1. Advertising
    y u no do it?

    Advertising (learn more)

    Advertise virtually anything here, with CPM banner ads, CPM email ads and CPC contextual links. You can target relevant areas of the site and show ads based on geographical location of the user if you wish.

    Starts at just $1 per CPM or $0.10 per CPC.

I am fed up with low paying writing gigs. Please help me.

Discussion in 'Copywriting' started by nofullstop, Jul 24, 2008.

  1. MaxineMetaphor

    MaxineMetaphor Peon

    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    #61
    Look local. That's what worked for me. That and I gave out a few freebies early on. Once you earn the confidence of a potential client, the work and money begins to follow. Don't get discouraged, and stay with it.
    SEMrush
     
    MaxineMetaphor, Aug 5, 2008 IP
    SEMrush
  2. resto

    resto Peon

    Messages:
    173
    Likes Received:
    5
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    #62

    In the land of the Internet and computers people are out sourcing like crazy.

    The pre capita income in India is $997.00 a year, in the U.S it is about $40,000 or so. Someone in India can work for 20 or 40 times cheaper then a person in the U.S. or Europe and still live well.

    $997 / 12 = $83
    $83 / 4= $20
    $20 / 5= $4

    Someone in India could make $4 a day and make the average per capita income, .001 a word is good money to some people.

    1000 words a day someone could make double the per capita income, even at $2 for 500 words that’s average income. Run a couple of articles trough the spinner and make a days wage before teatime, living the good life.

    It’s becoming a global economy.
     
    resto, Aug 5, 2008 IP
    SEOLinker likes this.
  3. nofullstop

    nofullstop Peon

    Messages:
    1,396
    Likes Received:
    28
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    #63
    Statistics just don't make sense to me. I am from India and now let me write a couple of lines over here.

    It is not so that I was offended with what you wrote but I think it requires correction.

    I don't know the exact number but I think more than half of the Indian population is below poverty line and still MOST of them just don't use Internet. Here we are discussing about the income by freelance writing and hence those below poverty line should NOT be included in the analysis which you made.

    For the rest 1k isn't the avg. income per year but you can say for the upper middle class (which actually will turns up to do writing work as they are the ones who know English and dream of huge incomes) $800 (approximation) is the avg. income per month.

    Their is a family in my area whose business is selling cigarettes and they earn around $100 per month of this business and they seem to be content with that income. For my family I am the one who spends $200 monthly only on my friends. Monthly family budget is much higher.

    So their is that difference which people should consider before labeling India a poor country.

    I agree that we are way behind countries like US and UK but please don't think that our average income is $997 per year :eek:

    Just felt like I should leave some corrections :p
     
    nofullstop, Aug 5, 2008 IP
  4. End2End

    End2End Member

    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    2
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    43
    #64
    My friend,

    Let me give you a very honest and maybe rude reply.
    The days are gone when people used to earn money from hard work.
    Last update, I think it was pre-historic times, when you had to hunt to eat.

    Today, Hard work has no value. Try switching to smart work.
    You live around SEMs, learn the art. It is better than investing time on your content writing.

    The following sentences are being said, not to let you down or to show how rich i am, but to tell you the importance of SEO.

    I am 29 years old, from a middle class family. 5 years ago I started my own business, investing nothing only $100 to buy a computer on installments.
    Today, I have 3 companies, cumulative turn over of USD 5 Million.
    I can get SEMs on a flash of a finger, but I have been learning it myself since last 1 year. I know this is the future. The world would change in another 20 years. Everything would happen on internet, or thru internet. I havent seen the future, but that is my assumption. Internet would be 3 times more powerful than today.

    Anyways,

    If you still want to do content writing, I will give you the job, maybe offer you $500 a month. :) Depends on your caliber.
    Get in touch with me if you are interested.

    You c, this is an example of smart work.
    I know I can earn $500 from 1 article written by you, for which I will pay you maybe $5.
    :)
    The offer is open, email me anytime.

    Thanks!
     
