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Do You Still Have Hope In The Content Section Here At DP?

Discussion in 'Copywriting' started by coreygeer, Mar 1, 2014.

  1. #1
    I feel more and more like I'm walking through the bad part of a neighborhood when I see the content section. I've subscribed via e-mail to the content section and every thread is basically the same thing anymore.

    Everyone wants amazing content for dirt cheap pricing. The art of negotiation doesn't really work on clients paying $1 per 100 words either, because they just check their PMs for more writers if you try to reason with them.

    My high paying clients are on vacation so I'm looking at all possible work that doesn't make me want to shove a spike into my brain. I got started on Textbroker but very quickly found out how ridiculously insane they are with commas. They will seriously bump you down to the Level 3 tier which is $1 per 100 words if they find a problem with one comma.

    Clients have 96 hours to accept work, which means you have to complete everything by Sunday if you want to be absolutely guaranteed to receive credit for work done. I will say one great thing about Textbroker though, they always pay on time.

    I seriously feel depressed when I look at this forum's content section anymore. It's starting to feel more and more like Detroit every day. If you don't know what Detroit is, it's a city in the USA that relates to the content creation forum here exactly.

    Detroit was once a thriving city that was the King of manufacturing and was a raging industrial machine. As time went on, the people who made that city great started leaving and it turned into a massive ghetto. Like DP, this place used to be thriving with ripe opportunity for writers. One by one, client after client disappeared. I remember when it used to be so easy to find $2 or $3 per 100 word clients who wanted bulk content.

    I used to be too busy to know how to manage my time.

    In Detroit, you can buy a house for $100. It might be gutted and have homeless people living in them, but at least it's only $100. They even cut the budget for their Fire department and EMTs in Detroit don't have GPS. Police calls to shots fired or life threatening emergencies could take hours to get a response.

    Honestly, I just see Detroit when I look at the content section here. It had so much potential back in the day. I also remember when you could sell an eBook here and make a few hundred easy bucks. Everyone keeps coming back to $1 writers despite being burned time after time again. Everyone wants writers who are used to sweeping streets to pave them gold roads.

    I try to reason with people, I try to convince them out of there $1 mindset and try to warn them of impending incoherent content. No one ever believes me or they simply won't hear any of it because they only value their content as they see fit.

    So what do you think? Does this place still have hope? Is it long gone at this point?
     
    coreygeer, Mar 1, 2014 IP
    Jameyson MacDonald and wwstewart like this.
  2. awundrin

    awundrin Active Member

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    #2
    I so agree with you! Used to be easy to find people here willing to pay decently but that's no longer the case. Now this section of DP is very much
    like freelancerdotcom - full of buyers looking for articles only costing a buck each or even 50 cents!


    I lived in the city of Detroit for a few years back in the 80s. So sad what's become of the once-great Motor City!

    Is there still hope for this place? I'm thinking not much.
     
    awundrin, Mar 1, 2014 IP
  3. tom11011

    tom11011 Well-Known Member

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    #3
    Maybe this is no longer the right approach. Maybe find websites with the content you like to write about and approach them instead of holding out for people to approach you? Just a thought.
     
    tom11011, Mar 2, 2014 IP
  4. coreygeer

    coreygeer Well-Known Member

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    #4
    I have more than just DP under my belt. I don't sit here and wait for clients off DP to contact me. If I did that, I wouldn't be able to eat or pay for anything. A lot of bulk order clients from here disappear for weeks to months and then contact me later down the road asking if I still wanted to do content writing.

    The majority of the time, a negotiation for price is never met. This is usually how it goes:

    "I want to pay .50c per 100 words."
    I set my own price and try to work with a client that offers bulk work.
    "Well, I want to pay .50c per 100 words. Take it or leave it."
    I decide to leave it.
    "Wow, greedy writers. Guess I'll just hire someone for even cheaper then."

    I get requests all the time on Skype from people on here. I get some PMs every once in a while but that's usually how the majority of "negotiations" go from here. They want someone who's willing to crank out content at warp speed and dirt cheap. As far as higher paying clients, then along the lines of what you said, you have to market yourself to find them.

    The higher paying clients generally don't come to these forums or even know they exist. Are there some here? Absolutely. The majority of them I've met have no idea that job boards or marketing forums even exist. They're usually business owners or starting entrepreneurs.

    Yep. You see all kinds of .50c or $1 per 100 word writers posting their services here. I'm not saying they're all bad but I do know from experience how a majority of them work.

    They have native English agents working on those freelance escrow middleman sites to talk to employers. When you talk to a "candidate", you might not be talking to them at all, but instead you're talking to an agent that speaks perfect English. Then when you hire the candidate, you get incoherent gibberish back and you're left puzzled. If you've ever had that happen to you, that's probably why. A lot of those freelance middle man sites have people that talk to employers for the writers.

