Mia is there anything Bush has ever done is wrong? Really saddam attacked us in the first gulf war? I thought he originally attacked kuwait?
You can't blame them too much. I mean after all, they get all their history lessons from government funded public schools instead of getting out of the control grid and learning about "real history."
First, China does not have the total capabilities required to sustain non-alliance military action in other regions so that's off the table--for now. Second, Iraq had a history of State Terrorism (and using WMD's). We did not find any WMDs. The intelligent person has to ask why. Did Saddam make a couple and use them? This is extremely unlikely--possible though. The more likely scenario is that he moved remaining WMDs through Syrian and other channels. Third, Iraq was accused of State Sponsored Terrorism. States participate in "guerrilla war" all the time. It gives them a chance to try and achieve an objective without getting their hands dirty.
Wait til we bomb Iran and they join in support to fight against the US. They already have 1000 volunteers that promised to suicide bomb the US military bases in Iraq.
Did I say that? You just LOVE putting words in people's mouths don't you? The first war ended in a cease fire. US and allies had the right to go in at a later date, if Saddam did not abide by the cease fire terms.
You know I was reading through this thread and was not going to chime in on it until I read this. I would assume that the troops you are talking about are not American Troops. However, if this is what you are referring to then you need to get a clue. How long did you serve in Iraq? I would assume not at all. The soldiers there have it hard enough without having comments made about them by people that have no idea what it is they are really doing. While yes there were a few that did violate laws and are being punished for it, this does not mean that the other 99.99% of them are doing this. In fact they are there doing their jobs even if they agree with the war or not. I served for 10 years and was part of the first Gulf War. My younger brother spent a year in Iraq this time and watched as friends were killed by the road side bombs being placed all the time for them to come upon and in the hopes of some insurgents "die". When you make comments such as "troops murdering and raping citizens" it does nothing good for the soldiers there who had no control over the situation. While yes I believe that President Bush used September 11th as an excuse to take out Saddam. I still support our troops no matter the price. They and the Iraqi people who want peace and freedom are the ones paying the price right now for the decisions of our government and that of the insurgents who are bombing and killing their own people. My hope is that we will remove our troops from there as soon as possible, but we cannot do that now until there is a fair bit of stability for them to do so. Unfortunately as someone earlier said in a comment "they will be fighting each other for 10 years now" This has been the way of the middle east unfortunately for over 3000 years and was until recently the way it was in the western world as well. No we cannot hope to force our way of life unto others as some think. What would we do here if that happened to us? We would take the fight to the invaders. We instead should respect others religions and ways of life and instead deal with them in an understanding manner and one that recognizes their uniqueness. This has not always happened and thus is where the United States has been seeing the type of hatred that we see now towards us in the middle east. So yes you should and can have your view, but at least show a certain amount of respect for the 18, 19 and 20 year old kids and many others that are dieing there every week. Kevin
You are right lorien. We ended the war with a cease fire. We never ended the actual war per say. This is why we spent the next 10 years patroling their skies with our planes. Also Iraq invaded a smaller nation because they wanted the ports. We in turn defended and returned this country back to its rightful government along with many nations from around the world. Was our invasion of Iraq this time wrong? Most likely, but they could hardly be called a model nation towards their neighbors and in terms of terrorism. I have no doubt that the old Iraqi government was supporting terrorism. So in some ways we may have tried to stop this from spreading, but created a few more issues for us. Now the question is how long is it going to take us to remove ourselves from there and still continue doing some long lasting good. Our support of the new government there is going to be an ongoing issue for years to come. Lets hope we can at least come out of this with the knowledge we did not invade them and do nothing in the long run for the Iraqi people, but help a more evil dictator come to power.
The rebuilding of germany was considered a failure for a long time after WW2 too. Its way too soon to tell how its gonna turn out. And germany was pretty much a homogenous people, while Iraq is really 3 different groups of people who have hated each other for centuries, only forced together in the 50's (??) by Britain. I think Iraq was a necessary step to cut the head off the snake, personally. Separate Iran from the other ME countries and hope that separation helps Iran takes care of itself by allowing the younger people who want reform to make reform possible. I don't think it'll happen right now, but in the future, who knows.
