Then why do attribute "intellectual deficiency" to (super sexy me), when you claim I said Obama is anti-semetic? But when it's pointed out it was actually Jews saying that "Obama is anti-semetic" then different rules apply. Using your logic these Jews do have intellectual deficiency, otherwise you would have double standards, One rule for "non-Jews" and another for Jews. Are you a non-Jew hater? Like this: Settler Rabbi publishes “The complete guide to killing non-Jewsâ€
Are you serious? from my previous post you didn't get an answer to this? read it again. Real slow this time. Reading comprehension quiz: now you tell me my answer, as given in the previous post. I really hope that you are in your early teens. or else... I hope that you manage to feed yourself...
maybe one of zionist leaders , thought of Palestinians like Arabs( if they are Arabs not Palestinians then it might be ok to transfer them ) , that is why they were dreaming "transfer " Arabs( Palestinians) Yosef Weitz, the architect of the "transfer" theory And finally there had been developed a scheme how to solve this problem : "Scheme for the Solution of the [Palestinian] Arab Problem in the State of Israel," which was contained in a three-page memorandum signed by Weitz, Danin, and Sasson. The memorandum called for : 1. "Retrospective transfer". 2. Preventing Palestinian Arabs from returning to their homes. 3. Destroying Palestinian Arab villages during military operations. 4. Preventing cultivation and harvesting of Palestinian Arab lands. 5. Settling Jews in Palestinian Arab towns and villages. 6. Instituting legislation barring the return of the refugees. 7. Launching a propaganda campaign for the resettlement of the refugees in other places.
He did not "think of Palestinians like Arabs". Ben Gurion knew what everybody knew 60 years ago: "Palestinians" do not exist. Today they exist, as an outcome of history and a lot of propaganda. You reading Ben-Gurion's personal diaries ziya? man. what a surprise. You are such an intellectual. Nice that finally people who can read and write came to Palestine, no? I am reading Herzl's diaries these days - in German. Fascinating.
All of them. Especially the David Ben Gurion one, which is completely twisted. Anyway, you hold UK citizenship? if yes, come to Israel, I will show you around.
hmm, did they fall from moon? when you say 60 years ago, do you mean 1948 or 1949? in 1948 and before, for more than 2000 years, there were people living there whom consider this land their homeland, do you agree, or you think it was empty for like 2000 years, just waiting the Jews to come? and those people who were living there, call themselves Palestinians, is the problem in what they call themselves? or in the fact that hundreds of thousands of them been expelled from their properties in a big ethnic cleansing process that is still continued till these days? whom are these people Edward Reed is talking about in his letter? in 1922?
I agree, there were always people who lived in Palestine. But they were not only Arabs. They were also jews and druze and bahai and cherkes and christians. The Arabs are nomads. Most of the Arabs that are today called "Palestinians" arrived during the Ottoman rule. I have no problem with how they call themselves. I just want to stress out to the people who are not from the region and are interested in this conflict, that when you say "jew", it means something that exists for thousands of years. When you say "Arab", it means something that exists for thousands of years. When you say "Israel", it means the country of the jews in Palestine, and when you say "Palestinian people" - it means "the Arabs who got screwed by Israel" - and nothing more than that. The "Palestinian People", unlike what they teach in their schoolbooks, is 60 years old, and not 3000. Sorry m8. This is history. I couldn't find this letter anywhere except on another thread in this forum. If you will show me a couple of documents where the Arabs of Palestine are called "Palestinians", you will prove that I was wrong. Lord Balfour, however, called them "Arabs of Palestine" in the Balfour declaration. Was he ignorant that actually these people are not just Arabs but more accurately "Palestinians"? - no, he wasn't ignorant. He just died before all this Arab propaganda
you are confusing Arabs with Bedouins here, Bedouins are nomads, but Arabs are not nomads. I m sure you know Bedouins, and that they live in desert, but you also know, that Jaffa, Haifa, Ramleh, Hebron, and many other Palestinian towns were not desert, and were not empty either, that there were Arabs living there, be they Muslim, Christians, or else, Jaffa for example, was no desert, and was not empty, it is clear in Ben Gurion words: now what method are you going to use? saying: No Jaffa was empty? or Ben Gurion did not say that? it is true, Jewish people, Christian people, were in Palestine since thousands of years, but not these Polish, Russian, and whatever immigrants that been forced on Palestine, and when you say, Jews existed there for thousands of years, you need to mention in what %? what was the total population of Palestine, and the % of Jews, Christians, Muslims, and others before 1948? do you have any idea? are you trying to imply that Arabs faked this letter? check nytimes archive, here is the link, click to read the full document there, it is in PDF, if there is any letter different than what I pasted here, let me know. another document, but this time it is dated back to November 25, 1833, that refers to Palestinians, it is a PDF file too, click it and read where it says: "But there had been intercourse and intermixtures always between Greeks and Palestinians as far back as history.." this makes them 2, or you need more?
