Just when you thought Islam was pretty cool

Koresh was a lunatic who deserved his fate. The only tragedy regarding his death is that he took a lot of brainwashed, but otherwise innocent, people with him. That was completely unnecessary. Of course, the government storming the compound didn't really help matters either. But since when has thought been a strong suit of a government agency?

I'm definitely in favour of gassing mia at this point. I haven't made my mind up about you though.

 

Hey man I know you were just kidding... I've been out with a couple of Muslim girls who were both hotter than Bin Laden's niece... but there's no way that I would convert to Islam or to Christianity for that matter for the sake of anyone. (Although I do like what Jesus had to say and I don't hold anything against Islam its just not my cup of tea)

You'll be all glad to know that neither of those girls were killed or even looked down upon by their families.

 

I think that there is a big difference in comparsion some of you guys make here.

Mia pointed out clearly that this is a common practise and supported by their respective govts or at least they are not judged for this crime.

In Turkey this year
3 women in seperate cases hat their throads slit because they talked in talk shows on TV

Islam is not seperated from the islamic states governnance, not like in most western countries. - It may make a big difference

 

Now that's funny

 

yy Gtech, you spout it, doesn't make it true..

You claiming the 'both ways' is pretty funny to me as well, don't worry from now on I'll point out all of your 'both ways' as well, you want to play, so be it...

Funny you claim both ways, but never point them out...

 

Your signature is an excellent example, lest ye forget so soon

How's the north wind?

 

Realy an example, yet you failed miserably in that attempt

Excellent example showing you how can not comprehend anything past your own itsy bitsy little mind set...for that it worked great..

 

Yes, that must have been it!

 

lol it actually was, talk about taking items totally in the wrong way...
It's clear you see everything as black and white, fear debating internal issues on anything or anyone who is usually on your side. To me that is a huge sign of weakness and nothing more than part of a puppet patrol..

I agreed with you on the main issue itself from what we knew, I debated your blank check attitude and ex presidential executive orders, sorry it scared you that much you had to make an attempt to twist anything you could.

So what's your opinion, I've read your anti islam posts and quotes..

If it's so bad, what's your opinion on Iraq having a constitution based on Islam?

 

Democracy has just begun in Iraq and its their decision in what to do with it.
It could take decades before it works out to the best for them though.
I guess we will see some constitutional changes then too.

 

Yes it could and is...

But that was not the point.

I love seeing Bush supporters such as who started this thread rip on Islam, but then love everything that has been done in Iraq including the constitution that is based on 'Islam' talk about having it both ways...

 

Iraq Constitution was not based on Islam before Bush occupied Iraq and women had rights. Is Bush occupation of Iraq and demolishing women rights and installing a religious government a step forward or backward?

 

Yet, your reply with "the president" was so clear! I've made no blank check statement and that you continue to think it has, clearly reinforces that you had already assumed "the president" did violate the constitution. I find nothing about you scary. Humorous, but certainly not scary! In fact, you honored me by putting it in your signature, and for that, I congratulate you!

Well, let's start off with your opinion(s) first. Or do you want to remain in a position where your position isn't defined, so you can better attack others for theirs? Perhaps we can clarify that they aren't actually made to reason with someone else and establish that they are in fact your true position(s) and you will back them up. That's fair, isn't it?

My position on the post? Not surprised in the least bit. I'd have to go through my links, but definitely not the first time this has happened, even this year. And the usual suspects that make excuses for such always run looking for something in the bible for moral equivalence. There was a girl beaten here in the US this year by her brother over something similar ("honor") and it's taking place in Europe as well. For those that don't follow these types of things, I can see how it might be a surprise and worthy of some moral equivalence.

As far as Iraq and the Constitution? The world is full of "lesser of two evils" choices. All people deserve freedom. You either support that, or you don't. There have been many reports about Iraqis doing extraordinary deeds to help others, in their quest for freedom. To suggest the people of Iraq do not deserve freedom because they are muslim is about as biggoted as I can think of. Freedom is power and always brings about change. Time, not those who want terrorists to win, will be the judge.

 

There was no constitution at all and was a pure dictatorship.
Are you missing that?

Women had rights? - Now you're kidding me.
Udai was driving around and raped randomly and disgraced women. After the rapings a few lucky ones didn't get killed.

Saddam employed a northern tribe to have any woman killed they didn't like or if they were suspicious in being against him or his family.

 

#1 I've proven you wrong on your reasoning of my sig

#2 I have never said a bad word about Islam now have I? I would think it would be up to those who have in the past, yet support the war in Iraq and everything involved to the point of bending over and being fully lubed would you not?

My opinion, if Islam is what they wish to have it is up to them. It is not up to me, nor should it be up to anyone in the US to tell them what to have.

 

Forget about it, you can not gas mia or doug. There is already supreme court ruling about this:

The US Supreme Court has ruled that executing mentally disabled is unconstitutional because it is "cruel and unusual" punishment.

 

Nope, you only wish you had!

Never said you did.

It should be up to them and it was.

