Exactly. When a site gets pagerank quickly by buying links, this is scary stuff. They may make some money in the short term (BlueFind did for sure), but it is questionable this sort of thing will last. I would hate to see someone that worked hard get in trouble because they didn't realize what could happen. It has happened before, and you have to so careful. And in cases like BlueFind, it is not just BlueFind that is affected adversely. It is also the people that bought links. John, I'm not trying to give you a hard time. You did something very amazing, and we had to find out somehow. But now we know more than we did then! And since we know more, if you are spending top dollar for links, you have to think about the best way to spend it. I'm starting think it is more valuable to spend a smaller amount on several PR 4,5 and maybe 6 sites (like Aviva), but for higher pagerank sites, the first thing I want to know is how long they have had that pagerank. What I like about the Aviva directory is they spend a lot of time adding quality articles, and other helpful items. And then they get a lot of backlinks to internal pages, because people actually want to read it. It is clearly something more than a directory built to sell links and pagerank.
Hello... From my understanding off what matt said is.... they dont want any NON relevent sites linking with a high PR sites PR8-9s just for the sake of gaining better PR then normal ... He made enough examples to were it should be load and clear... If your site is relevent then nothing will really be said as its possible that its for traffic or advertising rather then for the sake of inflating PR. He also mentioned about sitewides cause basically your possably linking with countless numbers of inner pages PR which also affects the outcome of PR and he requested that we use "no follow" so as to prevent this from happening... On his amended statement he clarified that web directories hes not seeking to punish for paid reviews BUT you are whom you link too... in other words if you just let anything threw thats not quality then you will be looked at the same as you are just accepting for the $$$ and not quality control standards. thx malcolm
You know what I think. For Google it is very easy to detect a site which is a directory. And if you look at Google's Guidelines they specifically say 'Don't link to ........ because your ranking may as well be adversely affected' something like that. And with the paid link thing going on, what Google is actually going to start doing is lowering the rankings of those directories which list crappy sites. I mean they probably won't show up on SERPs or have a high pagerank. I guess what Google is trying to tell us is, 'If you own a directory, run it right or else bury it'. I have a pretty strong feeling about this.
Yes .... thank you for agreeing with me I mean you still have some people that dont want to understand plain and simple... and they try going around the issue but he made it pretty clear
I think you should not.. Google is worried about passing Page rank and not traffic.. If you bid high, you get higher position and more traffic. Similar to Adwords.. He is against PR passing links - So whether its bid or non-bid directory - Dont sell links - You can take review price.
This answer says it all right here as far as google is concerned with directories. "Q: Are you interested in things like affiliate links? Are you interested in hearing about directories in this report? A: Nope, I’d be most interested in feedback like the examples that I mentioned above, or things like paid posts that might affect search engines. If you’re still unsure what sort of reports we’d like to get, that’s okay. Fortunately, the vast majority of people sending in reports are on the same wavelength and are sending in solid feedback like the examples above." Directories have nothing to worry about unless they are trying to cheat the system for pr, other than that our market still looks pretty solid.
@dvduval So then whats the difference with tag cloads? if those arent the worst thing that ever came out i dont know what is... and i dont see any off those being de-indexed.. Maybe people think cause the one got de-indexed that it will happen to all.. I dont think so... bid directories will be around but will likely evolve like the web directory is. @ Banless.... EXACTLY... when google stops counting links as votes thats when we die and it aint happening anytime soon... thx malcolm
Exactly, Malcomb. And we have examples of sites that went down who bought links. And as I was saying, there are sites like Aviva that have done such a wonderful job creating great content that people actually WANT to link to. They are not taking the short cut. They are working hard to make a quality site. No doubt Aviva would do just find if a google employee looked through the site.
Directories have everything to worry bout. Did you read the part which he said on directories. I'm willing to bet on this. Within the next year Google is gonna put most directories out of business which are linking to crappy sites. Here's one that i monitored, epitrope . com, used to have a pr 7 and listing everyone for a 1 time fee. Google knocked him down in size. btw, malcolm, i was gonna quote what you had written cause u took the words right out of my mouth which I wanted to say.
