Well, yeah, I understand this option won't be easy. But we have to do soemthing about religions. People are also killing eachother because of that. This is a particular example. I was meaning in general. Anyway, differences looks not good. Past posts in this thread show that, in New Mexico, people speak, live and eat spanish. What local people think: "they should learn to speak english" Well, I agree. It is integration.
I was out exploring some deserted tropical islands on wednesday, and we found 3 cuban boats and trash all over the place, whats up with illegals littering so much. Sure maybe they were dying of dehydration but still, funniest thing we found was a shirt with a american flag on it that said "american" , I wonder if one thought that was a good shirt to wear to blend in?
Rick, I grew up in a city of immigrants, one of the 'original' and most historical cities of the United States of America, and never experienced what you did. Either way, I don't think our personal experience is neccesarily relevant, not neccesarily carrying the weight that either you or I might wish it to convey upon a predicament so vast.
libertate replies: Yes, your thin veneer is showing. libertate replies: No, libertate, you would have to be living with your head up your butt not to be able to accept the obvious relativity of my example. If that is the case I probably shouldn't even waste my time responding to you. Actually, so could I. Talk about stereotyping. I am not suggesting these are the only jobs they "will" do... I am telling you that these are 99% of the jobs that folks here will pay them to do, and that, praise God, they are only too happy to accept. I am not limiting them, you (your attitude towards them) are by not granting them legal guest worker status. libertate writes: What a crock of bull. Why then would employers give these jobs to illegals, especially in the current political climate? Hunh? What the ----??? libertate responds: Like I said, you have no idea who I am either, now, do you? Again, like I said earlier... what a crock.
Dead Corn, You provided no discussion points, simply attacked me, personally. Illegal imigration is the topic of the discourse.
I don’t agree that Europe should accept emigrants from other countries either than European Nations because we simply don’t need to. If our governments took the time to promote a unified labor market whereby workers would be offered decent conditions in which they could go work in neighboring countries for fair pay I’m sure things would work out to everyone’s advantage. Some countries have 10% unemployment rate and am sure these workers would appreciate a job in other richer countries if they knew their rights and safety would be respected. If I go to my local unemployment office all I have is a small board with a few jobs for other European nations which most of the times are outdated. I’m sure if people new about the jobs offerings in other countries they would actually apply for a position.
The only thing that needs to be done in any industrialized nation is 1) Something to the extent of what you're refering to 2) tax incentives to have 2-3 children...therefore keeping a descent level of population stability and equality in production. I think Australia recently did the 2nd option. I'd say Japan's a clear example that immigration isn't necessarily needed, although they really do need to put in more tax incentives to produce more offsprings. To me that's the only conceiveable reason why a country needs immigration. Not for cheap labor, but to supplement failed policies within...particular concerning the circumstance of older people vs young. Although my position on abortion isn't quite certain, I know for sure we wouldn't need immigration at all if abortions didn't happen.
Well in Europe we have very good maternity subsidies and that didn’t get us anywhere. The only ones that actually took advantaged where the immigrants and that’s why many nations like France are thinking twice about continuing with them. In France currently some people earn more money with their children than working a full time job. The same applies to many Northern European nations like Norway. The problem is that Europeans aren’t moving from one country to the other in search of job opportunities looking for work. If you think about it I’m only 2 hours from London, Paris and 1 hour from Madrid. Yet these countries seem so far away because of all the complications in applying for a job in those countries.
Guess it depends on the enviroment. From what I heard, Australia did well with it...but needs to continue on with it. Too much paperwork to just work in another EU country?.... In all those years that was worked-on? That I did not know.
May be because it is not true, you basically need to go police station and say I am here if your country is a member of EU.
That's right. And for the family matter, right again. North African immigrants use to make lots of kids, so they can get more than a full time job paycheck. So then, they don't need to integrate themselves... That has been included in the Jose Maria AZNAR thoughts about the immigration problem. He's right and nobody is listening...untill it'll be too late...
You were answered, point by point, in sync with the rythym of your choice. If you don't like the heat in the kitchen...
Many companies accept fake IDs and social security cards, or hire people under 'independent contractor' contracts in order to avoid having to worry about their employees taxes. And with the 'independent contractor' contracts, they can avoid any chance of having to provide benifits. This creates situations were some businesses may be hiring illegals without realizing they are doing it.
