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<DIV> vs <TABLE>

Discussion in 'HTML & Website Design' started by latehorn, Jan 6, 2006.

?

What's your opinion

  1. I use only <DIV>

    38 vote(s)
    33.9%
  2. I use only <TABLE>

    20 vote(s)
    17.9%
  3. I use a mix between aka sementism

    54 vote(s)
    48.2%
  1. FeelLikeANut

    FeelLikeANut Peon

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    #41
    You very possibly could if you had some facts to back your case, but it seems you don't. You're always willing to debate until I ask you for facts; then you suddenly lose interest in the conversation.
    SEMrush
     
    FeelLikeANut, Jan 9, 2006 IP
    SEMrush
  2. Dio

    Dio Well-Known Member

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    #42
    Expect to hear a lot about it - will be a buzzword in 2006... :D
     
    Dio, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  3. minstrel

    minstrel Illustrious Member

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    #43
    If you say so, Nut. I don't think this is about facts. I think it's about opinion. You seem to think using tables for layout or Internet Explorer is a sin against nature. I don't. C'est la vie.

    But I really don't see any point in you repeating your opinion and me repeating mine ad nauseum, do you?
     
    minstrel, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  4. minstrel

    minstrel Illustrious Member

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    #44
    Yikes. I read the blog. I still don't know what it means :eek:
     
    minstrel, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  5. FeelLikeANut

    FeelLikeANut Peon

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    #45
    I think this is the perfect summary for everything you've said. :p
     
    FeelLikeANut, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  6. Dio

    Dio Well-Known Member

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    #46
    Same here - but I'm starting to hear our programmers mention it a lot - I think it just means when you take out all the formatting and layout, you get the information as its intended - <h1><h2><p><h3><p>, etc - flat down the page.
     
    Dio, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  7. minstrel

    minstrel Illustrious Member

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    #47
    I guess my reaction is, "OK but how is this different from what most of us have always done?"... it's a new catch phrase but it doesn't seem like a new concept.
     
    minstrel, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  8. Dio

    Dio Well-Known Member

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    #48
    No - I'd agree, I think my understanding is simplistic and there's maybe a lot more too it that I'm not yet comprehending. Either that or I need a new set of Emporer wear... ;)
     
    Dio, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  9. Sham

    Sham Peon

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    #49
    I'm a tables person myself.

    I would really like to exclusively use divs for layout, but I get put off everytime I visit a page and see layers overlapping form elements, layers overlapping other layer etc...

    Also, what happens when you try and view a DIV layout site in a text only browser like lynx? (ok, I know no-one uses it, but still).

    I get into regular arguments with some friends who use dreamweaver, which from what I hear, uses divs everywhere.
     
    Sham, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  10. FeelLikeANut

    FeelLikeANut Peon

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    #50
    You get something very much like this,

    http://www.csszengarden.com/?cssfile=none

    that is, all visual formatting information is disregarded and you are left with the natural document structure.
    If you're writing semantic HTML then you really need to be writing your code with absolutely no conception of how the final page will look. Or, possbily an easier way of looking at it, have ten different visual designs in mind, and write code that will work with them all. The colors and layouts you use should be independent of the organization and structure of the information being styled. Everything on the page should be marked up for what it is, not how it will look: if information is a list, but you don't want bullets, mark it up as a list anyway since that's what the information is, and remove the bullets later with CSS. Attached is a page I had put together for someone else a while back to show how such code and designs can be made.
     

    Attached Files:

    FeelLikeANut, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  11. SEbasic

    SEbasic Peon

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    #51
    It makes a *lot* more sense than a table based layout - that's the whole point...
     
    SEbasic, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  12. vectorgraphx

    vectorgraphx Guest

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    #52
    My opinion: and i've stated it before - use what you need to use to get the job done. Carefully consider your target demographic and design accordingly, and you can't go wrong.

    As far as tables being the "wrong" way to design websites, which i do personally disagree with (in much the same way that i would disagree with someone saying that CSS is the "wrong" way to design websites), i'd be curious why, then, such sites as:

    www.microsoft.com
    www.ibm.com
    www.google.com

    etc... are using tables?

    Honestly, it's a pretty silly issue to find yourself on either side of the fence on. tables/css won't make or break your website.
     
    vectorgraphx, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  13. Sham

    Sham Peon

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    #53
    Sham, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  14. FeelLikeANut

    FeelLikeANut Peon

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    #54
    Many don't realize how beneficial semantics + CSS can be until they have created and maintained a site that uses these principles. Unfortunely, you probably can't make it in quite the right way the first time; it seems difficult and clumsy. Like everything else, it takes time and practice to master.

    And there are sites that have fully converted to this approach, such as msn.com.
     
    FeelLikeANut, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  15. FeelLikeANut

    FeelLikeANut Peon

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    #55
    ( Assuming this comment was sarcastic: )

    Why can't people read so they know what they're talking about?!?

    Firstly, I posted that link in direct response to your question of how a CSS-layout site would look in a text browser. Thus, you are seeing the site with no CSS applied.

    Secondly, the second sentence on that page says, "Select any style sheet from the list to load it into this page." So you scroll to the heading "Select a design" and pick one.
     
    FeelLikeANut, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  16. SEbasic

    SEbasic Peon

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    #56
    I love that site - Simply Stunning.
     
    SEbasic, Jan 9, 2006 IP
  17. justinwp

    justinwp Peon

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    #57
    I only use css now for the most part. Now that I understand how it works, it is much easier to use than tables.
     
    justinwp, Jan 12, 2006 IP
  18. Immorta

    Immorta Peon

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    #58
    Div's all the way...

    1. Less Code
    2. Lower File Sizes
    3. Better Browser Compatability

    To name but a few reasons.
     
    Immorta, Jan 12, 2006 IP
  19. girbaud

    girbaud Peon

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    #59
    i use divs, although its easier to create tables
     
    girbaud, Jan 12, 2006 IP
  20. Sham

    Sham Peon

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    #60
    No I wasn't trying to be sarcastic, I genuinly have never seen any application of css like that before and it is quite cool how much a change in stylesheet can do for a site.
     
    Sham, Jan 13, 2006 IP