 

Ok Gtech for those interested in the full chain of events, let them decide. God I can't believe you're still brining this up, but very well.

http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showpost.php?p=521306&postcount=3944
http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showpost.php?p=521331&postcount=3945
http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showpost.php?p=521961&postcount=3946

Up to them, ok I agree with you there but if Islam is bad as you've posted in the past with links to I believe White Nuckle Terror or something to that nature, and others how can you then support putting in the very item you've stated is bad as the basis of law in the country, how is that going to make the 'great plan' make any improvements?

 

"The Iraqi constitution adopted in 1990 under Saddam Hussein was among the most secular in the Arab world

The Iraqi constitution adopted in 1990 under Saddam Hussein was among the most secular in the Arab world. It made no mention of Sharia -- Islamic religious law -- although Islam was named the official state religion. It prohibited all forms of discrimination, gender or other, and guaranteed freedom of expression as part of "the revolutionary, national and progressive trend."

http://www.kentucky.com/mld/kentucky/news/12385744.htm

Background on Women's Status in Iraq Prior to the Fall of the Saddam Hussein Government

Historically, Iraqi women and girls have enjoyed relatively more rights than many of their counterparts in the Middle East. The Iraqi Provisional Constitution (drafted in 1970) formally guaranteed equal rights to women and other laws specifically ensured their right to vote, attend school, run for political office, and own property. Yet, since the 1991 Gulf War, the position of women within Iraqi society has deteriorated rapidly. Women and girls were disproportionately affected by the economic consequences of the U.N. sanctions, and lacked access to food, health care, and education. These effects were compounded by changes in the law that restricted women's mobility and access to the formal sector in an effort to ensure jobs to men and appease conservative religious and tribal groups.

Women's Status in Iraq Prior to the 1991 Gulf War
After seizing power in 1968, the secular Ba'ath party embarked on a program to consolidate its authority and to achieve rapid economic growth despite labor shortages.1 Women's participation was integral to the attainment of both of these goals, and the government promulgated laws specifically aimed at improving the status of women in the public and-to a more limited extent-the private spheres.2 The status of Iraqi women has thus been directly linked to the government's over-arching political and economic policies.

Until the 1990s, Iraqi women played an active role in the political and economic development of Iraq. A robust civil society had existed prior to the coup d'etat in 1968, including a number of women's organizations.3 The Ba'ath Party dismantled most of these civil society groups after its seizure of power. Shortly thereafter it established the General Federation of Iraqi Women (GFIW).4 The GFIW grew to play a significant role in implementing state policy, primarily through its role in running more than 250 rural and urban community centers offering job-training, educational, and other social programs for women and acting as a channel for communication of state propaganda.5 Female officers within the GFIW also played a role in the implementation of legal reforms advancing women's status under the law and in lobbying for changes to the personal status code.6 On the other hand, some Iraqi women have argued that as a political arm of the Ba'ath party, the GFIW was destructive to women's issues in Iraq and "did not reflect or represent the struggle of millions of oppressed Iraqi women."7

The primary legal underpinning of women's equality is contained in the Iraqi Provisional Constitution, which was drafted by the Ba'ath party in 1970. Article 19 declares all citizens equal before the law regardless of sex, blood, language, social origin, or religion. In January 1971, Iraq also ratified the International Covenants on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR) and Economic, Social and Cultural Rights (ICESCR), which provide equal protection under international law to all.8

In order to further its program of economic development, the government passed a compulsory education law mandating that both sexes attend school through the primary level.9 Although middle and upper class Iraqi women had been attending university since the 1920s, rural women and girls were largely uneducated until this time. In December 1979, the government passed further legislation requiring the eradication of illiteracy.10 All illiterate persons between ages fifteen and forty-five were required to attend classes at local "literacy centers," many of which were run by the GFIW. Although many conservative sectors of Iraqi society refused to allow women in their communities to go to such centers (despite potential prosecution), the literacy gap between males and females narrowed.11

The Iraqi government also passed labor and employment laws to ensure that women were granted equal opportunities in the civil service sector, maternity benefits, and freedom from harassment in the workplace.12 Such laws had a direct impact on the number of women in the workforce.13 The fact that the government (as opposed to the private sector) was hiring women contributed to the breakdown of the traditional reluctance to allow women to work outside the home.14 The Iraqi Bureau of Statistics reported that in 1976, women constituted approximately 38.5 percent of those in the education profession, 31 percent of the medical profession, 25 percent of lab technicians, 15 percent of accountants and 15 percent of civil servants.15 During the Iran-Iraq war (1980-88), women assumed greater roles in the workforce in general and the civil service in particular, reflecting the shortage of working age men. Until the 1990s, the number of women working outside the home continued to grow.

http://www.hrw.org/backgrounder/wrd/iraq-women.htm

Arnie

Please explain for us, how is making a new Constitution based on Islam and sending women back to home step forward and progress in your mind?

 

Actually, the post is here:

http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showpost.php?p=519451&postcount=3861

But I can see why you didn't want to post that one

Regarding the "support putting in the very item..." Reread my post. I wasn't happy about it, but then it's not my choice to make, it's theirs. Are you trying to argue that because islam is their basis now, that it's a good reason NOT to support their freedom? It sounds like it, from the way you are asking your question(s).

Are you for their freedom, or against it?