date
    2 - 6/17/2004
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________
    Bob and Foxy added link Sleeping Bags to their sig files on this forum 5/06/2004
    Results for - ( site:forums.digitalpoint.com +sleeping bags )
    Note:Foxy & Bob removed links from Signatures - 6/11/2004
    4060 - highest links reported 6/12/2004
    Note:Foxy & Bob replaced links in Signatures - 7/21/2004
    Note:Foxy & Bob removed links in Signatures - 11/16/2004

    1110 - 8/28/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1120 - 8/31/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1100 - 9/20/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1130 - 10/06/2005
    __________________

    Caryl and Foxy added link Sleeping Bags to their sig files on the SEO Chat forum 5/11/2004
    Results for - ( site:forums.seochat.com +sleeping bags )
    Note:Foxy removed links in Signatures - 11/16/2004

    81 - 8/31/2005
    79 - 9/01/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    91 - 9/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    156 - 9/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    155 - 10/06/2005
    __________________

    *August 18, 2004 - (10) Project Supporters donated Links from 13 different IP addresses to page. Additional info will be added as it comes in.

    Total links found by using site:www.domainname.tld Researched daily by Foxy

    Daily Totals Report (click to see full report)

    606 - 1/29/2005
    457 - 1/29/20052/6/2005[/B](148 lost links from one IP) [/b]
    251 - 2/12/2005
    261 - 3/03/2005
    273 - 3/18/2005
    275 - 3/19/2005
    508 - 4/09/2005
    560 - 5/20/2005
    627 - 6/14/2005
    536 - 6/25/2005
    584 - 7/11/2005
    631 - 7/29/2005
    15,785 - 8/19/2005
    __________________

    Dec 17, 2004 - digitalpoint's "Patient" Added link to 116 different urls
    (Located on 3 different IPs within same class 3 IP address Address - 217.36.188.*)

    Jan 20, 2005 - (moved all urls to dif server - now all 116 are on same IP + changed from Coldfusion to Java)

    Number Indexed by Google

    40 - 12/23/2004
    48 - 12/24/2004
    107 - 12/30/2004
    115 - 1/2/2005
    116 - 1/21/2005
    108 - new urls & 70 old urls- 1/31/2005
    __________________

    PR/Backlink info

    ~ April 22 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    143 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ March 3 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    113 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ February 3 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    260 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ January 1 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    268 Backlinks - see Table of Links reported
    ___________
    ~ December 16 Update ~ (only Backlinks updated in this update)
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR6
    155 Backlinks
    (Details can be found for this and the following in Complete Report)
    ___________

    "A nice tool that Shawn didn't write -" DISCUSSION
    __________________
    Note:Google API has page at #11

    [​IMG]
     
    mcdar, Oct 6, 2005 IP
  11. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

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    #2191
    This may be worth noting:

    [​IMG]


    Dave,

    What are we trying to compare here Web sites or web pages?

    If we are looking at "themes of web sites" then I would like you to consider the site in position #8, Amazon.

    What is the "theme" of that site?

    What is the overall "theme" of the first thousand or so links to them listed in Yahoo?

    Also, would someone please tell me how to check the backlinks, to a specific page, in Yahoo.

    Caryl
     
    mcdar, Oct 6, 2005 IP
  12. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #2192
    Caryl, Bob:

    Open your mouth and you get a lot of pot shots. :D

    The amazon thing...come on...they are high ranked for all sorts of phrases.

    Its not that they have more pages and bls (or inbounds) than all other sites in the top 10. Its that it is an overwhelming amount more than any other site in the top ten

    They are ranked everywhere. LOL Amazon is themed for EVERYTHING.

    I am not the expert on all this. I've picked it up elsewhere...and I'm still curious why Caryl's page flips around more than others.

    W/regard to theme. Don't have a precise answer on that one. Bet themed SITES add more weight to a themed page. A camping gear site adds weight to a page w/in the site for sleeping bags.

    Google's algos are COMPLEX w/many factors...and they change. They consider many aspects. That is why amazon ranks high along w/sites that focus on topic. From a consumer's perspective its a good choice. Might be able to buy cheap sleeping bags.

