Isn't hard earning a living off writing these days...

I am thinking about all of these low quality writers who charge very little, they are kinda spoiling it for you professionals, ey?

 

Ah, it isn't too terrible really. It is much like comparing Jello and Crème Brulée - to use an example from a favorite movie. Sometimes clients need the basics, and sometimes they want a delicacy. I can see the value of each, but only provide one - and it pays accordingly. (Of course, DP isn't the only place to drum up some business, either.)

Now, does this question have anything to do with the contest you are promoting through your signature? LOL

Rebecca

 

It all depends on what you write and the quality of your work. People will pay for qualiety. Also,writing for the web is only one avenue for selling your work. There are still offline venues that will pay you very well, especially when you become established.

 

Rebecca, are you claiming that I made a short thread in a pretty busy forum just for people to read about my contest! Well... kinda ^^

Honestly, I did ask the question out of curiosity. I know that e book writers have suffered due to all these lousy e books that are just flooding the net which cost under 5 bucks so I was wondering if the same applied to freelance writers.

PS: Why not join join in, I'm sure you'd win ; )

I guess thats the thing, you have to get well established before people realize that your service is that of quality, correct?

 

Unfortunately contests like that won't attract the "best writers" in DP or anywhere. A sales letter from a professional will cost you thousands. They're not going to write one just for the hopes that they may make $10 for it.

Yes, low-rate writers can hurt professional freelancers to some degree. I don't think most of us really consider them our competition, b/c the types of clients we target wouldn't even dream of hiring the vast majority of them, no matter how low their rates are - professional publications tend to blow off writers who don't demonstrate that they know the value of their work... it shows that they don't know terribly much about the publishing industry (whether online or off).

That said, in agreement with Rebecca, the real problem isn't with them taking work away from us (there are plenty of high paying gigs if you know where to find them). Rather, the problem can be that they portray a false sense of what's "standard" in the industry, which affects the expectations of certain client groups. So it drives certain markets below standards professionals will take, which is a shame, but it's not as though there aren't others that make up for it.

As for getting well established before people realize your work is worth higher rates... I'd disagree with that. There's the "you've gotta start somewhere" mentality that says you should take lousy gigs in the beginning to build a portfolio. Quite frankly, that's a dumb move in most cases, because a portfolio built on those kinds of projects is extremely unlikely to ever net higher-paying clients for you. They won't take the work seriously. You need to decide what your time is worth BEFORE you start writing, and build the skills in your niche that you'll need to attract clients. If you're desperate for portfolio pieces, launch your own site, or do some pro bono work for a respected non-profit agency (it will carry more weight in your portfolio than just about any $5 writing gig ever will, especially if they're a recognized name). It's not hard jumping right into decent-paying markets if you learn how to go about it first.

 

Its not the money (thats just symbolic) , its the show, the honor that is being displayed : P. To refute your argument, I had one expert writer pm me just to try it out, and I'm sure he is not interested in the ten bucks. Come on, its fun, you have to see the idiosyncratic melancholic beauty in this, open thy eyes to the beauty it withholds! ^^

Jenn, I know that deep down inside you are wishing that you could enter my 10$ contest!

But isn't that like a Catch 22, you have to be there to get there?

 

lol I'd actually have to question how much of an "expert" they are honestly. If they really were, their time would be far too valuable in billable hours elsewhere to engage in contests anyway. Competing just to "best" beginning writers in the niche just makes them look foolish, like they can't actually compete with their peers. I'm not trying to bash your contest; I'm sure you'll have plenty of submissions and be happy with the results. I just don't think the winner would come close to being the "best copywriter on DP".

I'm not sure what you mean about "you have to be there to get there." I don't think it's a catch 22 at all. I even gave a specific example of how to get started in really building quality portfolio pieces that will help net better clients than the $5 type of gigs.

 

Don't you have some time for some fun? Its like when professional gamers play in public domain, they know that they are wasting time, but who cares, its fun!

Yea you did, sorry for not paying attention. Do keep in mind though that there's usually more than one way to do it.

 

Honestly, not much. And if I did, I wouldn't be spending it doing more work. Copywriters are pretty drastically different than professional gamers. Taking time to write one sales letter for nothing or almost nothing could cost them thousands of dollars, and even if they won it would have little effect on them. It's easier to land one great client, get paid a significant amount for your time, and have them refer you to other clients. They'd get more work and a bigger reputation boost that way than simply saying "I won a contest on DP."

I'm sure it will be a lot of fun for newer writers, or those who haven't written sales letters, and who want to give it a try, so I'm not saying there's anything at all wrong with running a contest... just that most professionals wouldn't give it a second look (they don't give any contests the time of day though, so it's nothing personal - unless it's something well-established and reputable after being around for years, and most still wouldn't give the time for "possible" income or other rewards).

I'm also not sure about calling the winner the "best writer in DP". There are a lot of truly outstanding writers here in a wide variety of niches who would not only avoid contests, but who simply don't do sales letters, b/c it's not everyone's cup of tea. Good luck with it though. I'll certainly be interested to see the winning sales letter.