    End2End, Aug 5, 2008 IP
  5. marketjunction

    marketjunction Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,779
    Likes Received:
    187
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    183
    #65
    According to current estimates, 25% of India's population is below the poverty line.

    In 2005, India had 60 million Internet users. Don't know what it's at now, but that number suggests that many in India don't use the Internet.

    As to per capita income, it's on the rise and has been since 2000--where it was very low.

    I believe the per capital is now approaching $3,000 annually. Resto is looking at some old data. ;) Some have predicted it will rise to $15k+ within 40 years.

    However, I believe what Resto was trying to point out is that people in India can be hired far cheaper than someone in the US, because of cost of living, etc. Hiring a US worker is 20+ times more expensive.

    But that should be obvious. That's why US companies outsource to India, Mexico, China, the Philippines, etc.
     
    marketjunction, Aug 5, 2008 IP
  6. lightless

    lightless Notable Member

    Messages:
    3,850
    Likes Received:
    334
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    230
    #66
    Good writers are a breed apart from the average Joe of their country. They are smarter, more knowledgeable and educated. Thus they aspire to higher incomes than the rest of the average Joes in their country. So a writer's income shouldn't be compared with that of an average Joe in my opinion :D

    Although the picture is complicated by average Joe's who pose as writers. ;)
     
    lightless, Aug 5, 2008 IP
  7. SEOLinker

    SEOLinker Banned

    Messages:
    1,599
    Likes Received:
    33
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    #67
    In my town in Ukraine I would say average income like $500-$600 dollar, real one, not stupid stats, that $100/month and lower incomes were true 8-10 years ago. In Kyiv, capital up to $1000. Which $100, lol ? Rent in capital starts from $450.

    If someone calls countries developing it also means that salaries there grow as well, not only providing $2 slaves, lol. If we are talking about taking ALL jobs from DP (and making living from it) it's better just to go to outsourcing firm for job. Pay will be the same and less stress.

    As Jason said above it's cheaper for sure hire someone in english speaking Asia for that job. But overall looking at the rates, I would say (taking quality in account as well) 4 times cheaper. Not 20+ for sure, it's simply not true.

    I just showed that $2 offer to my friend, he laughed at it.
     
    SEOLinker, Aug 5, 2008 IP
  8. marketjunction

    marketjunction Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,779
    Likes Received:
    187
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    183
    #68
    Actually, it is about 20x (okay, might be 14-15x) for certain jobs, because there's also insurance and other things at play here.

    I know it's not 4x cheaper. You said the average income in your capital is $1,000 monthly (right?).

    Care to guess what the average income is in our capital? :) Hint: it's well over 20x that of course.

    But, let's keep with your $1,000 for a moment. And let's imagine it's for 160 hours (40 hour weeks). That comes out to be $6.25 USD hourly.

    According to Forbes in 2006 (these figures are higher now), the cost to companies for an auto worker--hell, we're not even talking doctors and stuff--was $70 - $76 hourly for Ford, BM and Chrysler.

    Doing the quick math, you can see that these autoworkers are about 12x the cost of the average person in your capital city. And that's just autoworkers.

    IMHO, residents in developing countries are at an advantage. Take online work. If they can learn to do it at the level of someone living in a developed country (USA, EU, etc), they can afford to charge less and "afford more" in their economy.

    It would be like if I suddenly moved to the Philippines. I'd live like a king there. I could afford servants and so forth (yeah, sadly, I looked into one day). ;)

    If you're a capitalist, like me, globalization has been an exciting ride and it's only getting better.

    Thanks to globalization, I can hire competent people from other areas of the world at a fraction of what it would cost me to hire someone here (or do it myself).

    Um, where is this conversation going? What was the original post about? Niles is that you? I need an espresso.

