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Ignorant Paypal, Chargeback dispute.

Discussion in 'PayPal' started by AllHostOne.co.uk, Dec 22, 2011.

  1. #1
    Hello all

    Since 9th December Paypal have told me that the buyer of a webdevelopment package which I had invoiced for the seller/developer (i'll explain further soon) had intiated a chargeback under the code of 83 which means the payment was unauthorised. I really dont see how it was unauthorised because the invoice was sent to the buyer who clicked on Pay Invoice, I did not force them at all. The invoice was for $2000+. So I was looking over Paypal's guides on how to investigate and how they investigate wrong chargebacks, and what it suggests is to contact the buyer, And so over the 13 days i sent 4 emails to the buyer and I recieved no reply at all, and i also sent several emails to the buyer via my business email with no reply at all, So each day i added a note to the PayPal dispute page letting paypal know that the buyer does not obviously want to communicate so there is little more I could do, i also rang up PayPal to see if there was anything I could do and the person on the phone said they would put a note on my account to show that I did ring up to try and fix this.

    And so today I recieved this email from PayPal
    It does say that If my account is now in the negative that I should add funds to my account. The problem is, I cant because i dont have any funds, my account is linked to my bank account and that does not have that many funds, The money that i recieved from the buyer was sent to the seller last month. So i've been looking paypals User Agreement: https://cms.paypal.com/uk/cgi-bin/?...ntent_ID=ua/UserAgreement_full&locale.x=en_GB And if you look at 5.2 :
    At no point in that paragraph does it say that any money owed will be taken from my bank account. So if i keep checking my bank every day I should not see a payment taken out of my bank from paypal for this money? And what exactly does it mean "set-off"?

    As i mentioned at the beginning, I am in sense, the middle man , This person has several other people working for him doing the same job, invoicing people for web based products (web development etc) and forwarding the money onto him minus a $500 fee (to keep for your self). I have done 2 invoices and i've only had 1 of them chargeback so far. Last time i heard from him was a few weeks back when he had just come out from hospital, So several times during this I have emailed him with no reply and also tried to contact him on MSN, I have no idea wether he is just simply blocked/ignoring me or is genuinally away from a computer/msn/internet or back in hospital. So i have got my friend to add him on MSN and to monitor wether or not he comes online so i can see if he's blocking me or not.

    I was going to do a chargeback on one of the payments i sent to the seller but because it was sent money abroad option on my bank, I rang them up earlier and they said they would take a £25.00 fee from me for the chargeback but it would not gurantee that i would get the money back, so even if i did not get the money back i would still be £25.00 out of pocket.

    So, so far im a bit confused and not exactly sure what I should do. Supposing reading the email the credit card company from the buyer could still delcine to continue the chargeback and my paypal balance will be returned to a netural state.

    Regards
     
    AllHostOne.co.uk, Dec 22, 2011 IP
  2. coolu

    coolu Member Premium Member

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    #2
    you should call paypal via skype for free and tell them the situation about it
     
    coolu, Dec 22, 2011 IP
  3. AllHostOne.co.uk

    AllHostOne.co.uk Member

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    #3
    Paypall should know because i've included in the numerous notes I added on the dispute to speak to this person and it's pretty obvious they decieded not to
     
    AllHostOne.co.uk, Dec 22, 2011 IP
  4. contentboss

    contentboss Peon

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    #4
    If he's charged back via his credit card, your changes of a win here are slim. Credit card companies normally side with the customer, and Paypal aren't going to reimburse you.

    Lesson - if you are selling something of value, get some of the money upfront.

    And you should also do him the honour of submitting him to a few of the online bad credit check sites. You'd be AMAZED how often we see 'banned' people come back for a second bite at the cherry, and it's cool to automatically direct them to a 'go away, thief' page.
     
    contentboss, Dec 22, 2011 IP
  5. theonly1

    theonly1 Active Member

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    #5
    all your notes in fispute page are useless.believe me no one in Paypal even read them
     
    theonly1, Dec 22, 2011 IP
  6. Rohail Enterprise

    Rohail Enterprise Member

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    #6
    This, but also through team viewer confirm that their source of payment.. Make sure it is NOT credit card funded.
     
    Rohail Enterprise, Dec 22, 2011 IP
  7. AllHostOne.co.uk

    AllHostOne.co.uk Member

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    #7
    I've sent in a complaint to PayPal telling them how discusted I am, I've requested that they tell me all the details of how they investigated and what made them go for the buyers side, Hopfully they'll reply, although im sure they will reply with some stupid standard email which will make no sense at all.

    @theonly1 Well when I rang them a few days ago they said they could see all the notes and that they would all be read, So i've asked them in the email aswell that if they read the notes they would of been able to do something about it and search deeper, wether or not they did.....


    Does anyone know if Paypal will end up taking the money from my bank account or not? Looking through there agreement which i quoted above, it doesnt seem that they would although im not sure.
     
    AllHostOne.co.uk, Dec 22, 2011 IP
  8. ~~~~

    ~~~~ Well-Known Member

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    #8
    I don't think they can take the money from your bank account, however they may make your Paypal Balance negative which you'll have to bring back to zero, if you wish to use the account.
     
    ~~~~, Dec 23, 2011 IP
  9. M8INTERNET

    M8INTERNET Member

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    #9
    As above, this is an expensive lesson to learn
    Agreed, a deposit up front would have confirmed if the buyer was not on a scam with you
    This matter is complicated further by you being in UK and the buyer being in US, as well as services not being covered by seller protection

    PayPal will come to a final decision some time around the first week of February 2012, but I can be almost certain they will not reverse the decision
    However, if you have explained that the customer ordered a service which was delivered EXACTLY as they required it will be up to the Credit Card company decide
    I have had one such decision in my favour

    PayPal will not be able to withdraw excess funds from your bank account
    Instead they use a debt recovery company in the UK called Robinson, Way, & Company Limited
    They will send you two invoices for the outstanding amount, and if no payment is received 28 days after the second invoice they will lodge a CCJ against you or your company (as appropriate for the name of the PayPal account)

    For such future projects get a contract put in place, specific to the customer
    Equally, check the payment status includes verified and that the contact details match those already filed with you
     
    M8INTERNET, Dec 25, 2011 IP
  10. AllHostOne.co.uk

    AllHostOne.co.uk Member

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    #10
    Well i've been reading up on a paypal hatred site which has in their FAQ:



    - http://www.screw-paypal.com/faq.html#19
     
    AllHostOne.co.uk, Dec 25, 2011 IP
  11. Pandanger

    Pandanger Greenhorn

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    #11
    I know for a fact they will take the money out of your bank account, or at least try to. I would strongly suggest closing the bank account, and making a new PayPal account.
     
    Pandanger, Feb 19, 2012 IP