This is all you could find? very lousy. Not Enough. In the texts you give, "Palestinians" means those who live in Palestine. Also the jews. Why didn't lord Balfour or the League of Nations hear of the "Palestinians"? because they didn't exist before Israel came to be. The Arab nationalism arrived slightly before Israel was established. There were no Palestinians until then. Imad, give it up. You are fighting a battle you can't win here. You can't rewrite history no matter how hard you try. Some bedouins live also in the Galille (North). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuba-Zangariyye Of course I know the Bedouins, they are proud Israelis and fierce IDF soldiers. I even remember the story of the first woman bedouin in the IDF: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amira_al_Hayb Bedouins are mostly nomadic, Arabs are nomadic too. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_people , not so much though as the bedouins, but still. There were ARABS living there, true, the same Arabs that lived at the time in Jordan or Egypt. Only later they became "Palestinians". Well said. This is exactly my point. Between 4% to 15% throughout all of history. When the Ottomans conquered Palestine, it was 11%. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Jew The Ottomans were very happy to accept the jews in the 16-17th centuries after they were expelled from Europe - because they could read and write and speak several languages, a thing that the Arabs - another people which the Turks imported to Palestine (many of which are now "Palestinian") - couldn't do. So "Jews coming from Poland Russia etc'" is not a new thing. Only the numbers are different, thanks to Herzl and the Nazis. Read about the history of Safed: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safed (from the 16th century part). Stop quoting Ben-Gurion from your propaganda websites. You clearly don't know anything about Ben Gurion and are not interested to know anything. It doesn't make you look too smart. I never read them anyway. They also doesn't matter: For every Ben-Gurion quote from 53643746 BC you can bring, I can bring you 1,000 Hamas quotes and youtubes from 2009 telling how cool it is to kill jews. you know that - elevate your debate from propaganda to real argumentation: if you can. I hope you are learning new things.
nope, this is not all I can find, you asked for couple, unless if couple mean 3, or 100, and I know it is not enough for you, even if I posted 1000's. I m not battling here, I m very pleased with the progress so far, and I hope i won't offend you when I say I been laughing at some of your posts, not ridiculing, but the way you it went, first you say: then you say, the geographic area existed, and its name is Palestine, which means, you are saying that the name Israel used to rename a geographic area that is called Palestine, which is true, I recommend you to read: The Invention of Ancient Israel: The Silencing of Palestinian History (Paperback) or this book: The Mythic Past: Biblical Archaeology And The Myth Of Israel (Paperback) then you say, even if Palestine is there, there is nothing called Palestinians, it is been a term invented by Arabs after Israel was invented, and I showed you how some old letters and documents refer to Palestinians, and now you say, Palestinians mean, those who live in Palestine, very true, those who live in Palestine, why are they called Israelies now not Palestinians? and what happened to those who used to live in Palestine for thousands of years? and whom call themselves Palestinians? regardless what is their name, there were people there as we both agree, they can call themselves Palestinians, you can call them Fizfozians, somebody else can call them Cricrobrofians, the most important point that you are trying to avoid, there were people there, whom consider that geographic area named Palestine as you admit, their homeland, and as you agree, the Jews were a tiny minority there, before the loads of illegal Zionist immigrants come, what happened to these people? this is what I m asking, where are they now? was what happened to them legal? acceptable, or OK? and on what bases?