    :D
     
    marketjunction, Aug 5, 2008 IP
  9. SEOLinker

    SEOLinker Banned

    Messages:
    1,599
    Likes Received:
    33
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    #69
    Mmm....well, yes, some sort of, problem is goods costs more in 3rd world. I mean cars, electronics, clothes, etc. etc. Services are may cheaper for sure. Prepare to pay upto $50k for new toyota camry here for example and with interest (if we are talking about credit) like 12% yearly or more. Same goes with real estate. It costs $800-2000 for square meter in average. And credits even higher (up to 20% sometimes) cause our banks take credits in US banks, lol

    Also it vary which service. Restaurants are not cheap comparing with US I would say. It's the same or even more sometimes.

    What I mean is IT field. If someone in India charge $12/hour for programing he would charge in USA about $50/hour. But in DP it's kinds $5-6/hour mostly nowadays wich is not so attractive even for 3rd world if we talk about IT. Saying that low cost services on DP scum mostly. Cause these guys can get this jobs locally without problems, not begging in DP.

    By the way I am seeing lot of people lately from US and EU in my town with business goals. Probably it means business opportunities:)

    And yes I would like to know what average income in New York:) I am thinking about $6-8k monthly. But 250k (which is even $20k/month let's say) a year ? Sounds a lot.
     
    SEOLinker, Aug 6, 2008 IP
  10. sleuth1

    sleuth1 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    7
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    108
    #70
    Here is a thought from an outsider, become an expert on a subject you like and have a passion for and write about that, differentiate yourself by your writing subject, ideas and style

    Everyone is a writer these days (on the internet) you wont get a lot of sympathy for your plight because to write for a living seems odd to many bloggers (for instance) since they are already doing it for nix.

    The best writers are often not "writers", many "writers" are shockingly boring or absurdly verbose and seem to be writing "fillers" rather than anything useful to others

    If you write with punch, get peoples attention, then you will get gigs, stop writing for "writers" and their often pompous ritualisms.The quality of many of the so called articles written for DP is terrible. Articles put up here sometimes have overt Asian or Eastern European "accents" Surely you can kick ass on this level alone. Good luck .:)
     
    sleuth1, Aug 6, 2008 IP
  11. resto

    resto Peon

    Messages:
    173
    Likes Received:
    5
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    #71
    India was probably a bad example because I have never been there and don’t know much about it or the pay scale. But I was just trying to point out that in a global economy some low paying jobs are good money to some people.

    I lived in Nicaragua before and the average wage was $50-$70 a month, that’s like $2 a day and they work 10-12 hour days 6 days a week. $2 a 500 word article would be great money to them.

    I can’t write myself but if I was in Nicaragua I would hire someone that had lived in the U.S. and was fluent in English for $70 a month and have them write articles all day and sell them on the internet, give the writer $2 a day and sell 8 articles a day at $20. Get a good system going and hire an office full of people flood the market with 500 word articles for $2.50 people would buy it up all day, and people would be happy to have a comfortable job writing articles.

    Where I live I pay $900 a month rent for a 1 bedroom apartment there is no way I could make a living off of the internet forums, but if I was in a place like Nicaragua I could make money all day long and hire people and make them a living also.

    That’s global marketing sell anything anywhere and make anything anywhere, Sell in expensive places and make in inexpensive places.

    You never know when someone will go somewhere cheaper and flood your market with a cheaper price.
     
    resto, Aug 6, 2008 IP
  12. LPEZZINI

    LPEZZINI Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    45
    Likes Received:
    0
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    116
    #72
    I have been doing sales all my life and this is my two cents!

    do a few packages x -articles for $ xxx.xx,

    have a few sample articles, sell it as a backlinks magnet.

    How many article do you have out on your service?

    Do you have a website?

    focus on certain niches

    and finally....don't give up. You can be living like a king.
     
    LPEZZINI, Aug 8, 2008 IP
  13. sandarr

    sandarr Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    81
    Likes Received:
    8
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    100
    #73
    If I might jump into this conversation, don’t become discouraged. Instead look in some of the many different places for work on the Internet, there are sites that list jobs that you do not have to bid on or place a rate for prospective clients to bid on.
    Once you find the right clients they not only will pay the rate you feel comfortable with but they will become steady clients.
     
    sandarr, Aug 8, 2008 IP
  14. outspan

    outspan Active Member

    Messages:
    420
    Likes Received:
    5
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    58
    #74
    you need to get out from the crowd. It's hard but not impossible!
    My mother tongue is Italian and I've been writing articles in English for 6 months now. I got several writing gigs including Suite101.com, which is very selective, and I've become a chief editor for a site soon to be launched. I never write for less than $.03/word now.

