Hyphens - Yes or No?

Discussion in 'Search Engine Optimization' started by caroline, Sep 3, 2004.

  1. #1
    I think that domains with hypens are not all that better than normal domains with the same keywords, because Google can now see if part of a url is a keyword, regardless of whether it's hyphenated or not.

    Hyphenated domains often look spammy (well, not always) and are harder to memorize. So, I think I'll pass. What do you guys think?
     
    caroline, Sep 3, 2004 IP
  2. Will.Spencer

    Will.Spencer NetBuilder

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    #2
    Google "highlights" non-delimited portions of words, but Google does not index non-delimited portions of words.

    Hyphens are definitely your best bet for SEO.
     
    Will.Spencer, Sep 3, 2004 IP
  3. Old Welsh Guy

    Old Welsh Guy Notable Member

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    #3
    I am in agreement with will, although G identifies a portion, it does not read it as a word. How do I know? made up word, got site spidered and indexed, did a search for part of made up word, site did not show up.

    Added another made up word on the page, got site indexed, did search for first made up word and part of second made up word that was in the domain, it highlighted the part word. again did a search for the part word, no results.

    This proves that it does not return it in the results although it identifies it.
     
    Old Welsh Guy, Sep 3, 2004 IP
  4. DomainLoot

    DomainLoot Guest

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    #4
    I personally would NEVER buy anything from a hyphenated domain website...

    So, it "may" help your SEO a little (may!), but it may also NOT be that great for sales ;)

    Don't be a spammy "also ran."

    Good luck,
    Mike
     
    DomainLoot, Sep 3, 2004 IP
  5. gooner

    gooner Peon

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    #5
    If the domains available I usually go for both and setup a 301 redirect from the non hyphenated to the hyphenated domain for type-in and word of mouth traffic.

    It also helps with spam to setup your email account for the non hyphenated domain (domain that doesn't rank at all).
     
    gooner, Sep 3, 2004 IP
  6. quadcity

    quadcity Peon

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    #6
    The real value of a keyword domain is in the anchor text, not the domain itself.
     
    quadcity, Sep 4, 2004 IP
  7. l234244

    l234244 Peon

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    #7
    I cant say I have seen a great deal of difference, I have hyphenated and non-hyphenated sites ranked well.
     
    l234244, Sep 4, 2004 IP
  8. juke

    juke Peon

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    #8
    You may be limiting yourself with that approach. My sites that keywords doamins with hyphen are ranked very high and sales are great and I spend no $ on advertising other than submitting my sites to paid directories.


    Domain name itself does play a big roll in Yahoo and MSN ranking.

    I like short hyphen keyword domains names. you get the added benefit from having keyword in domain and natural anchor text in your BL's.

    Google sees the hyphen as a space and giving your link a natrual anchor text.
     
    juke, Sep 5, 2004 IP
  9. Owlcroft

    Owlcroft Peon

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    #9
    The summation seems easy enough: it seems unlikely to hurt anything (sorry, i fear maxweb is a in a small minority here), and is very likely to help. Those who say that G cannot, in fact, peel out words in a nonhyphenated domain have experimental evidence on their side (more even than mentioned so far), so there should simply be no question.
     
    Owlcroft, Sep 5, 2004 IP
  10. Trance-formation

    Trance-formation Peon

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    #10
    I've played with both at different times and would have to say I see no noticable difference in visitor behaviour. I do have the domain name www.cross-stitch-pattern.com and place nowhere in google for cross stitch pattern, while I do place for cross-stitch-pattern (which confused me since I went with this name based on advice that google treated the hyphen as a space)
    :rolleyes:
    I tend these days to use a hyphen if it is grammatically intuitive to do so, such as my www.trance-formation.co.uk as the domain name itself has no SEO function)
     
    Trance-formation, Sep 5, 2004 IP
  11. mushroom

    mushroom Peon

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    #11
    But I would use hyphenated sub-folder names, "sub" and "folder" are treated as seperate words by most SE's.
     
    mushroom, Sep 5, 2004 IP
  12. nadlay

    nadlay Guest

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    #12
    Look spammy to who?

    Most surfers look at the title and description to decide if they are going to click on a link, and probably never even notice the URL.