If you have to look so hard, and lord Balfour don't agree with you: give it up. you can't rewrite history. No problem, but beware that the joke will not be on you: I will try again. A country called "Palestine" never existed. Country is an entity which is different than "geographical area". Palestine - is the historical name of the "geographical area". Israel - is the name of the COUNTRY, that is now on the "geographical area" also known as Palestine. And in the jewish tradition as "Land of Israel". I will explain 10 times more if needed. It is crucial that you finally understand these basic concepts. you shouldn't have skipped so many classes in school.... Have you read these books? No. So why all this bullshit? The fact that a title of a book says something is worth exactly: 0. Cut the bullshit man. No, you didn't. You worked very hard and you barely found some funny PDF. If I look for "Germans" or "French" or "Swedish", I will have less trouble finding something don't be ridiculous. No, I say that in your quotes, the term "Palestinians" is used to simply denote "those who live in Palestine" - and NOT the conventional meaning of "Palestinian People" as for 2009. Yes. There were people there, they were Arabs. The zionist immigration was perfectly "legal" - the British gave their blessing. Then, they changed their minds because of the Arab pressure (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Paper_of_1939), so the immigration became "illegal". But was the British occupation of Palestine legal? does the word "legal", which you love to use, have any meaning when speaking about politics and countries? no, it doesn't. 11% is not a tiny minority. Palestine is the heart of the jewish people. Who? the palestinians you mean? you know what happened better than I do. From first hand experience, no?
Wouldn't that be a fantasy coming true eh? Don't be afraid so much of the truth hoping that it will disappear, it will not. Life is not so easy. Long time!, where have you been hiding? training camp for soldiers of Allah in Pakistan?
so now if Americans, gave their blessings to Russians to immigrate to Iraq, then it becomes legal? British was the occupying power, it was occupying and colonizing so many countries or (geographic areas if you like) like India, Ireland, USA ..etc if British then allowed so many Chinese immigrants to Texas, does this make it enough to consider it as a legal base to rename Texas to New China for example? and expel the people of Texas to elsewhere? and tell them you are not the people of Texas, you are Mexicans? I m glad that you say it is not ok or acceptable, and yeah, it is really not, they been denied the right of self-determination, and this is what they are fighting for, to half the right of self-determination, and not somebody else suggest them to live elsewhere than their homeland, or change their names to Jordanians, or change Jordan name to Palestine, or wipe them off the map, and history, by renaming the geographic area that been known as Palestine to something else. Edit: have to go now, it is Eid prayer time, happy Eid to all Muslims and happy thanksgiving to all Americans and anybody who is celebrating these two occasions or any of them. will check & continue later.
Maybe I didn't say it clear enough. I dont think that the British mandate was "legal". I think that "legal" - when talking countries nations and politics - is a word with no meaning. Actually, I don't think, I know. True, except for one small inaccuracy: They were not "denied". They attacked the jews whose "right for self-determination" (if true or false, doesn't matter) they refused to accept. Then they lost, and paid the price. They were the active side, and only at a later stage became the passive side, if you forget the propaganda for a moment and look at history. The jews didn't want the war of 1948. They didn't believe they will survive it.
Where is the truth and where is the lie if you won't read any of the sources I or anyone else provides here? Toopac now knows how frustratingly useless it is to debate with the likes of you.
Gauharjl, What do you expect from someone calling themselves a zionist, and also believes that the israeli government is building extra settlements because of hamas attacks. When you lie to yourself long enough you start to believe your own lies and it becomes Truth. The Israelis that were living with the palestinians before the influx never had problems with them and even begged the UN not to let this happen. The true jewish People whome I have many friendships with here in America are very very peaceful people and never try to spread lies and propaganda . They are honest people. Some others have another agenda.
Yes, I have no intention of reading a cropped, altered and otherwise falsified account of what happened. You read it, you said in response those "Jews have intellectual deficiency" (sic). Just been reading the rest of your posts in this thread they are just as funny as this one. Maybe your a zionist? maybe you disagree with the term zionist? but.... You approve of land grabbing, you are happy with what's happened thus far Arabs kicked out to make way for Jews, that's 'ethnic cleansing', you support Israeli expansion, you donate to a place that advocates/admits that Israel shoots unarmed kids and they just need to spin it, as liberals won't see it as 'necessary'. In your opinion do you believe Jews have a 'god given right' to Israel? regardless of any other fact, like how you received that land in a non biblical sense.