    Could be cache dates as Caryl has pointed out. Does that explain why the page periodically jumps around. Don't know. Do we know the cache dates for the pages that don't jump around?

    From having watched this experiment for a while I know that Caryl's site is themed, the page is themed, and many of the anchor text bls are not themed. That is why I brought this up. Any other ideas?

    Dave
     
    earlpearl, Oct 6, 2005 IP
  13. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #2193
    Take a look at this article. It's getting mention in the SEO world in various blogs and commentary as one of the best new articles in the industry.

    Very detailed. The article was recently improved with commentary and voting on the opinions of leaders in the industry as to the relevancy of factors that impact rankings;

    http://www.seomoz.org/articles/search-ranking-factors.php?comments=1

    The opinions of noted experts suggest that anchor text was rated as the number 2 factor for ranking in the search engines.

    Gettting back to the origin of this experiment...I'd suggest that many are in agreement with the premise of this experiment...and the experiment started a long time ago (in SEO time frame). Caryl, I guess you were right on the money with your initial hypothesis.

    As to my question about why the site tends to jump around periodically, my first instinct goes to the points referenced in the article about "theme" (my term). Again this goes back to the origin of the experiment.

    Many tight inbound links (Bob - please note my use of language here) came from sites that have nothing to do with sleeping bags. So that is my premise...that the lack of themed links could cause this periodic rankings weakness.

    Who knows though. The above referenced article and the ratings are opinions-not facts. On top of that over 100 items are referenced as having impact on serps. Some will be more relevant for certain SE's than others. Some may have no impact on different engines...and there well could be other items that impact serps.

    As to the initial suggestion that it appears that some of the IL's or Bl's toward the front of MSN and Y may suggest stronger links or more themed links...this was noted by at least some of the participants in the article.

    I simply did an initial check for the experiment page and 2 of the sites noted at the top and felt that the other sites showed more theme related links than did the experiment page.

    Anyways, it is an interesting article...and it does suggest in the ideas of many noted in the field that anchor text and rankings are strongly related.

    Dave
     
    earlpearl, Oct 7, 2005 IP
  14. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

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    #2194
    NEW PAGE UPDATE:
    *Google PR/Backlink update
    **33 Active DCs(6 New DC Found)**


    The "New Page" sleeping-bags.htm
    04/07/2004 "New Page" went live

    Search for "Sleeping Bags"
    _____________
    NOTE: Due to size constraints, the entire report can no longer appear in a post.
    You can view the entire report here... Complete Report
    ________________
    Last 10 days