You said you served in the military, so you've heard of Delta Force and SAS, right? You do know that those guys carry out black operations in Iraq all the time. They are brainwashed and trained to go kill innocent people so that it can make the insurgency "worse" than it already is. Are there real Iraqi insurgents? Sure there are some. But many of the rapes, murders, and bombings are bring carried out by troops in "deep cover." As I said in my previous posts, SAS British troops were caught dressed up like Arabs last year shooting Iraqi police. What is that all about? The answer is simple. Certain elements in our government need Iraq to end up in a civil war so they can fully conquer the country and use it as a launch pad to attack Iran and other nations. This is not about supporting the troops. Our own government doesn't support them. Henry Kissinger called military men "stupid fools" that are "pawns" to be used in foreign policy. It is not about supporting the troops. It is about NOT supporting a government who feeds troops into the meat grinder so a few old men at the top can get rich. That is what is is all about. Rich people profit from wars. I don't understand why that is so hard for people here at DP to understand. Besides, if our government cared so much about the troops, why did soldiers have to complain to Rumsfeld last year to put armor on the damn humvees? And why did I see a soldier a few weeks ago on the new that was paralyzed and was getting the run around from the government about getting his checks? Our government treats the soldiers worse than anything. Don't even get me started with the depleted uranium the troops are being exposed to.
Well, you assume wrong. That's where I have to disagree. Saying there are a "few" doing it, is like saying there are only a "few" bombs going off in Iraq. You can chose to pretend it's not a big problem, but from what I've read and seen since we've been there it's a widespread problem and MOST OF THEM are not being punished. If you ask me that's a lack of morality, character and courage. If you don't agree with costing thousands of families their lives including our own, then you should stand up for what you believe in instead of serving a worthless scum bag like George Bush. If we stopped invading countries and stopped supporting Israel, we wouldn't have any terrorism to worry about. But instead we're over there dropping bombs on peoples homes and shooting their children. That's not going to create anymore terrorism or hatred against us now is it It's a shame they are dying, at least ones who do actually care about the Iraqi people. But again, I just find it really hard to have sympathy for people who willingly signed up and have now helped in the destruction of Iraqs communities and the murder of thousands of innocent people. I give my full support and sympathy to those who are only there because they signed and are forced, and don't agree with whats going on.
Kevin thank you for your service. Please thank your brother as well. Please realize no matter what the cause, cost, or result, there are people who do support and respect you. Thank you! It sickens me that while there are "18, 19, and 20" year olds as you mentioned giving their lives for others, there is someone around the same age that does nothing but shame them. These brave men and women are serving you and me Yo-Yo, not their president.
Yoyo, it is important to always remember that the globalists run "game theory psychological scenarios." They know what the average person will do based on their actions. For example, my brother is having a hard time getting to where he wants to be in life, and he isn't getting the type of job he wants. One day, he tells me that he should just go join the military. I told him he was a fool, and is playing into the hands of the NWO. The NWO expects young men who can't find good jobs to join the military because the NWO destroyed the damn economy in the first place! I told my brother that he is being manipulated, and pointing out a better solution to his problem. Yoyo, many people are brainwashed. They don't understand the minds of the globalists the way you, I, and a few other people here at DP do. That is why we must try to educate them and wake them up.
They certianly aren't serving me or they would be at home with their families and not in a country on the other side of the world where we shouldn't have ever been in the first place.
Wrong. They ARE NOT serving us! How has the average American benefited from this war!? The only people making millions is the president and his father!!! They are the people being served. Nothing happening in Iraq has an effect on my life. I'm not richer or poorer because of the war, and "freedom" has nothing to do with it, though that is what the mass media would have you believe.
Mia, I fully realize a large number of these 18 and 19 year olds (immature kids) were coaxed into signing up. I understand they weren't properly trained or given the tools needed to succeed in a war, especially in Iraq. I can only hope to understand how terrible that must feel. The fact that you are proud to have these young kids dying for you is disgusting. And the fact that they are so lost out there and have so little authority that these thing can go on is only proof that we should have never gone to start with. Drugde just had an article about an Iraq vet stabbing his wife 70 some times - what do you think that says?
Well they are certainly a lot more mature than you will ever be. I'd say someone that stabs anyone 70 times had some issues prior to being a vet. I recall a Marine killing a president with a single shot. As usual, your logic is perversely flawed.
A large number of 18 and 19 year old kids in the country come from broken households, and "think" they have no choice but to go to the military because they've been brainwashed. The economy has been weakened, and finding good jobs is tough. Some people see the military as their only way out....... When you go into the military, they break you down and rebuild you in "their" image. Not the image YOU want, but their image. There is a name for that........Its called mind control. Yet I'm called the conspiracy nut when the CIA has been involved in so many mind control projects its not even funny.........like MKULTRA. Most humans(except for sociopaths) have a mechanism within them that keeps them from killing other people easily. But when you go into the military, they work to get rid of that....... When I hear about a veteran stabbing his wife over 70 times, that tells me it worked..... If you are talking about Lee Harvey Oswald, over 50% of Americans now believe JFK was hit as a result of a conspiracy. Oswald was a patsy thats why he was killed right after the murder so he wouldn't go to trial...........and testify.