Is it legal to create a website for someone who plans to sell counterfeits?

Discussion in 'Legal Issues' started by gandalf117, Nov 10, 2010.

  1. #1
    I want to know if you as a freelancer accept an order for an online store that sells only counterfeits and imitations are you liable for building the website?

    I have heard and read various stories of people who get a lot of money quickly by selling counterfeit products online. If they get caught and the police asks who built the website and they point to you, what happens next? Does the police go after the builder or builders of the website? Are there any fines or maybe more?

    P.S. How would you even know if an online store you built sells only legal products? Should freelancers never build online stores?
     
    gandalf117, Nov 10, 2010 IP
  2. dscurlock

    dscurlock Prominent Member

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    #2
    Listen officer, I just build websites, and nothing more.. I do not care if it is whitepowder in a cup, i was
    just hired to create a website for the seller, nothing more, nothing less, what they do with the sites
    after I create them is their legal responsibility....now if you go and knowingly create a bomb
    making website, well, your bad...some things are just commonly stupid :)

    and I am not a lawyer, just because you drove the get away car, and did not actually rob the bank...
    the cops may by your story, or they may not, if you did get charged, it would be less of a charge
    then that the counterfeiter would be facing...they saw what he was doing, they actually caught
    the counterfeiter, but in your case, they have to go a few steps futher and prove that you
    knowingly created a site for the counterfeiter knowing it was counterfeit products.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2010
    dscurlock, Nov 10, 2010 IP
  3. gandalf117

    gandalf117 Active Member

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    #3
    thanks for the quick replay, dscurlock,

    I am hoping for a more serious answer though. In reality I wouldn't even want to talk to a policeman let alone repeat what you have written above. Does it really matter to the courts whether you knew the website sold illegal goods? They know that anyone can deny knowing what they were doing. Maybe being involved is good enough for them, is it? Most importantly, are the courts interested in the person who designed the website?


    Hasn't anyone out there built an online store? How did it go? Have you never had such concerns?
     
    gandalf117, Nov 10, 2010 IP
  4. dscurlock

    dscurlock Prominent Member

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    #4
    I am going to honestly say I do not know. Counterfeiting is illegal, you also admited to aiding the counterfeiter,
    is it possible that they could hold you responsible as part of the counterfeit ring? absolutely, you did contribute....
     
    dscurlock, Nov 10, 2010 IP
  5. WordyDivas

    WordyDivas Peon

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    #5
    If you are really concerned I would recommend walking away from the project. I know it is hard to turn away a good client, but if you know they are planning to sell counterfeit goods, and believe that you will be held accountable don't put yourself through the stress.

    On the other hand, I can't help but wonder how many web designers have built sites for clients they assumed had legit goods or were using dropshippers only to learn otherwise later. Has anyone heard a case of a web designer being prosecuted for this? Honestly, I would think that law enforcement would be more interested in pursuing the owner of the website (or the web host if the domain is cloaked) than a third party whose only affiliation/involvement was the initial design.
     
    WordyDivas, Nov 10, 2010 IP
  6. 24788

    24788 Peon

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    #6
    I think a good record of all your projects would help to back your case. You built one website that sells fakes and 99 websites that honest products vs. 99 sites that sell fakes and 1 website that sells honest products.
     
    24788, Nov 12, 2010 IP
  7. averyz

    averyz Well-Known Member

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    #7
    I agree with dscurlock.

    You just don't know. Sometimes the law has better things to do and they just don't waste time on somethings sometimes they have not enough to do and they go after everyone.

    Grey area is it worth the risk ?
     
    averyz, Nov 12, 2010 IP
  8. Business Attorney

    Business Attorney Active Member

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    #8
    You can be liable for contributory infringement if you meet both of the following tests:

    1. You knew or reasonably should have known about the infringing activity; and
    2. You made a material contribution that assisted the infringing activity.