    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/08/2005 [10 DCs #29, 23 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/09/2005 [21 DCs #30, 2 DCs #31, 10 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/10/2005 [7 DCs #29, 13 DCs #30, 9 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/11/2005 [14 DCs #29, 16 DCs #30, 3 DCs #32]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/12/2005 [5 DCs #28, 9 DCs #29, 12 DCs #30, 7 DCs #31]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/13/2005 [14 DCs #28, 3 DCs #29, 16 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --9/14/2005 [9 DCs #28, 17 DCs #29, 7 DCs #30]**(Allinanchor #6 on All DC)
    Postion #11 allinanchor: #3 --9/15/2005 [All DCs #11]**(Allinanchor #3 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #3 --9/16/2005 [29 DCs #10, 4 DCs #11]**(Allinanchor #3 on All DC)
    Postion #21 allinanchor: #5 --9/17/2005 [14 DCs #12, 19 DCs #21]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #20 allinanchor: #5 --9/18/2005 [5 DCs #12, 28 DCs #20]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #5 --9/19/2005 [10 DCs #10, 9 DCs #12, 10 DCs #19, 4 DCs #20]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DC)
    Postion #10 allinanchor: #3 --9/20/2005 [10 DCs #9, 23 DCs #10]**(Allinanchor #2 on 6 DCs, #3 on 27 DCs)
    Postion #20 allinanchor: #5 --9/21/2005 [8 DCs #18, 18 DCs #20, 7 DCs #21]**(Allinanchor #4 on 10 DCs, #5 on 23 DCs)
    Postion #19 allinanchor: #4 --9/22/2005 [4 DCs #18, 10 DCs #19, 7 DCs #22, 4 DCs #38, 8 DCs #97]**(Allinanchor #4 on 17 DCs, #5 on 16 DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/23/2005 [5 DCs #34, 16 DCs #35, 4 DCs #36, 8 DCs #37]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/24/2005 [4 DCs #33, 11 DCs #34, 18 DCs #35]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/25/2005 [14 DCs #33, 12 DCs #34, 7 DCs #35]**(Allinanchor #5 on All DCs)
    Postion #36 allinanchor: #5 --9/26/2005 [25 DCs #36, 6 DCs #110, 2 DCs #209]**(Allinanchor #5 on 31 DCs, #6 on 2 DCs)
    Postion #35 allinanchor: #5 --9/27/2005 [4 DCs #33, 8 DCs #34, 12 DCs #35, 9 DCs #36]]**(Note: Allinanchor #4 on 8 DCs, #5 on 25 DCs)
    Postion #32 allinanchor: #5 --9/28/2005 [23 DCs #32, 10 DCs #34]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #31 allinanchor: #5 --9/29/2005 [19 DCs #31, 12 DCs #32, 4 DCs #33]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #32 allinanchor: #5 --9/30/2005 [18 DCs #32, 15 DCs #33]]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #28 allinanchor: #5 --10/01/2005 [28 DCs #28, 4 DCs #29, 2 DCs #32]**(Note: Allinanchor #5 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #27 allinanchor: #6 --10/02/2005 [28 DCs #27, 5 DCs #28]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #27 allinanchor: #6 --10/03/2005 [22 DCs #27, 11 DCs #28]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #26 allinanchor: #6 --10/04/2005 [10 DCs #24, 4 DCs #25, 19 DCs #26]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #30 allinanchor: #6 --10/05/2005 [9 DCs #27, 11 DCs #28, 13 DCs #30]**(Note: Allinanchor #6 on ALL DCs)
    Postion #11 allinanchor: #4 --10/06/2005 [29 DCs #11, 4 DCs #26]**(Note: Allinanchor #4 on 29 DCs, #6 on 4 DCs)
    Postion #11 allinanchor: #4 --10/07/2005 [ALL DCs #11]**(Note: Allinanchor #4 on ALL DCs)

    Postion #11 allinanchor: #4 -10/06/2005 [ALL DCs #11]** (Note: Allinanchor #4 on ALL DCs)

    Cache Date: Oct 4, 2005 13:31:07 GMT
    _____________________________________________________
    note: these pages are found using ( site:www.compar.com +sleeping Bags )
    number of Bob's PR6 and PR5 links found:

    138 - 9/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    140 - 9/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    152 - 9/28/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    155 - 10/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________

    note: this page is found using ( site:www.ski-france-ok.com +sleeping Bags )
    Foxy's PR5 and two PR4s
    0 - 4/20/2004
    3 - 5/04/2004
    Unchanged from previous date
    2 - 6/17/2004
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________
    Bob and Foxy added link Sleeping Bags to their sig files on this forum 5/06/2004
    Results for - ( site:forums.digitalpoint.com +sleeping bags )
    Note:Foxy & Bob removed links from Signatures - 6/11/2004
    4060 - highest links reported 6/12/2004
    Note:Foxy & Bob replaced links in Signatures - 7/21/2004
    Note:Foxy & Bob removed links in Signatures - 11/16/2004

    1110 - 8/28/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1120 - 8/31/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1100 - 9/20/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    1130 - 10/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________

    Caryl and Foxy added link Sleeping Bags to their sig files on the SEO Chat forum 5/11/2004
    Results for - ( site:forums.seochat.com +sleeping bags )
    Note:Foxy removed links in Signatures - 11/16/2004

    81 - 8/31/2005
    79 - 9/01/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    91 - 9/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    156 - 9/08/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    155 - 10/06/2005
    Unchanged from previous date
    __________________

    *August 18, 2004 - (10) Project Supporters donated Links from 13 different IP addresses to page. Additional info will be added as it comes in.