    Or they have people who take a small percent of the writer's profit to find them work and talk to employers as well. Seems like a lot of work for pennies at the end of the day, but to each their own.
     
    coreygeer, Mar 2, 2014 IP
  5. ryanjohn23

    ryanjohn23 Active Member

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    #5
    I was looking for online writing opportunities for my significant other since she's a superb writer and she wants to be a work-at-home mom since we have a 2 year old and one on the way. I was looking at DP but most of the rates I saw wouldn't make it worth while. Here are a couple of sites we're investigating for her to make income providing content.

    helium(dot)com
    constant-content(dot)com

    Also this is a great article: http://www.makealivingwriting.com/150-websites-blogs-pay-writers/

    Hope this helps,
     
    ryanjohn23, Mar 2, 2014 IP
  6. YMC

    YMC Well-Known Member

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    #6
    I don't know why any serious writer even bothers visiting the BST content section here. It's been worse than a flea market ever since I joined DP. Just didn't see the point of chasing fractions of pennies or wasting my time trying to educate buyers who in the end don't care about quality over quantity in the first place.

    There are some good paying clients among the membership but it does seem they tend to approach the better writers directly rather than join the free-for-all. I don't blame them, why deal with dozens of "I write good" sorts of replies when they are looking for a real writer?
     
    YMC, Mar 2, 2014 IP
  7. averyz

    averyz Well-Known Member

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    #7
    DP content section is the same as it has always been.

    At the top of the spectrum you usually get a couple of literate people trying to make decent conversation that usually get filled in with low grade illiterate 3rd world posts on “where is money” “how much for ?”. Then you get the people who think the can change market prices with rant posts “Don't work for peanuts” followed by “I wrte you for $200, I no work for peanuts”. People ignore this section and then it turns to buy and sell cheap low quality writers and content.

    Same old same old.

    I really don't see the Detroit comparison. This place was never a global manufacturing king.
    I see this place more like some 3rd world desert that gets an occasional UN truck with water and rice then you get a mass of heathens fighting over the small portions.


    True I don't know why you would look for well paying jobs here. When someone has a nice budget for content they do not run over to DP make an acct and weed through illiterate scammers looking for front page content. Sorry they are not here.

    If you are feeling low about your writing skills this is a good place to make you feel like you have great skills. Other then that . ?
     
    averyz, Mar 3, 2014 IP
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  8. Smitten

    Smitten Active Member

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    #8
    Lol @detroit comparison. Let's be honest here: the DP marketplace has always been the home of the bottom feeders. Still, there was a time in distant memory when the occasional worthwhile assignment could be picked up here. There was a time when you could write passionate threads enticing customers who wanted VALUE over BARGAINS, and it was actually worth the time & effort.

    Not anymore.
    It's really been a long while since the UN trucks stopped driving by these dire wastelands!

    Oh well. My current position: Set up your own website and start working on drawing clients to YOU. If you're in it for the long haul, you really have to learn plan ahead. "We may all be in the gutter, but we're looking at the stars". Right? Well, just looking won't get you anywhere. Take your best shots, and don't fret if you keep missing the mark. Make sure you have loads of ammunition. Think strategy, persevere and fight!

    That's what I tell myself everyday, but do I listen? Yeah; hopefully I'm finally starting to :)
     
    Smitten, Mar 3, 2014 IP
  9. coreygeer

    coreygeer Well-Known Member

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    #9
    The UN truck comparison was pretty funny. I know this place has always had it's eye sores but I remember when I could come here and search through the entire first page of people looking for writers. Were many of them worth taking the time to contact? It wasn't likely, but I picked up a couple of great bulk clients from here that helped pay bills and then some.

    Now, I rarely see new threads here for anyone looking for freelancers. When I do, it's the same thing usually. Someone wants a website made for $100, someone wants a $1 content writer, someone wants a logo for $5, someone wants a jack of all trades and you get the point.

    Those people have always been there, I know that. I started out writing on the Rich Jerk forum for $1 per 100 words when I was 18 years old. I thought that was an awesome price. Here I am getting paid to write fast for $5 per article I can crank out. Of course I also quickly learned that clients want you to edit, proofread and sometimes include images in these articles as well.

    Then you have the special occasion where people want you to upload content to their WordPress and manage it as well. "What? Why would that cost me more money, I'm already paying you to write my content."

    I've heard it all over the years.

    "But my budget"
    "You write fast so I can't pay much"
    "My dog died, I need to save money"
    (No, I'm not kidding)
    "*Insert family member* died, can we cut the budget?"
    "Well, I found someone who will do it for $2 per 500 words"
    (I gave up trying to convince those people otherwise. I find that it's best to let them learn on their own what kind of content they'll get).

    I've had someone who found my Facebook and stalked me because I refused to write for their prices, I've been DDoSd because Skype gives people your IP and I've had someone follow me around on this forum insulting me wherever I go.

    I look back at DP like the good, the bad and the ugly. There were great clients I found from here, there were bad clients I found from here and then there were just some ugly ones.

    Even the people who used to comment on those "I LOOK FOR $1 ARTICLE GRAMMAR MUST PERFECT LOWEST BID GETS JOB" type posts have disappeared. More and more familiar faces seem to be vacating the site and never returning. Who knows, trends come and go and they're pretty unpredictable.