    If you innocently create a website for a store that happens to sell some counterfeit merchandise and you had no reason to believe that the store was created with that intention, then your lack of knowledge should keep you safe. If you create a store with the name "replica handbags" and see that they are planning to sell expensive trademarked bags, then chances are you should have known that they were selling counterfeit goods, whether you knew that for a fact or not.

    Whether or not your creation of a website is a "material contribution" to any infringement is a question of fact, but there is a very good chance that if your client sells the products online, your contribution in creating the website would likely be considered material.

    In short, if you have no reason to think that a client will be selling counterfeit goods, you shouldn't have to worry that a site you create may be used for illegal purposes. On the other hand, if you DO have reason to believe that the site will be used for legal purposes, then building the site can definitely expose you to liability for contributory infringement.
     
    Business Attorney, Nov 12, 2010 IP
  9. reelstuff

    reelstuff Active Member

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    #9
    I think the key here is did you know, and if you did, then you could be in serious trouble.

    I can imagine a situation where if you have plausible dependability, then you ok, but the rule is usually if in doubt, dont.

    Same legal disclaimer applies, were not lawyers,

    The thing here is what about CPAs, or anyone else that does something for a criminal, are they guilty by association too?

    Again the hinge pin here is did you know that what you were participating in was illegal, for example if you put up a wordpress website for products, but you did not take any pictures or upload any of the products, then how could you know what they were going to do with the website?

    Still what if you found out later on, then your in real trouble, because if any reasonable person would have called the police then your in trouble, I guess the main thing here is if you know that what your doing is wrong, then dont do it,
     
    reelstuff, Nov 12, 2010 IP
  10. mnicklas14

    mnicklas14 Greenhorn

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    #10
    Well now that you made this post, I don't exactly think it would be a great idea because your acknowledging on a public forum that you are aware of the legalities your client is breaking the law. If you legitimately don't know, you could probably get out of it, but since its clear you do know, I don't think its a good idea
     
    mnicklas14, Nov 16, 2010 IP
  11. iwantvarun

    iwantvarun Active Member

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    #11
    Don't put your name any where .Just create a site where the client can load images and add product and can sell them.obviously domain and hosting order from your client side.Your responsibility is to create webpages or setup initial configuration for the client.

    I don't think if you create a web mall site where client can add any product and can sell those products how you can be responsible for his action.
     
    iwantvarun, Nov 17, 2010 IP
  12. kkimachia

    kkimachia Peon

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    #12
    You are an accomplice... aiding and abetting, plain and simple.
     
    kkimachia, Nov 17, 2010 IP
  13. averyz

    averyz Well-Known Member

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    #13
    I have heard a few stories about people selling grey area stuff from the internet then after a while the law takes notice and starts tracking stuff then makes some visits.
    But most of the time the main criminal knows he is doing stuff he can get in trouble for so he is using proxies, western union, fake names, etc so when things turn bad he vanishes and everyone else involved that is traceable gets to deal with law enforcement.
     
    averyz, Nov 17, 2010 IP
  14. vndnbrgj

    vndnbrgj Member

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    #14
    I would completely stay away from it.
    You could potentially get charged with conspiring to commit fraud/larceny.
    Since you already know that the site is going to be used to sell counterfeit items.

    I mean, think about it, if someone wanted to track your ISP.....they could potentially track all of your history from said ISP.
    In the event this were to happen, you blatantly just created a thread about conspiring to commit fraud.
     
    vndnbrgj, Nov 17, 2010 IP
  15. AstarothSolutions

    AstarothSolutions Peon

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    #15
    Assisting others to break the law is a crime in itself.

    You now have a public posted statement saying you knew that they are intending to break the law before you've helped them. Unless you're in a country that you feel would make you untouchable it would be even more silly to go forward with it
     
    AstarothSolutions, Nov 19, 2010 IP
  16. Tim46

    Tim46 Peon

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    #16
    If it feels wrong don't build it...
     
    Tim46, Nov 23, 2010 IP
  17. Dibiase

    Dibiase Guest

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    #17
    you would only get a smaller charge, not to much.
     
    Dibiase, Nov 23, 2010 IP