    Those of us involved in web development, seo, whatever, tend to take more notice of the URL and consider it more than a casual surfer would do.
     
    nadlay, Sep 6, 2004 IP
  13. Old Welsh Guy

    Old Welsh Guy Notable Member

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    #13
    Google absolutely does treat the hyphen as a space, there is no gain in the eyes of google in having a keyword rich domain, but the real gains com in the fact that when people link to the site www.cross-stich-patterns.com they are giving you the absolute maximum benefit of keyword rich anchor text. Directories will use the name of the site as anchor, the list is endless.

    Does having a keyword rich domain name benefit you apart from link anchor?
    Probably not, other than if it is memorable also.

    Does having a keyword rich domain help you?
    Absolutely as you get the max link anchor.
    OWG
     
    Old Welsh Guy, Sep 6, 2004 IP
  14. DomainLoot

    DomainLoot Guest

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    #14
    All very interesting points, I guess my "feelings" with respect to hyphenated domains
    come from:

    My suspicion that one registers a hyphenated domain because the non-hyphenated
    version is GONE?

    And hence, I hate being second-best ;)

    So, if someone has beaten me to the non-hyphenated version, than I will "out think" them on another idea, concept or domain...

    Just being stubborn I guess.

    Thanks for shedding a little more light on hyphenated-domain-names.com ;)

    TOTALLY AGREE with the point most surfers/customers don't even recognize
    URLs.

    Interesting.
    Mike
     
    DomainLoot, Sep 6, 2004 IP
  15. caroline

    caroline Peon

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    #15
    Well, best-satellite-tv-free-now.com does look spammy. I automatically disregard such results in the SERPS. A two word hyphenated domain would look OK though.
     
    caroline, Sep 6, 2004 IP
  16. Trance-formation

    Trance-formation Peon

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    #16
    Certainly. I would also disregard bestsatellitetvfreenow.com :p

    I like my urls to have a certain intuitive flow about them. Take www.crossstitchpattern.com... 3 s's in a row... how often do you think that is likely to get misspelt? arguably, www.cross-stitchpattern.com might have worked :)
     
    Trance-formation, Sep 6, 2004 IP
  17. juke

    juke Peon

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    #17
    If you look at Webmaster-Link-Exchange.com Ranked very high in SERP for those keywords. I'm not depending on type in traffic but SE traffic for the site.

    My SEO-Forums.com has only been online for about a month and it has already started to rising in SERPs for "SEO Forums" and getting traffic from searches for "SEO Forums"

    Another example would be Text-Ads.com very new site but again targeting SERP traffic and I would expect much same results.

    I agree that too many hyphens will take away from the domain name branding and does deter from SERP ranking to some bit but limited use of hyphens with descriptive keywords in the name can be very effective.
     
    juke, Sep 6, 2004 IP
  18. Owlcroft

    Owlcroft Peon

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    #18
    It's unclear, to me, at least, how, say, vegetable-gardening.com "takes away from domain-name branding" as compared to vegetablegardening.com (both real sites, neither mine, the two apparently distinct), and I am really puzzled at how one form compared to the other can "deter from SERP ranking", except, perhaps, by being harder for potential visitors to remember and type in.

    As has been aptly pointed out, a long, trashy, keyword-stuffed domain name is going to be bad mojo with or without hyphens. But in shorter, more realistic and plausible cases--like the one I mentioned above--I think that hyphenation makes it much easier for potential and return visitors, and I know that it makes it possible for Google to see the keywords.

    As I have said before, how can you go wrong by hyphenating?
     
    Owlcroft, Sep 6, 2004 IP
  19. juke

    juke Peon

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    #19
    Well said...
     
    juke, Sep 6, 2004 IP
  20. nadlay

    nadlay Guest

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    #20
    Seeing both those sites listed in the SERP results, I'm sure that I would recognise the individual words in vegetable-gardening.com more easily, and tend to click on that one first.

    With vegetablegardening.com your brain has to scan the phrase and determine the break between the words. For example, someone might scan vegetablegardening.com and notice table gardening before they notice vegetablegardening.com

    With the hyphenated version, you've already done the analysis work for them and directed them to the correct phrase.



    When I first started, I always used non-hyphenated words, because I thought it looked more professional.

    Now, I'm sure that Google can spot the individual words more easily in a hyphenated URL, and I'm also sure the viewer can spot the individual words more easily, so I now tend to use hyphens in all my new domains.
     
    nadlay, Sep 7, 2004 IP