Interesting...

Discussion in 'Google' started by fryman, Dec 1, 2004.

  1. #1
    I have always struggled with my main keyword. It used to be #10 for a few days at Google, bringing me great traffic, then it would be bumped down to #11, loosing almost 30% of my traffic. I just couldn't get a stable rank for it.

    I then started browsing for some sites to advertise mine. I only chose sitewide links on sites that had at least 2k pages indexed (I have found incredible bargains at sites that have over 6k pages indexed!). After a few week of doing this I checked at Marketleap, and I now have an amazing number of backlinks, and they continue to increase every single day (I have about 16,500 right now).

    Yahoo shows over 4,500 backlinks; as always, Google hides them and shows... how many do you think? No, not 1,000... not 800... not 500... lol, only 380!

    Anyway, since I started doing this, my keyword has stuck on the first page. It still jumps up and down a bit, but it doesn't get bumped down to the second page as it used to. Heck, right now I am ranked at #8!! I even passed a lousy spammer that has made me mad and has always been #9 using hidden text and similar tactics.

    So, this proves 2 things:

    Don't cheat the engines. Play fair, it may take a longer time, but one day you will get a good rank

    And I guess it also proves that advertising your site using sitewide links isn't penalized as many people here think.

    Any opinions about this? Any similar cases?
     
    fryman, Dec 1, 2004 IP
  2. leo

    leo Peon

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    #2
    Not an opinion but a question: what do you mean by sitewide links?
     
    leo, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  3. joeychgo

    joeychgo Notable Member

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    #3

    He means a link that appears on every page - like in the footer...


    Anyone know if this works on a long term basis?
     
    joeychgo, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  4. leo

    leo Peon

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    #4
    I see, thanks for info! And how do you induce people to put a link of that kind on their pages? What is their benefit doing that?
     
    leo, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  5. joeychgo

    joeychgo Notable Member

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    #5
    you would either pay them for the link or trade links with them
     
    joeychgo, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  6. nohaber

    nohaber Well-Known Member

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    #6
    It isn't penalized. If it were, everyone would be giving the competition site wide links :D
    Thing is, it works now. It would probably work in the long term. The problem is the these links are votes from the same site. It's like having a lot of votes from a single party and few votes from others. I would think that SEs should devalue these links (not penalize, not ignore) but devalue a bit. They still bring relevancy ranking though.
    Of course, if all those links were from different sites, they would bring more relevancy everything else being equal (PR).
     
    nohaber, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  7. joeychgo

    joeychgo Notable Member

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    #7
    well - what if I had say 5 sites I was trading these kind of links with -- all similar sites?
     
    joeychgo, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  8. fryman

    fryman Kiss my rep

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    #8
    This is paid advertising, so they are non-reciprocal links.

    I did say "penalized" because I have seen many silly post of people saying that sitewide links could get you banned. Some people even said that if you get some of these links and use them to point to a competitor you will get him banned (I know... stupid, but some people still believe that).
     
    fryman, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  9. nohaber

    nohaber Well-Known Member

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    #9
    Some of the most popular sites like phpbb and dmoz have loads of site-wide links. No penalty for them :D
     
    nohaber, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  10. zamolxes

    zamolxes Peon

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    #10
    Having links from a variety of domains/ips is still preferable.
     
    zamolxes, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  11. lorien1973

    lorien1973 Notable Member

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    #11
    I buy sitewides all the time. I only buy them on sites that are related to me (more specifically, related to a page inside my site); and they have helped tremendously. I'm top 10 on I think 70% of my keywords now. Top 20 on like 87% #1 on 30% I think. Sitewides aren't punished - but their effect can be delayed if there is a little doubt in google as to its relevance (I've seen sitewides knock pages of mine off google for 4-5 days, then it reappears and comes back with the effect of the sitewide in tact).

    After you see the power of good super related links, they are like crack. You keep wanting more and more LOL.
     
    lorien1973, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  12. T0PS3O

    T0PS3O Feel Good PLC

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    #12
    What's the turnover on your discountmart site Lorien? Or is the tvproducts your cash cow?
     
    T0PS3O, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  13. lorien1973

    lorien1973 Notable Member

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    #13
    You mean conversion rates? Um, its something I'd rather not share if you understand, but its very low on ODM; tvproducts converts substantially better - but profit/sale is very low, so its a volume business.

    I just recently redesigned discountmart to look better, and I'm hoping that'll improve conversions in the future.

    The adsense ads on odm make it a lot less stressful to make sales, as the clickthru rate is tremendous cuz of ad placement.
     
    lorien1973, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  14. Such Great Heights

    Such Great Heights Peon

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    #14
    Sounds like you could achieve just this ... site wide links on many different sites with the coop ad network.
     
    Such Great Heights, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  15. lorien1973

    lorien1973 Notable Member

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    #15
    The very nature of randomness makes coop network sitewides virtually impossible to acheive. You could probably easily get 5-10 links from a single site, but a sitewide? I wonder what the odds on that happening would be.
     
    lorien1973, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  16. SEbasic

    SEbasic Peon

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    #16
    It would depend on your weight I guess.
     
    SEbasic, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  17. DarrenC

    DarrenC Peon

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    #17
    nohaber, I remember phpBB getting a penalty a while back for "selling" links on its homepage. So your comments are not strictly true.
     
    DarrenC, Dec 2, 2004 IP
  18. kewler

    kewler Peon

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    #18
    fryman - congratulations on your success.
    How old is your site? - is that the fresh site bonus?
    Which PR do your sitewides linking site have? How long have you been using them? It could be that effect vanishes a few weeks later as the "fresh"ness effect is over...

    cheers
     
    kewler, Dec 3, 2004 IP
  19. fryman

    fryman Kiss my rep

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    #19
    Site has been online since March.

    I have no idea of the PR of the sites, my toolbar vanished and I can't get it back.
    I really don't care about the PR, but I am sure non of them is over PR5. I have tried to get only sites that are a bit related to mine (not the same theme, but they get the same kind of visitors, young people). I also tried to get links on sitesd with at least 1.5k pages indexed. Backlinks at Marketleap show over 17,500 now, and increasing every day...
     
    fryman, Dec 3, 2004 IP
  20. Dirkjan

    Dirkjan The Dutch SEO Guy

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    #20
    They are hubs.

    The 2 most important sites for Google are Authorities (sites with a lot of content, lot of imbound links, not too many outlinks and if they outlink they probably link some actual or high rated content) and hubs (sites with many inbound links, and many many outlinks.

    If people search for something and Google is not sure he gives the best option, he gives hubs high because there is a good chance that they find there what they are looking for.

    DMOZ and Yahoo only work if they have very high links to them. DMOZ and Yahoo are both linked by content of Google... They ARE high hubs.
     
    Dirkjan, Dec 4, 2004 IP