    Ever since low quality got hit with a nerf bat, places like iWriter and Textbroker don't seem to get much love either. Some people learned that you aren't going to outdo Cracked.com style writing for $10 or $5 per article. Some people will continue to hire people at that price until their budget runs to $0.
     
    coreygeer, Mar 3, 2014 IP
  10. khemraj

    khemraj Well-Known Member

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    #10
    I've been searching for a good writer who can do reviews for me. I am ready to pay, even tried with couple of writers here on DP (without negotiating for a single penny). Unfortunately, I rejected all the articles even had to pay for the sample articles.
     
    khemraj, Mar 3, 2014 IP
  11. tom11011

    tom11011 Well-Known Member

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    #11
    Could it be the fiverr effect? I found a guy on fiverr who wrote my websites 'about us' page. He did a great job, he's from the US, speaks read and writes English and has a ton of positive feedback. The feedback system on fiverr is pretty good and sellers don't want to risk bad feedback so they do a good job. Also, fiverr gives you the opportunity to view the users work in very creative ways. For example you could watch the users videos of him outlining some of the blogs he's worked on.

    So, I think that is what you are up against. Pretty much everything on fiverr is $5 but you can charge for extras.
     
    tom11011, Mar 3, 2014 IP
  12. coreygeer

    coreygeer Well-Known Member

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    #12
    Were they that bad? They can't be worse than the content I received when I tried hiring on oDesk.

    When I went through 100 writers on those cheap of the mill sites, I found 1 or 2 with great English that actually produced readable content. Those people are what's called golden gems. They have no idea that speaking perfect English qualifies them for far more than $1, so they tend to stick in that $1 price range.

    Fiverr is a lot like oDesk. You're bound to find 1 decent writer in the herd of copy pasted crap and incoherent content.
     
    coreygeer, Mar 3, 2014 IP
  13. wwstewart

    wwstewart Active Member

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    #13
    I miss the days where I could easily make a decent amount from this site, too. In fact, I got my first steady writing job from a member of this site. After a while, I didn't have time to work for him, but he paid well (usually $10-20 per article) since I delivered high-quality work. It's a shame there aren't more of those people around.
     
    wwstewart, Mar 3, 2014 IP
  14. coreygeer

    coreygeer Well-Known Member

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    #14
    Agreed. The best client I ever picked up from here was a bulk client that paid whatever I asked him to.

    I would tell him the price, he would usually say "cool, sent" and that was it.

    The majority of the adds I get on Skype now are trying to negotiate me down to .50c per 100 words because "budget" or "bulk" work.

    Even the thought of $1 per 100 words is cringe worthy but a lot of people who have added me from here think even that is expensive.
     
    coreygeer, Mar 3, 2014 IP
  15. tom11011

    tom11011 Well-Known Member

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    #15
    So is the problem this site or is it a lack of work. Are people needing less articles? If not, then they must be going somewhere?
     
    tom11011, Mar 4, 2014 IP
  16. Content Maestro

    Content Maestro Notable Member

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    #16
    The problem IMO is that some people do not understand the importance of investing into content. They somehow must be made aware of the fact that spending more money will result in better quality.
    “Content is king”. High-quality content is potentially not only able to recover investments but can also enhance profit margins.
    Money is always the biggest motivation and writers will automatically be driven to deliver good quality when the pay matches their expectations.

    Just my view ….. I hope this is not wrong.
     
    Content Maestro, Mar 4, 2014 IP
  17. khemraj

    khemraj Well-Known Member

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    #17
    I have no idea about oDesk, but the articles I received can't be used, now you can see how bad they would be.
     
    khemraj, Mar 4, 2014 IP
  18. averyz

    averyz Well-Known Member

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    #18
    I think the problem is the over all market that the this sub forum relies on. This sub forum usually supplies low end websites, MFA, “turnkey” and other such websites.
    After the “recession” in 2008 MFA sites along with adsense dropped so did much of the site flipping and turnkey sales. The market for cheap sites is a fraction of what it was a few years ago. Which equals less people buying content for them and less people looking for writers.

    The reality of low grade sites is they are selling for around $40-$50 4-5 pages of content. That is why the budgets for these sites are so low. They might sell on flippa for $100-$150 but flippa takes half of that in fees.
    When someone is making $20-$30 profit on a website they cannot buy $50 articles. You toss $200 in content on a MFA site it is still sells for $40-$50. it is what it is and people only pay so much for that.
     
    averyz, Mar 4, 2014 IP
  19. YMC

    YMC Well-Known Member

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    #19
    Google algorithm changes have made the ROI on low-quality content sites worse than ever. I think it's a combination of fewer folks buying cheap content (no profit in it anymore) and people looking elsewhere for writers. Word is out that here and most of the freelance websites have been over-run with low-end writers offering dubious content for pennies.
     
    YMC, Mar 4, 2014 IP
  20. tom11011

    tom11011 Well-Known Member

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    #20
    I tend to agree with the last two posters. It used to be owning many sights and earning through adsense worked well, but after googles changes in algorithms, I think people are now starting to focus on one or two sites and making them profitable with quality content, possibly self written.
     
    tom11011, Mar 4, 2014 IP