Its all good as for epitrope google made the mistake of moving him up as he had hardly any links pointing to his site and poooof PR7 ...google isnt perfect as it gave then the next time took away and dropped him were he should have been PR5... BUT i have noticed that hes got some serious problems as more then half of his inner main urls are being de-indexed and or grey bar syndrome.. thx malcolm
should read Actually I had edited that shortly after hitting that enter button. I was typing with my heart and not with my mind We all work, talk & play together.
adnan Yes, I read that as well. From what I gather all he is saying is that directories should not be acceppting everything that comes their way just for the sake of receiving a review fee. This statement (Does this seem like a high-quality directory to me?†you can usually get a pretty good sense as well, or ask a few friends for their take on a particular directory.) makes it clear that google is not against directories. They just want directory owners to show a little class and stop building all these crappy directories. I'll say this, for those who are scared of what might happen then maybe they should get out of the market and leave it to those who are able to handle it. Thats may take.
All in all, I think Google wants to check up on your link profile, who you are linking to and who links to you. Quality of backlinks is even more emphasized by their relevancy now. If not relevant, I don't think PR is going to pass any more as it doesn't work that way in many current cases. Many directory owners buy links on totally irrelevant site. I admit I bought few links that are not relevant to my site theme due to the low price But I usually don't do that at all. I think what's worse than the fact PR may not be passing from those backlinks is that G may penalize sites that bought such links. I think we need to be very careful now on. Creating good link profile is becoming more important.
This quote from Matt is especially important when it comes to link bid directories I'm not trying to be the bad guy here. I just don't want people to find themselves with a big loss because google decides to start looking at this more closely with directories. Clearly, he is thinking about it already.
Exactly. I don't think Google is after directories. But will be after the ones which link to crappy sites. Which is like a big, big percentage of the so called seo directories out there. Actually I don't run a link bid directory or any scripted out of the box directory so can speak neutrally about this. Where you list your site, ie, #1 or #8 I don't think Google is concerned about that. They themselves list sites in order of Page Rank in their directory and Yahoo directory offers a sponsored listing where you pay like $50 p/month to be listed on the first page. What Google is concerned about is WHAT sites you list. take care
That may not be true, as that is not what he said. He said the fee should be for the review. For a top directory "... the fee is primarily for the time/effort for someone to do a genuine evaluation of a url or site".
Well you can have a free directory as long as Google is concerned in my opinion. But if you link to spammy sites, whether you charge a fee or not, you could be in jeopardy. if you wan't I'll hunt Google's webmaster guidelines which says this for you. Now when your talking bout a fee, sure, to get in the directory, there could be a review fee. For better positioning, there could be an extra fee. Yahoo! directory does it, business.com does it and alot of other major directories do it. Nothing wrong with that. Actually I started a new thread on the bid link directory and you can post there if you like and it will stick to topic. take care
Yes, that was probably a good idea to start the new thread, because I think this thread is more about what constitutes "gaming the pagerank". I don't think anyone likes it, but I can understand why google would want to protect their algorithm. And even worse, by protecting their algorithm, they encourage behavior that benefits google financially. I don't think this spells doom for directory owners. It just means that you have to work toward quality links AND content, and then you can have both a high pagerank site and charge for the review process. One question: what about those "toplist" sites? How have they faired? They are very similar to bid for position.
Im not sure but i think he commented that it would just not get any juice from it... and thats it Someone else also said about relevency and linking inner catagories... For instance adding my inner "Pets" catagory link on a "pet forum" or pet related site would probably NOT bring any negative consequences.. Well i would hope not anyway.. thx malcolm
I have a pet forum Before I got into directories, I tried the "forum thing". No I have a few that I need to sell or something. Not getting juice, yet on the surface, everything looking grand, would probably take a lot longer for people to realize. I have seen some high PR sites that had bought links go down on the last update, and I can't attribute it to anything but that.