000000000000 I wish I had the article. Apparently there's many companies that offer that as an SS for their worker. LMAO. It's quite a few...but I can't remember the number.
Here's an article I found by googling...not sure if it's the right number, as I had one directly from government sources once. But apparently they're saying it comes from a government source... *shrug* http://arizona.indymedia.org/news/2006/06/44668.php
Nonsense. Sorry, guys, you are all wrong here. See, this is the dirty little secret the gov't doesn't want you to know. They do not hire under false ID's to avoid paying taxes, they PAY those taxes, the worker does, his unemployment, FUTA, SUTA, and Social Security. The employer inturn reports those taxes and contributes per the law. The thing here is that these illegal aliens cannot benefit from these very taxes they are paying. They cannot claim social security when, by age, they would normally have been eligible. They can never receive unemployment. A myriad other things as well. It's the gov'ts dirty little secret. But one heck of a cottage industry for them. Now you want to scream and hollar about the medical problem at the hospitals - fix it - give them guest worker status and take an additional tax out of their paycheck to help with this. Otherwise, like I said before - stop inviting them to the party and then, at the end of the day, telling them to go shit in their sombreros. America needs to do some soul searching here.
Even if I accepted your overly optimistic version of what good employers and good illegal aliens do, too bad. Maybe they should not come here illegally then. They do not deserve legal rights when they are illegal. This is not about the numbers for me anyway. I'm tired of people giving away my portion of the country because they have some inner calling to help criminal aliens. Why don't you give up your lifestyle and go fix Mexico. Quit bringing broken ass mexico to my doorstep and telling me it's my responsibility to it...bullshit.
Hahaha... See, couple things which are very funny about your statement: 1. I have always said that both the status of the illegal alien, the working illegal alien, and the law should change to accomodate our obvious need for (and use of) our south of the borders amigos. If this happens then they can achieve some sort of "legal" status. Is it not said that necessity is the mother of invention? 2. Hoping that "maybe they shouldn't come here illegally" well, lol, that train already left the station long ago, and, I might add, at the behest of your government and country, despite the posture of the day, like your own, to the contrary. 3. You say you're "tired of people giving aweay your portion of the country because they have some inner calling to help criminal aliens" you betray your ignorance of the causes behind this problem: it ain't about "inner calling" it's about business - pure and simple. It's industry, not psychology (albeit your obvious detestation of these unfortunates may well be). 4. You write: "Why don't you give up your lifestyle and go fix Mexico?" What life style? My single father of five children lifestyle, trying to make ends meet like every other law abiding American citizen? I ain't no bleeding heart, buddy, I'm a realist - I don't live on Camp Candy Mountain, I work my butt off in the city, and I know right from wrong - and how we invite these people in here to work, and then tell them to go shit in their hats is wrong and I don't give a shit what color you want to paint it. 5. You write: "Quit bringing broken ass mexico to my doorstep and telling me it's my responsibility to it...bullshit" I don't exactly know who you're addressing this to, but I can tell you this - I ain't bringing nobody in nowhere, I wake up in the morning, say my prayers, drop a kid or two off, and go to work. But I DO recognize that I am part of this great country, and this great country has been allowing this rich field of workers into this country forever - because we need them. That also makes telling the truth about the deal MY RESPONSIBILITY because I am a voter who recognizes how this effects my precious land. When I listen to someone like you telling me to stop talking the truth it only makes me that much more assured I must talk it - louder and louder. And louder still.
I don't care about them. I don't care about them. I don't care about them. There is no mystery here. I don't invite them here either. Double talkers like you make a nice little wussy nests for them to cuddle up in. "We're sorry you had a rough time avoiding the INS and the border agents on your illegal quest to the US. Here, let's give you our hospitals and under the table money. There there, is that better...hmmm." Bullshit. Screw business. My industry could use them more than anyone. I flat out stop selling for companies that use illegal border jumpers. It costs me money and I don't give a crap. It's not about money. Those who use that argument that the economy needs illegal aliens are cop outs. I hear no truth coming from you. And I am not telling you to stop saying anything. You can spout your rubbish all the day long. Why don't you start yet another civil rights hand out protest for the illegals...or how about a fundraiser? Maybe you work to install andy gumps and water coolers along the coyote route? I believe in civil rights FOR LEGAL AMERICAN CITIZENS, not border jumpers. People who circumvent the legal system and then look for unearned rights under that same law are pathetic and deserve nothing more than a ticket to the back of the line.