Normally I would say it isn't wrong. But it's clear these bastards purposely conducted this test during a break in oil prices. I take that personally because the consequences effect my daily life.
Having a stable democratic government in Iraq, protected by us, could help avert a global energy calamity. We may be paying now, but you could look at it as an insurance policy, pay a little now so we are not completely ruined financially in the future. I know you're going to think this postulate is silly, but consider one hypothetical off the top of my head; A Russian backed Iran invades and takes control of its oil fields. Don't think it's possible? Russia has confiscated oil companies from its own citizens in order to further nationalize its oil. There are a thousand other hypothetical scenarios you could invision that could cause a situation that would absolutely ruin the US.
Ahh so you don't mind the huge effects this is having on your daily life on the small hope that it could help you in the future, even though it's just as possible it could make us weaker in the future. There is a LONG way for Iraq to be democratic, stable and complete.
I think it is VERY likely that a US protected democracy in Iraq is very much in the long term interests of the entire world. An open Iraq with free market oil is a hell of a lot better than letting it fall into the hands of nationalizing loonies who don't like us. It's actually coming along rather nicely. Have you not been reading the news? I used to be skeptical but I'm very glad to say that it really seems like the Iraq experiment is going to succeed. I have a lot of news articles from credible sources that will back me up on this(but I'm lazy and will only go get them if you insist).
i cant keep reading the non-sense that people write in here.. felzafndy, imad, Mr_2 there's no country in the middle east that can match Israel in military strength you must be influenced by your country propaganda too much. but we will just have to wait and see, right ? Syria's air space got penetrated and Israel aircraft's got to the probably most secured site in Syria the secret nuclear reactor protected by Russian anti-aircraft missiles and bombed it - Syria's reaction: Silence, the Muslims are scared. Where are Iran your allies why aren't you attacking with them? 4 fronts! Hamas from Gaza, Hizbullah from Lebanon, Syria and Iran! I will tell you why, your leaders are scared - because they know what will happen when Israel decides to Strike we will send you back to the middle ages.
'loonies that don't like us' much like much of Iraq is today? They don't exactly love us over there, we can not protect them forever. An Iraq in civil war is far more dangerous to us than the butcher being in charge. I've been following it, violence is down 'big whoop' the surge is also ending. Both civilian in Iraq and experts that I have read are worried that once the surge is over the violence will erupt again. It's not that difficult to see, during 'the surge' much like martial law crime/violence will go down. The criminals/freedom fighters/terrorists whatever you want to call them are buying their time as they can not currently move around freely. That is far from being a free and open democracy, lets see how well things are once the surge is over, a few years after we are finally out of there. Civil war is a definite possibility, an Iraq in absolute chaos will help us how exactly?
This was absolutely brilliant. Nice one. We're paying triple now for oil, and this war is estimated to cost around $3 trillion in debt which we have to service. How is this "a little"? Btw, newsflash, the Iraqi government is now mirroring the Iraqi people of the last year, and saying, "Yankee go home". You will need to modify your language, it's not about protecting Iraq. Once the current authorization expires, it becomes obviously, legally and without doubt, an occupation. Which means we are stealing the oil. Do you sleep under your bed at night? Geez man, it's like you're a test subject for DHS propaganda. Sure, there are a thousand scenarios of what could go wrong. Some nutcase in North Korea could have fired off the first nuke that starts WWIII 5 minutes ago. Is the solution to attack, invade, destroy and control everyone? Besides being immoral, is that really the world you want to live in? One of perpetual war?
The surge was bought and paid for with taxpayer dollars. When the US forces started buying off the Sunni militants, that is when the violence decreased. People don't understand that Iraqis, like most eastern and middle eastern cultures are not naturally Democratic. Obviously, I have made my position on democracy clear many times on the forum. I'm digressing... Iraqis seem to be more tribal than democratic. Forcing democracy on them is a bad idea. It's like taking a carrot and trying to root it in the desert. Democratically, the Sunnis and Kurds will always be at a disadvantage to the Shias based on population size. That's why democracy fails in the ME and these other regions. The only reasonable solution IMO is to allow them to live in enclaves, voluntarily. Not that it is any of our damn business how they rule themselves. It's not like we would allow them the right to come to America and change our system because they want to secure their agricultural future by controlling our farmland. @Mia, energy prices are through the roof, because the dollar is debasing. The House Banking Committee is now going to get the FED Chairman to testify on that. There are a lot of myths about the price of oil, meant to distract people from looking at the intentional destruction of the currency by the government.
yo yo read on top left corner it says Location: Sweden. You lost the last war to a group like Hebullah and now you come and speak about destroying the most civilied and advance european country like Sweden?!! Who knows maybe those bombing of Syria done by B2 stealth bombers or YF 117 aircrafts?! Without the help of United State Israel is gone in less then a year no need even for any country to attack it it gonna collapse . Imagine those powerfull arab countries who export billions of $$$ oil. They simply can sell oil 20% cheaper for those countries who stop supporting israel and boycott its products. there is very lil or no support for Israel regime in european countries ( i dont know about USA ) The goverments here usualy support israel because of pressure by US.
