Hacing a hard time finding a writter.

Actually, most of the best (and most reliable) writers I know here don't fit into this grouping at all. Why? Because it's often pointless to post BST threads with professional rates, and they know it - they get most of their DP gigs through private referrals. Also, having iTrader means nothing, and serious buyers and traders here know that. High iTraders would be far more likely to mean the writer is cheap than that they're good. That's because those with huge iTrader numbers take on a lot of gigs rather than the fewer, higher-paying, more serious gigs around - and if they got the gig privately (which they often do), it's not possible to leave iTrader here on DP.

Yes, there are good (even great) writers here on DP. And yes, GAF is on the same level as DP - a few gems, but lots of garbage to sort through to find them.

The best way to find writers on DP though, is to look beyond the forum itself. What do I mean? Judge their writing by their posts; not their ads. Then review their professional sites (if they're committed to the job for the long haul, they'll have one). There you'll generally find portfolios, client testimonials from various sources, rates, and anything else they've chosen to make public.

 

lol! The best way to find writers is by reading their DP posts? Are you kidding me? Please...if you consider yourself a "professional writter" and you aren't employed by a major publication nor have your articles widely syndicated, you are delusional.

 

A 'professional writer' is someone who is working professionally as a writer, i.e. they are being paid to produce original content for a client. Any time a client uses that article in a public capacity, it has been published. There are plenty of writers who are not employed by major publications or are featured in top magazines or newspapers, and assuming they are anything other then freelance writers who work in a public capacity is arrogant.

 

You don't know what you are talking about, Yoko. If someone uses the word professional then they must be able to back it up with education or previous experience in a major company. I professional isn't someone who picks up a pen or types something and sells it to a proxy owner who wants a nice welcome message. Think about it........Its arrogant saying that anyone who writes and sells it is a professional. that's stupid.


Back to the topic. I'm sorry every connection you make is backing out. I notice the very same thing. Some guy is struggling to write one article a day for $5, then I offer a sweet deal to make him $100 a day to stay with the same easy topic and write for me for awhile, then they take off like I'm Saddam with an AK47.

Its not your fault, don't listen to others who say this. The reason they are blaming you is because they are fighting to overpower cheaper writers so they can freely charge $5,000 for a day of work. Take a look and you'll find all in this topic who blamed you have previous posts to sell their skills at a cuthroat price.

What's happening is the people you are talking to want the money and saw the demand for writers, but after a few articles they just don't feel like doing it for a longtime. Its hard to stay on track writing. These people you are talking are simply having second thoughts on doing the job.

I'm sorry, but unless you are willing to get ripped off by some money hungry thief then you'll have to write for yourself. You should write for yourself anyway. Its a skill you should have if you are going to make it in the world. Just be happy it isn't Graphics that is hard to get, a lot of people would be screwed.

 

If you're looking for writers on DP, then YES (which is what I said in the first place, btw). That's the best way to go about it. And I hate to break it to you, but I know a LOT of professional writers who aren't employed by major publications or have their articles widely syndicated. As a matter of fact, some of the best (and most highly paid) writers I know are freelancers, meaning they automatically don't fit your definition of what a professional writer is (they're not "employed" at all).

And please don't go around insulting people here. Calling someone delusional because you disagree with them is inappropriate, and grounds for an infraction. I'll let it slide this time.

It's a tough call, and everyone has their own ideas of what professional writers are. I can't see a single logical reason why a type of publication would play a role in that (that would be like saying no copywriter is a professional writer, because they don't write for publications, which is just silly). The same would be true of saying people who only write for local or regional publications (or small business clients) aren't professional because they don't work for major companies. I'm not saying there are no differences between amateurs / hobby writers and professionals - just that type of publication isn't one of them imo.

I know people who have been published in one or two major commercial and trade magazines, but they don't pursue writing regularly (a lot of professionals in other fields do this as a PR tactic). Are they professional writers? I also know writers who have written several published books and magazine articles, but they're full-time ghostwriters, so their name is never attached publicly to a project. Are they then not professional writers? I can't see a good argument for that.

Even here at DP, there's a lot more to it than that. I used to draw the line based on price, but I realized that was stupid. I mean, if someone can charge a few bucks for an article, but they're able to earn a decent full-time living doing that because of the cost of living where they live, who are any of us to say they're not professional? Even if the writing isn't always great by someone else's standards I'd say anyone would have a difficult time saying someone was't a professional writer if they're able to make a full-time career out of it. I think a lot of well-known, highly-paid actors royally suck - that doesn't make them not a professional actor anymore than it would in the writing profession. Things like that are too subjective.

As for education, yes, it's a good thing to have an educational background tied to your writing, but I don't think a lack of one makes someone unprofessional in all cases. Sometimes years of experience in a field make someone more qualified than a writer with any particular degree. Even if someone does have a degree, who's to say what degree qualifies someone as a professional writer anyway? Some would say an English degree. I'd completely disagree, and say a degree should be in their specialty area (for example, I'd consider a technical writer more easily a pro if they had an engineering degree than an English one, or a medical writer with a medical / pharmaceutical degree rather than one in journalism or creative writing). There are far too many writing disciplines out there to really make blanket statements about education.