    Total links found by using site:www.domainname.tld Researched daily by Foxy

    Daily Totals Report (click to see full report)

    606 - 1/29/2005
    457 - 1/29/20052/6/2005[/B](148 lost links from one IP) [/b]
    251 - 2/12/2005
    261 - 3/03/2005
    273 - 3/18/2005
    275 - 3/19/2005
    508 - 4/09/2005
    560 - 5/20/2005
    627 - 6/14/2005
    536 - 6/25/2005
    584 - 7/11/2005
    631 - 7/29/2005
    15,785 - 8/19/2005
    __________________

    Dec 17, 2004 - digitalpoint's "Patient" Added link to 116 different urls
    (Located on 3 different IPs within same class 3 IP address Address - 217.36.188.*)

    Jan 20, 2005 - (moved all urls to dif server - now all 116 are on same IP + changed from Coldfusion to Java)

    Number Indexed by Google

    40 - 12/23/2004
    48 - 12/24/2004
    107 - 12/30/2004
    115 - 1/2/2005
    116 - 1/21/2005
    108 - new urls & 70 old urls- 1/31/2005
    __________________

    PR/Backlink info

    ~ April 22 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    143 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ March 3 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    113 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ February 3 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    260 Backlinks reported
    ___________

    ~ January 1 Update ~
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR5
    268 Backlinks - see Table of Links reported
    ___________
    ~ December 16 Update ~ (only Backlinks updated in this update)
    sleeping-bags.htm has PR6
    155 Backlinks
    (Details can be found for this and the following in Complete Report)
    ___________

    "A nice tool that Shawn didn't write -" DISCUSSION
    __________________
    Note:Google API has page at #11

    [​IMG]
     
    mcdar, Oct 8, 2005 IP
  15. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

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    #2195
    Dave,

    Interesting read.

    I find it important to note that of the 103 factors described there was only a high level of consensus on 11 of them.

    Actually, there was only average to widely disputed agreement regarding anchor text.

    You really have to consider the statements/factors and the category they are assciated with.

    The most agreement came in saying that anchor text was important in determining the value of a link. BUT things went down hill from there.

    I have taken the liberty of cutting and pasting all of the anchor text factors so it is easier to see how it ranks.

    Anchor Text Rating in Article

    AGAIN - consider how statements were worded as that certainly would have an effect on how someone rated.

    ALSO: They referrence "Sites" rather than "Pages". Does the fact that I carry outdoor clothing and safety/survival items such as gas masks and particulate respirators on my site hurt my chances for placing well for sleeping bags? If, in light of the posible Avian Flu Pandemic, I suddenly acquire thousands of links for particulate respirators, will my sleeping bag page placement drop from the ranks?

    Caryl
     
    mcdar, Oct 8, 2005 IP
  16. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #2196
    Caryl: The referenced article is an excellent read for the industry and is also a well articulated article with regard to factors that affect rankings.

    IMHO it is significantly thorough, which is not to say that other issues are not relevant and important.

    I'm currently very focused on theme issues and am looking into this with regard to my own site and testing others.

    These are issues open to discussion, testing, and debate. With the last few changes in the google algo's I lost rankings on topics and business names that I was successfully mentioning/referencing. These were topics/words to which my site was not closely related. Was it because of site theme or page theme - I don't know. I'm going to continue to test and try and provoke responses over the near future to get some guidance.

    Several of the people mentioned in the above article have dealt on these topics in ways more sophisticated than I can broach. Some of it has to do with computer intelligence and how to ascertain what sites/pages are about via algos.

    I didn't scrutinize the votes and comments as you did, Caryl, but it is interesting to see where the votes sit as to perceived importance for various ranking issues.

    Again, I remain curious why the experiment page tends to suffer from bouncing serps relative to other pages that have and do rank high for sleeping bags. I'm going to try and look at some issues. I'd love to hear if anyone else has any ideas.

    Dave
     
    earlpearl, Oct 8, 2005 IP
  17. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

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    #2197
    I suspect that this may also be a factor effecting the experiment page. However, I know of know way to verify the age of pages.

    [​IMG]
     
    mcdar, Oct 8, 2005 IP
    Smyrl likes this.
  18. compar

    compar Peon

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    #2198
    Earl,

    I an earlier response I accused you of wishful thinking. That was slightly rude, but let me tell you what I think you are doing.

    I think you have a theory -- and you are not alone in this, and you may even be right -- that 'theme' is very important, if not the most significant issue in current Google SERP placement. However what you are then doing is interpreting everything you read as support for your theory. This is the part that I see as "wishful thinking".