    I started at Helium.com, which is great for feedback, then started selling my articles ad DailyArticle.com, then Constant-content.com (which is more selective), then I got a position and Suite101, made a linkedin profile, applied for a few jobs and got a position as chief editor, plus I'm writing for the first ICT magazine in Italy...

    You need to keep looking, never give up! There is a lot of competition out there but if you write QUALITY content you'll have no problems. If you get a job at Suite101 they will teach you everything you need to know about writing for the Web, I guarantee you :).

    good luck
     
    outspan, Aug 8, 2008 IP
  15. jhmattern

    jhmattern Illustrious Member

    Messages:
    8,910
    Likes Received:
    794
    Best Answers:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    455
    #75
    I used to be an editor for Suite101. I'd say they're one of the worst to attempt to teach anything about "writing for the Web." About sucks as a company, but they'll at least teach you something useful. You don't need to join a network though to learn about writing for the Web. There are plenty of free resources that are far superior to what the networks can / will teach you, and there are plenty of us making a decent living doing just that who teach you (for free) how to earn well from your writing online.
     
    jhmattern, Aug 8, 2008 IP
  16. outspan

    outspan Active Member

    Messages:
    420
    Likes Received:
    5
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    58
    #76
    When were you working for them? Was it before 2007?
    My experience with them is thoroughly positive, I believe the editors I've worked with are extremely competent and their learning material is also quite good. Most of all, mentioning writing for them got me at least 3 different positions as a freelance writer, now I'm getting through college by writing articles so I really can't complain :)
     
    outspan, Aug 8, 2008 IP
  17. jhmattern

    jhmattern Illustrious Member

    Messages:
    8,910
    Likes Received:
    794
    Best Answers:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    455
    #77
    I left in the Spring of '07 I believe, and still know plenty of unhappy writers and others who have left. I was the Technology Editor when I was there, and remember the insanity of a supposedly competent Web-based company not even understanding what the hell blogs were about (nonetheless things likes forums) - definitely not people to teach much about Web writing. There's a post with more about it on my freelance writing blog if you feel like searching.
     
    jhmattern, Aug 8, 2008 IP
  18. latoya

    latoya Active Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes Received:
    73
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    70
    #78
    To me, the good thing about learning to write for the web under a content network is that you get paid while you learn. When you venturing out on your own, your pay depends directly on your performance.

    I've been with About for 15 months. If I'd spent that time learning on my own and doing trial by error who knows when I'd have started earning some real money. It's like the "keep your day job while you build your business on the side" type of thing, except it's a lot more flexible and exciting (to me) than a day job.

    I just read that post a few days ago. If you look at "Recent Comments" you'll see some folks have been talking about it.
     
    latoya, Aug 8, 2008 IP
  19. SalviaCrazy

    SalviaCrazy Banned

    Messages:
    251
    Likes Received:
    4
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    #79
    If you are wanting to make money in the higher numbers your going to have to get highered by someone for a long term month by month job. They seem to pay more and usually ask for 1-2 articles a day. I would suggest looking for people who are looking for these type of workers, you will usually get better rates.

    Make a thread in content creation saying your looking for long term work.
     
    SalviaCrazy, Aug 8, 2008 IP
  20. outspan

    outspan Active Member

    Messages:
    420
    Likes Received:
    5
    Best Answers:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    58
    #80
    It's a pity your experience with them wasn't as positive as mine. You seem pretty pissed in your post ;). However now they're giving every writer the option to start a blog of their own, ability to comment articles and to give them a "thumbs up", etc.

    I've recently decided to apply what I've learned to a website of my own, I've just launched it a few hours ago, let's see how much I can get from it. :)


    Best,
    Dario
     
    outspan, Aug 8, 2008 IP