Actually, no one charging significantly higher rates really cares about cheaper writers, because we're smart enough to know they're not our competition and people looking to hire them aren't a part of our target market. The fact that someone doesn't have the budget or inclination to work with writers who charge more doesn't make them thieves. And on that note, don't go around accusing other members of being thieves just because you don't fit within, or agree with, a certain market. It's completely inappropriate here. People contribute here when they have something of value to say. In this case, pointing out potential communication issues between the OP and their writer(s) in no way equated to people fishing for work from a client who clearly doesn't fit within their target.

 

The fact is that there are many different kinds of professional writers out there apart from the ones hired by major publications and those whose works are getting syndicated. And that includes freelancers.

 

I don't write an 1,000 word essay for less than $150, but that's because it's not just a hobby for me, I actually got the honors in high school and am in that Quill & Scroll society (I'm the president of my chapter too by the way!).

You know, it's very hard to get out of high school being very, very smart but not being able to find jobs because they all want you to have these very technical degrees. It's for a good reason though, they want to make sure you know exactly what you're doing and that other people can confirm it.

I remember hearing a story about this girl who was a photographer, and a lot of her pictures were very, very good! I think it was that fashion company called GUESS who gave her a job because they loved her work. They put her in a professional studio and everything, but when it came time to shooting the models, it was like every print was absolutely horrible! This was when you only had the film cameras aswell, and she basically lost them like $5,000 in one day. They didn't realize that she wasn't a good photographer (she took loads, but only took the best, didn't know how to work the cameras, etc) and based it on her output. Thus, now every photographer who works in these big companies have to have a college degree.

The thing about writing is, you can get the degree, but it doesn't really show that you're capable of being imaginative and original. You can take songwriting for an example, you get the songs that are catchy and simple like "Mr. Blue Sky", then others that are very inspirational like "Idler's Dream." A lot of these songs only appeal to certain people, and that's how writing is. For the most part, you don't want a person who's going to create an article that only doctors will understand, but you want someone capable of writing something that is easily read by people the ages of 15-25. But, the only way you're really going to get that is if you actually hire someone from the age group.

I have these 1-2 page page essays I wrote on a daily basis in my junior year and will probably put them online in a portfolio soon, they were marked as A+'s. It's like this huge pile of paper though, so I'll have to only pick the best of the best. Like everyone else is saying, you just need to create a budget just for hiring freelancer writers. Don't expect $500 to be the minimum, if you're serious about it and need 100 500-1,000 articles/essays, you're probably better off to start at $2,000.

 

I do have to say one thing: cheaper rates do not equate automatically to low quality. I myself am only starting out in freelance writing, and though I have written quite a bit in the past, I always did so as a hobby, or for free. That fact that I charge so little does not indicate what I will charge in the future, or even what I am worth. In fact I have had several clients who have paid me double or triple my rate after I finished their projects because they didn't feel right about me asking for so little.

But I am not going to start charging for content at the same price as someone who has been in the market for a significant amount of time until I have been able to build a reasonable list of long and short term clients, and a heavy sample portfolio. Experience is key to me, and should dictate what I use as my ongoing rates. I don't see why this makes me anything but honest about what it is I have so far accomplished, or why I should be labeled as anything less then quality for it. That goes for others who charge low rates for their own work, and until you know something about their reasons I think anyone deciding what they are and are not is more then judgmental, it's foolish.

 

oo87 - Like it or not, when you choose to charge very low rates, you associate yourself with a certain image. It may not be "right," in your opinion, but it's how many prospective clients are automatically going to view you. The bulk of writers charging very low rates are putting out low quality work. At those rates, it's impossible for them to spend a huge amount of time doing in-depth research. Much of it is actually rewritten work from a single source (which is a copyright violation). When a client chooses writers charging very low rates, they're taking on a larger business risk. So no, it's not foolish. They're judging based on experience and minimizing their risks - which is smart business.

If you want to show them you're different, that falls on your shoulders; not theirs to assume so. Like I said, you set yourself up for a certain image. It's basic PR - if you want to change that image, you need to work on doing that. Create that portfolio (if you want to work for low rates, get some cheap work from big and reputable nonprofits to add some value to the portfolio beyond webmasters no one has ever heard about). You don't have to accept very low rates to build a portfolio. There are other ways to do it that improve your image more quickly, build better portfolio pieces, and let you invest in your own future as a writer at the same time. Then make that portfolio available so people don't have to ask you to see it (get a professional website up to feature it rather than only having a DP forum thread to link to). Those are pretty simple things to do, but they can go a long way towards improving your image with the clients you want to target.

If you want help or more specific tips on building a portfolio or site that can help you attract clients with a different image, let me know and I'll send you a few resources I've written on the subject.

 

While I agree that there are many reasons a writer could have for charging a low rate, they will suffer what I like to call, "store brand syndrome."