    Look at the careful analysis that Caryl did to the information that you claimed was in total support of your theory. In fact after this analysis the information doesn't seem to support your theory very conclusively at all.

    Also there is nothing new in the importance of anchor text to SERP placement. That was one of the major hypothesis of the entire "sleeping bag" experiment and I think this experiment has shown this relationship. Despite the ups and downs of this page it has spent a lot of time in the top 10 -- it is number 11 today -- and none of the links, as you point out, are from themed pages or sites. So how important is "theme"? I don't know, but neither does anyone else.
     
    compar, Oct 8, 2005 IP
  19. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #2199
    The folks that developed the neat-o tool also have a tool that lists age.

    (webuildpages.com) I have nothing to do with them.

    I just applied it to the sleeping bags search term:

    The first list shows bls and domain age for the current sites ranked top ten in G.

    Domain Back Links Domain Age
    http://www.sleepingbagsandtents.com/ 4,300 21-sep-2001
    http://outside.away.com/outside/gear/buyers-guide-2004.tcl?Gear=Sleeping-Bags&v=10 215,000 21-sep-2001
    http://www.cyber-north.com/outdoorsupplies/ 13,200 28-may-1997
    http://www.gear-zone.co.uk/eshop/Sleeping-Bags.html 8,270 23-May-2000
    http://www.mountain-equipment.co.uk/sleepingbags/ 2,080 06-Jun-2000
    http://www.bigagnes.com/ 764 23-feb-2000
    http://www.fieldandtrek.com/src/TimesOnline/vsrc/FQ62/category-Sleeping-Bags-EQUISLEE.htm 4,110 28-may-1999
    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/browse/-/13331651 137,000,000 28-may-1999
    http://www.snugpak.com/ 650 15-jan-1998
    http://www.wiggys.com/ 3,280 02-aug-1997

    Their scrape of mcdar.com comes up with a domain age of 06-september-2000

    Well Bob, I was not looking to ram a theory down anyone's throat. I'm interested in why the site periodically takes a serps dive...while others that have been high ranked probably don't. I originally hoped to look hard at the site myself...with a focus on "theme". I haven't had the time. Then I presented my thoughts to the rest of you.


    If google Totally depends on algos...then their own staff could be surprised at results...especially as they tinker with algo adjustments over time.

    Caryl has been looking hard at cache dates for a period of time. I've seen very few comments here pro and con on this hypotehsis.

    She just mentioned origin dates. Could be...but look at the domain date for the site ranked #1. Not to say that it isn't the "answer" but with everything else it probably gets weighed into G's algos.

    There must be some aspect of balancing and weighing various factors with regard to all rankings. Amazon sticks out like a sore thumb for the sleeping bags serps...but its size and bl's (ib's) outweigh all other sites by an extraordinary amount. Why is it currently 8th and not 1st, 3rd, or 30th. From a theming perspective...pages related to camping/sleeping bags versus the size of the site...and the # of bls it receives it most assuredly ranks low on any type of " relative theme" scale (if there is one).

    I was initially oriented to the theme issue because I think we would all agree that the tremendous number of precise anchor text links into the experiment page came from sites with virtually no connection to sleeping bags or camping. The experiment page has shown that anchor text on its own is a powerful facet for google rankings. Yet the page has shown itself to be susceptable to periodic roller coaster effects. WHY DOES THAT OCCUR?

    I'm currently checking into theme based issues with regard to my own site and it struck me that that could be a "weakness" w/regard to the experiment page due to a potential "overdependance" on non-sleeping bags links from other sites. (quotations are my own way of defining these issues)

    All of you can look at other issues.

    Dave
     
    earlpearl, Oct 8, 2005 IP
  20. mcdar

    mcdar Peon

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    Thank you for this info!!!

    I find this interesting that All top 10 are at least four years old.

    HOWEVER - An improtant note though, the tool will only return the age of the "SITE".

    We know that the age of the experiment page is only 1 year and six months (04/07/2004). The age of the page could very well be causing Google to go schizo every now and then.

    Caryl
     
    mcdar, Oct 8, 2005 IP
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