 

Going back to the original comment.

I buy articles for different reasons. When I am looking for a well optimized article, I'm having you do keyword research and I want a high level of professionalism, I will pay more. Likely pages like this are going to go on one of my websites as a main page.

I also need on a regular basis, filler articles, these might be used for low end websites, article distribution, perhaps as "reviews" that I want to look like someone off the street. This style of article I would use the $5 - $10 writers, knowing that often I will need to adjust the spelling, grammer, etc.

If you are only writting the high end stuff, then you need to show the benefites of your writing. I think the work is out there for both styles, I just find it a lot harder to get myself to "test" some ones work at $50 - $100 a page, so I don't do it as often.

It's often a lot easyer to make a sale when you know what is going through a potential clients mind, so I thought I'd give you my opinion.

 

Time change. Same thing with web design before. Than you got dreamwaver and stuff and everbody could do a website for nothing without to 'study' the codes...

 

It's not really the same as Web design. You can design a website from anywhere in the world. You can't turn out English language content (that would appeal to most native speakers) from anywhere. The same if it's for French, German, etc. publications. Language and communication are the key differences, and what make the writing profession so different from others, and why it won't ever be one completely global market. The problem with good writers taking too little pay is more than likely that they either a) don't know where to find better gigs, or b) don't want to put the time into querying for them.

 

Or C.) Jenn -- they just don't care, and could be considered "hobby writers."

But Jenn is correct. Freelance writing cannot be compared to web design in that respect. I wouldn't say that low paid writers are necessarily "ruining" the market for professionals; they are not our competition. However, they are ruining their own chances to better their career and make more money for less work.

Those who care about quality will pay more for a professional approach. Those who are concerned more with quantity, regardless of how crappy the articles are, will be more than happy paying pennies per word for content.

 

I spend 2 or 3 hours a day writing. It's not much but I make a good living as a single mom who can be home to homeschool her daughter so I'm very happy. So, why do I tell you this? Because I don't charge the outlandish prices that some writers charge and yet have been published in several magazines and a ton online. It depends on what you want to do with the time that you have, I guess.

 

That would depend on what you consider "outlandish". $1000-2500 / article is far from outlandish for feature-length pieces in a reasonably large and recognized publication... it's more like standard. For a smaller magazine or large website up to $200-1000 would be a broad range, but where the standard rates fall. Again, not outlandish if they're looking to hire professionals, especially with an expert background in their niche. At the same time, there are probably many webmasters who think $100 would be an "outlandish" rate.

It's also not so much about what writers charge; it's about what the publications pay. You don't always get to propose your own rate structure. The larger the publication the more rigid they're likely to be, and if it doesn't fit your rate range, you simply don't query them. But well-known publications don't take someone on because they charge less... they often don't even ask what you normally charge, and don't care.

In my own case, I'd rather write one or two pieces over a month, for publications I can be selective about (almost entirely online for me right now, although a print move is a major plan for '07), while making the same amount someone else does writing several hours per day during a month. It just comes down to quality of life... not only can you build a stronger portfolio that way, but you have much more time to query other publications you'd like like to work with and sink time into your own content sites and such, where you can work to develop a strong passive revenue stream.

 

Interesting statement, No I don't use anything regardless of how crappy it is. But yes I do choose the lower price writers when their quality fits my needs. I have found some that put out a good quality for a fairly low price. I don't always want to pay for a Cadillac when a Honda will due.

By the way jhmattern, I liked you blog on Press releases, Good info there.

 

Thanks. I figured it was about time I actually started doing something with that blog again... and you just reminded me that I have a new template I need to post now today. lol

 

And that's absolutely fine. As a business, you have the ability to choose the lowest bid based on what will meet your needs. What upsets me are webmasters who seek "professional writers" to produce content for them, and balk at the rates they charge. Similarly, people who make crazy demands and are only paying 2 or 3 bucks an article also irk me. If someone is going to demand professionalism, then they better be able to pay up. Otherwise, they shouldn't make such strong demands and then be upset afterwards because a generic content writer failed to live up to their unrealistic expectations.

 

Denise,

I agree. I have charged according to what clients want. If it's a blurb they will get a blurb and charged accordingly. if they want an essay, well, they will get an essay and be charged according to essay writing rates.

It's amazing how many ask me to quote them for a 1,000 word essay and they expect it to be done for like $5.00. LOL

I charge around $80-$100 for a 1,000 word essay and I must say it's a damn good price for what is written. The clients who have paid do realise the quality they receive but most can't see. Probably obstructed by the banknotes infront of their eyes.

Col

 

80 to 100 dollars is an EXTREMELY good price for a 1,000 word essay. While you can be paid substantially more by targeting different publications, I have to admit it's quite refreshing to see a writer on DP that doesn't accept 5 dollars for a 1,000 word article I'm not totally knocking forums as a place to conduct business, but you are going to have to search long and hard on a forum for the clients not willing to compromise on quality for the sake of saving a few bucks (At least when it comes to writing; I can't say the same for other lines of work.)