I won't buy store brand cereal because it always has weird, mystery hard things that you can't chew. I won't buy store brand peanut butter because I think it has more roach parts in it than JIFF. I won't buy store brand ice cream because it always tastes like cardboard. Could there ever be a time when these things aren't true? Sure. Maybe there are some store brands right now that have good quality, tasty foods- but I'll never know.

Generally, when things are cheaper there is a reason. If you are a good writer with any kind of portfolio to show (even if you only have unpublished clips that you wrote and are GOOD), you should not have to charge next to nothing to write. Period. You should be calling local companies, emailing businesses, connecting on LinkedIn, doing whatever to get clients, and you should have a reasonable price. You should at least be making a living wage.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter to me what you charge, I would just hate to see quality writers devaluing their own work because they are insecure. On the other hand, you don't want to be over confident...somewhere in the middle you'll find your place

 

Actually, I have been thinking of building a more professional portfolio now that I have a few hundred samples available, so I would love any resources you have.

 

Here are a few articles on blogs of mine that can point you in the right direction:

Build a Web Writing Portfolio Even if you Have no Experience - This one covers ways to build actual portfolio pieces (published articles for example) without getting stuck in the rut of being viewed permanently in a low-rate writer group by your target market.

Setting Freelance Writing Rates the Right Way - This one covers how to actually set your rates (not average rates or anything like that, but how every individual writer should calculate their own rates based on their own situation). This article helps you calculate the absolute minimum rate you not only should charge, but that you can afford to charge. Many writers charging extremely low rates will find that when they really crunch the numbers, what they're charging isn't sustainable (obviously not all though, as the formula accounts for things like cost of living).

As for setting it up, a portfolio doesn't have to be anything fancy. Don't include everything. Choose some of your best samples, most recent samples, etc. You can link to them if they're published online, or publish them directly on your own professional site (if you're allowed to - if you sold full rights, you would be violating the client's copyright if you did this, so always check with them first). Also try to keep the portfolio to bylined pieces if possible (this isn't an option for some types of business writing or for those who solely do ghostwriting, but if you focus on Web content, try to get a few bylined pieces to show that you really are the author).

 

As far as not paying enough with every writer I contacted they either told me their payment needed or told me after I asked. Since we had already agreed to the price before they vanished.

These sites where you have to bid you have to sign up and a bunch of other stuff. Then there is the problem of bidding. I want one long term wirter so I do not want to go thought bidding and other thinges needed to break in a writer everytime. I need a writer.

For now if I can use text brokers and find out if they can write using a few keyword density keywords
DP writer s are still ace consideration.

This iis a lot of work for some to go though to give someone a job, If there are extra hoops to jump though it should not be the person offering to pay people. This possess makes me reluctant to buy anything on DP/ I though it would be a good thing to give DP writers the work I have to give them a break but few are willing to follow though to get to the point were I send article instructions so I am now also looking other places. In addition.

Here is what I want

First contact
The writer contacts me with a price and he or she keeps that price until after I have taken advantage of it. The give me their paypal address to pay..

Second contact
If I like what you said about the various issues then I will send you 3 keywords and some keyword desity easy guidelines There will also be a breif description the article

Third contact

At this point either send me you email address or request mine in response to this email. Confirm the

 

If you look you won't see an ad from me advertising content. I have regular long time clients that pay me a certain amount of money a month to write for them. When I feel like taking on more work I will reply to a few threads that I see.

The other reason I don't post is my generic rate is $0.05 a word not a penny so I figure posting an ad would be a waste of time. I do understand the confusion on rates but writers are going to charge different amounts based on the topic.

I charge higher for a casino review then a poker room review for example because there is generally more games and so on offered at a casino then at an online poker room.

I wouldn't advertise for a long term writer but a portion of the project your on then if you like the person's work then see if their available for a long term project to weed out some of the people that need a little extra cash, etc.

As far as who is considered to be a professional writer? If your main source of income comes from writing then thats your profession. As far as writing the content yourself I don't recommend it unless you know what you're doing.

You don't want to waste valuable time writing then have to pay someone to either rewrite it or edit it.

Geminiamp

 

I have this dinosaur educational website in which I learned a lot from. Should I write my resume that I am a Paleotologist?

 

That depends, do you make an income teaching and studying dinosaurs themselves? That analogy has a few holes...

 

You can put whatever you want on your resume. You can even make up a graduate school and say you got your Ph.D in paleontology there.

 

"GAF" the site where people bid for 50 cents per article and where they also seek for retaining authors for as high as $30 per month? There might be a good offer or two every now and then over there, but I have stopped checking out GAF for quite some time. I have checked out the samples that the potential authors post in there and they are horrible.

 

Unless you're paying for that sample (whether or not you ultimately hire them - and I'm not saying you're not), I don't blame them one bit. Self-respecting writers generally won't write free, custom samples (unless they're new and don't know any better yet). The "good" ones also wouldn't have to give something like that away for free. They're too busy with existing clients and offers from serious buyers who know how to judge their abilities from their portfolio.