We didn't do it without force. A lot of people died and suffered during the cold war. Vietnam for example.
Are you going to write it in crayon next? Where is the cite to this actual classified report? You don't have one, well I am shocked. Certainly you are not just repeating random hearsay are you? I am sure ThraXed is in on the need to know basis and got your copy directly from the DOD. Seriously, do you think because you use a bigger size font your point has more support? Do you think that Saddam treated his people well? You already answered that and that is your shame to live with. P.S. I love you you think you are making Saddam look good by telling everyone he only gassed Iranians and that it was the Iranians who gassed the Kurds. All you are doing is showing that both Iran and Iraq were a threat to the world.
Im talking about the collapse of USSR, what Vietnam or Afghanistan has got to do anything with this? You did it without force, I didnt see a single american soldier on a russian terriroty, instead it was a revolution, where russians were killing own people.
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9902E7DD1638F932A05752C0A9659C8B63 There, that better? NY times? For someone who is supposed to be one of the most honest people on this forum, i am yet to see this 'honesty'
No, I dont, I dont care what happens outside of the Russian Federation unlike you Vietnam is miles away from me, why whould I? They can deal themselves. Do you mean this:
The point, made in your link is simple: "But the truth is, all we know for certain is that Kurds were bombarded with poison gas that day at Halabja." Take your pick, Iran or Iraq? Saddam was a bad leader, and treated his own citizens badly, regardless of whether it was his poison or Iranian poison that killed the Kurds. I do not base my opinion of Saddam solely on the notion he gassed the Kurds. On the other hand, you seem to base your defense of Saddam on the fact that he didn't when that is it even accepted by your own cited sources. Again, either way, Saddam used poison gas and so did Iran.
browntwn, so you should be against the fact of Turkish Air Force bombing kurds in Iraq now, right ? I know the official US didnt like it, just asking you now Or is it just that MUCH matters to you: gas or bomb ?
The US and Russia fought many proxy wars during the cold war. I don't care if you have an interest or care about Vietnam, but you should understand how world events involving the USSR and the West led to the downfall of the USSR. I am not saying anything bad about the USSR or Russia, it is just a part of history. From the Cuban missile crisis - to the modern day events in Poland and Georgia all have an impact. I am surprised you don't understand the big picture aspect of these events.
Yes, Iran and Iraq used gas against each other, in a war, which the USA has also done many times. At least you now admit, Saddam did not gas his own people, as you and many have claimed here several times, but it will take more convincing that you are not a bigot.
Oh, I do understand them, that US now is like the old USSR, sticking their nose everywhere. Im glad we are not like that anymore. What Im just saying, is you didnt do it directly with your forces like you do it in all other countries. Proxies are fine, I know about them, theres another one, which is Georgia. And things go tight right now between NATO-Russia.
US and USSR butted heads hard for 40 years. Both sides were determined to take every opportunity to strengthen their position and to weaken the other's. Vietnam was a stand against the spread of Soviet supported communism. It was basically a proxy war in which the USSR supplied the North Vietnamese. Just as when the USSR invaded Afghanistan to help bring it under control of communism, the US supplied the Afghani rebels. Vietnam and Afghanistan can't be factored out of the decades long struggle, they were both integral to it. Had the US allowed the USSR to spread its influence without a challenge(even militarily), then the USSR would have had an better chance of overcoming their problems when hard times came. It's like an arm wrestling match where the two men seem to be evenly matched, but eventually one of their arms gives out.
I don't know enough about the situation between the Kurds and Turkey to have a educated opinion on the subject. If the Kurds in Iraq are trying to create a Kurdish state from parts of Turkey then I would understand Turkey's opposition to that. The details of who exactly is being bombed and why is not clear to me.
I admit no such thing and nor does your cited article. What is says is that it is unclear whose gas [Iran or Iraq] killed the Kurds. You seem to think that was Saddam's only bad act. There are many. Your entire defense of Saddam is based on the he didn't kill the Kurds with gas. Get real. He brutalized his own people time and time again. Don't pretend to be that ignorant.
Like Stalin did? What if Saddam was a USSR leader? Would you go and lose that much "just to establish a democracy in a region miles away from you" ? I doubt it. Its a common sense: the big fish eats small one.
No browntwn, this is just more intellectual dishonesty from you. The study asserts it was Iranian gas that killed the kurds. As i said, you will churn like a bird that i am a Saddam defender, i'm not, i am just trying to present an unbiased view, with facts, unlike you with how you try to paint him as some genocidal maniac, very biased and dishonest.
USSR would have been able to inflict much damage on the US so there was a much bigger downside. I am not in support of using the US military to impose democracy around the world. I do think we should support it and let it develop naturally with support of the people. I think we should support those who support our way of thinking and values.
I am. Mainly the USSR but I think there are many in power in Russia, including Putin, who played a part in the Soviet machine and who may or may not mind going back there.