Elton John & David Furnish are getting married tomorrow

Dreamshop Peon

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#61

I send out best wishes to anyone getting married.

There's a really long excellent article related to this topic...which I'll try to summarize (as I'm sure many of you wouldn't bother to take the time to read it thoroughly).

Most everyone recognizes that falling in love and expressing that love sexually are sublime human experiences. Romantic relationships can be an avenue of communication, of emotional growth, and of lasting interpersonal fulfillment. Some people are happier in heterosexual relationships; some are happier in homosexual relationships; some are happier alone. When our fellow human beings are happy, that's good for them and it's good for us. Any "morality" that fails to recognize this doesn't deserve the name.

...accepting homosexuality requires them to give up their favorite argument: it's wrong because we've always been taught that it's wrong. This "argument from tradition" has an appealing simplicity. It is easier to accept the status quo than to make fine-grained, well-reasoned distinctions between those sexual acts which contribute to human well-being and those that do not.

But easier is not always better. And in this case, the cost of simplicity is too high: it involves denying fulfilling relationships to gay and lesbian people without any better reason than "that's how we've always done things." This is moral complacency, and it deserves not merely to be rejected but to be harshly condemned. If one is going to condemn people for the loving, affectionate relationships in their lives, one had damn well have a better reason than that. The same reason was once used to oppose interracial relationships: it was a lousy reason then and it's a lousy reason now.

Most arguments against homosexuality fall into three broad categories: (1) the Bible condemns it; (2) it's harmful; and (3) it's unnatural.

MANY PEOPLE claim that homosexuality is wrong because â€œThe Bible says so.â€ This claim rests on two presuppositions:

(1) The Bible condemns homosexual conduct. (2) The Bible is a good moral guide.

Each of these raises questions. Regarding the first: does the Bible condemn all homosexual conduct, or just some? And which Bible are we talking about? (Remember that in addition to the numerous editions of the Judeo-Christian Bible, there are also countless other religious texts that claim divine authority. Given our tendency toward cultural myopia, it bears repeating that the vast majority of the world's inhabitants are not Christians.)

Regarding the second presupposition: is the Bible infallible, or might it contain some error? If the latter, how do we distinguish true moral teaching from that which simply reflects the authors' prejudices? Consider, for example, two passages â€” one from the Old Testament and one from the New â€” that seem pretty clearly to endorse slavery:

[...more here]

If homosexuality were indeed harmful to individuals or society, that would seem to provide a significant moral strike against it. But is it really harmful? And do the allegations prove what the critics claim â€” namely, that homosexuality is morally wrong?

More recently, critics have been fond of blaming homosexuals for their "threat to the family." This too is perplexing. Homosexual people come from families (contrary to rumor, we are not hatched full grown in a factory in West Hollywood). Many of us are quite devoted to our families, and an increasing number are forming families of our own. Provided that these families embody love, generosity, commitment â€” in short, family values â€” where's the problem?

[...more here]

PEOPLE OFTEN ARGUE that homosexual sex is "unnatural." But what does that mean? Many things we value â€” like clothing, medicine, and government â€” are unnatural in some sense. On the other hand, many things we detest â€” like disease, suffering, and death â€” are "natural" in some sense. If the unnaturalness charge is to be more than empty rhetorical flourish, those who levy it must specify what they mean.

It often seems that when people call homosexuality "unnatural" they really just mean that it's disgusting. But plenty of morally neutral activities â€” eating snails, performing autopsies, cleaning toilets, watching the Anna Nicole Smith Show â€” are disgusting to many people. That something disgusts you may be sufficient grounds for an aesthetic judgment against it, but it is hardly grounds for a moral judgment.

Perhaps when people claim that homosexual sex is unnatural they mean that it cannot result in procreation. The idea behind the argument is that human organs have various "natural" purposes: eyes are for seeing, ears are for hearing, genitals are for procreating. According to this view, it is immoral to use an organ in a way that violates its particular purpose.

Many of our organs, however, have multiple purposes. I can use my mouth for talking, eating, breathing, licking stamps, chewing gum, kissing women, or kissing men, and it seems rather arbitrary to claim that all but the last use are "natural." (And if we say that some of the other uses are "unnatural, but not immoral," we have failed to specify a morally relevant sense of the term "natural.")

Just because people can and do use their sexual organs to procreate, it does not follow that they should not use them for other purposes. Sexual organs seem well suited for expressing love, for giving and receiving pleasure, and for celebrating, replenishing, and enhancing relationships â€” even when procreation is not a factor. This is why heterosexual people have sex even if they don't want â€” or can't have â€” children. To allow heterosexual people to pursue sex without procreation while forbidding homosexual people to do the same is morally inconsistent.

[...more here]
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Dreamshop, Dec 23, 2005 IP

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Arnie Well-Known Member

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#62

Ok, I'll comment on this later, after the 25th.

Merry Christmas to All lots of joy and fun and hopefully a time of reconsilliation with Christ Jesus for some, no matter who - from deep in my heart.

Arnie

Arnie, Dec 23, 2005 IP

yfs1 User Title Not Found

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#63

Ok, Its now after the 25th

yfs1, Jan 24, 2006 IP

gworld Prominent Member

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#64

yfs1 said:

Ok, Its now after the 25th
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gworld, Jan 24, 2006 IP

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Elton John & David Furnish are getting married tomorrow

Dreamshop Peon

Arnie Well-Known Member

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gworld Prominent Member

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