Please tell me wise Mr_2 how did we lose the war exactly ? I can't see Hezbollah's flag in the middle of Tel-Aviv - no you are right we lost the war: Casualties and losses Hezbollah militia: Dead: ~250 (Hezbollah claim)[8] ≤500 (Lebanese officials)[9] ~500 (UN officials' est.)[10] ~600 (IDF est.)[11] Captured: 13[12] Amal militia: 17 dead LCP militia: 12 dead PFLP-GC militia: 2 dead Israel Defense Forces: 119 killed [13] 400–450 wounded 2 Captured Lebanese citizens: 1,191[14] dead 4,409 injured[14] Israeli civilians: 44 dead[15][16] 1,489 wounded; 2,773 treated for shock and anxiety[17] oh that's right Hezbollah is a Gorilla force not a country.. hiding behind civillians in Lebanon! about the oil you mentioned don't worry soon oil replacements will be available and the Muslims will sell there cars and start riding camels again. Israel agreed to set 200 Palestinian prisoners for the release of Gilad Shalit, Hamas wants 600 Prisoners - this must be the reason for why we lost.. 1 Israeli = 600 Palestinians so if we didn't kill 119*600=71400 enemy soldiers we lost alot more.. sorry didn't count the civilians -> (119+44)*600 = 97800
The butcher wasn't going to be in charge forever. However much a dictator would like to rule from beyond the grave, I don't think any have found a way yet. He may of weakened or just died and then chaos probably would have ensued anyway, which could have resulted in disaster, not only for Iraqis but for the world. Dictatorships often do not end nicely, but they always end. Where are you reading, moveon.org, huffingtonpost.com? Didn't you read the article I posted a month or so ago showing how Iraqis are cooperating by turning in stores of guns to the US military? Alot of the bad blood on both sides has been cleaned out by the sectarian violence in the last couple of years. It was unfortunate but perhaps inevitable and a necessary hurdle. I think Iraqis are starting to come together and embracing the idea of a new Iraq. Maybe you should too?
Spin this how you will(and of course it will be negative towards the US because you're such a patriot), but al-Maliki calling for a timetable for withdraw is an awesome sign that Iraq is working. He's not an idiot, by all accounts, he knows the consequences of US withdraw, he would not have even hinted at this if he wasn't becoming more optimistic about what would happen now in Iraq if we started withdrawing now. Please don't accuse me of being a victim of propaganda until you stop promoting the Alex Jones fear agenda here. No, just Americans, they are evil.
it was israel attacked Hezbullah with intentiion to distroy that group. You can fight any way you like. You cant come home after a fight and complain that the guy i fought was fighting karate style, or kung fu style etc.. lol Sorry but you sound like that Arab guy i know who never admit the fact that they lost a war to israel. If you attack and don't achieve ur goals and then run back you are lost that war! yeh if it was that easy there would be inventors who invent on daily bases new replacements for oil.
Dictatorships can and do have a successor. Sorry I don't read those sources, try again. There have been articles of Iraqi's turning in stores of guns to the US for years, in most cases being paid for it and in many cases turning in broken down equipment. I'm all for a 'new Iraq' that works, I however have a hard time believing in fantasy creatures
I don't have to spin it (although you are). Al Maliki is a terrorist, and he is going to lose the election unless he starts pandering to the Iraqi people, and not Iran. Al Sadr is gaining a lot of momentum with his nationalist agenda, and that is why Al Maliki was cracking down on the Sadr Army, because it looked at one point like there may be a coup before an election. The Al Maliki government has little to no real authority in Iraq, except what is given by the American forces. Just 3 weeks ago, American commanders were reporting that Iraqis were running from their posts when they came under fire. The Iraqis may not be ready, but the people want their country back. You promote it more than I do. I try to talk about real foreign policy, real history and real economics. If you're deficient on those 3 topics, you will probably want to blame propaganda. Can you do me a favor? I want you to read this, honestly and objectively, and tell me what you think.
Sometimes they have a neat little handover of power and everything goes smoothly and the people they rule over continue to live their desperate lives in fear for generations to come. But sometimes they also result in violence and chaotic power grabs that go on from a few hours to a few days, weeks, months, or even in perpetuity. Well, please share then. You post first from credible sources showing how rotten Iraq is going and I'll match you one-for-one, hell maybe even 2-to-1 with positive articles showing that it's headed in the right direction. Here's the weapons cache story for starters from a month ago. http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/06/18/africa/ME-GEN-Iraq-Weapons-Found.php
Hezbollah attacked the Israeli border first. again you keep ignoring previous posts by other people. "If you attack and don't achieve ur goals and then run back you are lost that war!" so what were Hezbollah's goals and what did they achieve ? Israel damaged Hezbollah so badly they're still recovering and it has been 2 years already.
Who said it was 'rotten' don't make things up or put words into my mouth if you want any type of debate. The 'right direction' under martial style law that can not last is not a guarantee that it will continue that way. You can hope like hell, that's about it, no definitive that it is.
Awesome, isn't it? You promote Alex Jones subtly yet often, and only subtly because you are a committed activist, which means you actually think you're making a difference here, and you're afraid that if you come out full force with the AJ propoganda that you will lose even more credibility. Don't think I've noticed how you backed off in the past when I started making crazy N.W.O. conspiracy jokes? Would you do me a favor to be disclosed at a later time?