can I use an image used in a popular 1969 children's book?

Discussion in 'Legal Issues' started by cscott5288, Jul 17, 2010.

  1. #1
    I would like to use the image of "The Very Hungry Caterpillar" in the web design of a humor blog. The book was published in 1969... but I am sure it has been republished since it is so popular. What copyright laws could apply? I read somewhere that copyright laws can only extend up to 14 years in the US. Can I use it under 'fair use' like how Wikipedia uses it?

    Here is the author's copyright information page: http://www.eric-carle.com/generalcopyright.html

    appreciate any help!
     
    cscott5288, Jul 17, 2010 IP
  2. c_programmer

    c_programmer Peon

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    #2
    Thats not true, for instance Disney has had copyright ownership over Mickey Mouse and related characters for years now. There is not much information we can give you on this passed what what page says. Does the publisher still exist? If so contact them and see if they are OK with it (IIRC they get the copyrights). Unless it is for serious profit I doubt they will have a problem, but that is at their sole discretion.
     
    c_programmer, Jul 17, 2010 IP
  3. edpatton

    edpatton Active Member

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    #3
    I would say that you will be best off not to use the image. You can still be violating a copy write law.
     
    edpatton, Jul 17, 2010 IP
  4. cscott5288

    cscott5288 Active Member

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    #4
    Damn. I hate this. What about fair use?
     
    cscott5288, Jul 17, 2010 IP
  5. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #5
    You likely need permission to use it. http://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-duration.html#duration

    "Fair Use" is not a black and white area and you need to ask yourself if you feel like spending tens of thousands of dollars or more if the copyright holder doesn't agree with your usage? If you win, you wouldn't have to take down the image but would also be out your attorney fees. If your site is commercial in any way (runs ads, takes donations, sells any product, sells links, perhaps even driving traffic to another site, etc. than you can pretty much rule out "fair use" as a defense. Get permission, perhaps for a fee, or I would use something else.
     
    mjewel, Jul 18, 2010 IP
  6. cscott5288

    cscott5288 Active Member

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    #6
    I don't get it. Star Wars came out in the 70s and yet the usage of Darth Vader's character is pervasive in our culture. Example: the chad vader show http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wGR4-SeuJ0

    You would think that such an expensive brand as Star Wars would have more copyright protection than an obscure children's book.

    My blog is a humor blog. It's all satirical stuff so the images used in the header are meant to be satirical. Does that better qualify me for 'fair usage'?
     
    cscott5288, Jul 18, 2010 IP
  7. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #7
    Are you having an artist do a different image of the character that is a parody or are you taking an image done by someone else and using it? Do you want to risk spending tens of thousands in legal fees arguing your case of "fair use"? There is nothing you can do that makes you immune from a lawsuit for copyright infringement if you use an image you didn't create, own, or receive permission to use. If your site is going to a commercial site (as defined above) you are making it much harder to have a legal defense. I don't know how to make it any clearer. Forget about what other people are doing or getting away with - it doesn't factor in to what this copyright owner may or may not do to enforce his intellectual property rights.
     
    mjewel, Jul 18, 2010 IP
  8. cscott5288

    cscott5288 Active Member

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    #8
    I see you're point. If I had an artist create an image that mimicked the original artwork as a parody -- would I be safe from legal ramifications?
     
    cscott5288, Jul 18, 2010 IP
  9. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #9
    I would say you would be safer from the perspective that it isn't an exact copy and generally speaking, you are less likely to piss a copyright holder off. Would you be safe from legal ramifications? Absolutely not. Anytime you piss someone off they have the right to sue you. You then need to hire legal representation to defend yourself against their claims. This is very expensive. The owner of this artwork has a copyright and you are talking about a derivative copy, which can still be infringement. The visual character may also have trademark protection - either registered or common law. If I was going to use this image and was worried about the possibility of being sued, I would write and get permission. If they don't grant permission, I would use something else unless I was prepared to spend some serious money in legal fees in the event the copyright holder decided to sue.
     
    mjewel, Jul 18, 2010 IP
  10. reelstuff

    reelstuff Active Member

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    #10
    I agree with mjewel, very perceptive, and accurate, This is why I have been using mostly original photos or royalty free works, in all of my websites and software, it just makes sense to avoid the pitfalls, out there, it is easy to just copy it but it is not wise at all, good post,
     
    reelstuff, Jul 19, 2010 IP
  11. Bruce McGivern

    Bruce McGivern Well-Known Member

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    #11
    I'm curious: How would they find out? Could you not just do a similar caterpillar design? I've a sister who draws Mickey Mouse pictures for leisure.
     
    Bruce McGivern, Jul 19, 2010 IP
  12. Nagfx

    Nagfx Peon

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    #12
    Can't you search for an "Alike" Picture on stock photos site?
    Then Purchase it? That seems the best possible solution.
     
    Nagfx, Jul 21, 2010 IP
  13. xanth

    xanth Active Member

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    #13
    The answer is... maybe.

    1. You haven't told us more about your usage and why you think it might qualify under the Fair Use Exception.

    2. Fair Use is an exception that is only a certainty when a court says it qualifies. Until then, there are no absolute safe harbors. If your use isn't likely to tick anyone off and it's non-commercial and seems to probably qualify under the FUE, chances are you won't have a problem but it's always a risk.
     
    xanth, Jul 21, 2010 IP
  14. cscott5288

    cscott5288 Active Member

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    #14
    cscott5288, Jul 22, 2010 IP
  15. mjewel

    mjewel Prominent Member

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    #15
    The first thing you have to answer is: Is your site going to run advertising, take donations, sell products or links, or have any other types of monetization?

    As you have been told over and over again: No matter what, claiming "fair use" is ALWAYS a risk. Even if you win a lawsuit, you'll lose attorney fees of thousands of dollars.
     
    mjewel, Jul 22, 2010 IP
  16. Nagfx

    Nagfx Peon

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    #16
    Yeah man, Just buy one stock photo of a caterpillar.
    and call it a day ;).
     
    Nagfx, Jul 24, 2010 IP