Calling all PR conspiracy theorists!

Discussion in 'Websites' started by libertines, Feb 24, 2006.

  1. LaCabra

    LaCabra Goats R Us

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    #21
    PR is not magical, its not wizardry ... its wellllll .... check post from immorta!
     
    LaCabra, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  2. Phynder

    Phynder Well-Known Member

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    #22
    Bingo - you are lucky you were not deleted from the Google index, like phynder.com was - for buying links...
     
    Phynder, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  3. ly2

    ly2 Notable Member

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    #23
    Dude who cares? You said youre in 1st and 2nd in the serps right? Be happy for that.

    PR<SERPS
    =]
     
    ly2, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  4. NetMidWest

    NetMidWest Peon

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    #24
    I am not seeing this effect in this update. PR for my site is going from 5 > 6.
    But I have yet to see new PR in the toolbar.
    During jagger, I saw my links go from 1700 > 511. This update the backlinks went to 509, despite having some new ones. (I expected a small increase, and yes, I know the backlink count is not accurate.)
    I think we are seeing some jagger type movements. My theory on this is here:
    http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showpost.php?p=662539&postcount=739
     
    NetMidWest, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  5. libertines

    libertines Peon

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    #25
    :D true - spose it is just a dent to the male ego!

    Having a low PR will not affect my serps will it?
     
    libertines, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  6. mad4

    mad4 Peon

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    #26
    Probably not - having fewer links might though and PR is an indicator of links. :rolleyes:
     
    mad4, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  7. MattL

    MattL Well-Known Member

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    #27
    I believe Google has been cracking down on sites that are known to sell links and reducing or eliminating their ability to pass PR (an "educated" theory).
     
    MattL, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  8. NetMidWest

    NetMidWest Peon

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    #28
    What is that based on?
     
    NetMidWest, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  9. E13 9AZ

    E13 9AZ Peon

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    #29
    How do you know it was for buying links?
     
    E13 9AZ, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  10. mad4

    mad4 Peon

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  11. Phynder

    Phynder Well-Known Member

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    #31
    That is the only "frowned upon" activity that I was involved in - that I am aware of.

    Your point is well taken - there is no way to know why Google has dropped a site from the index. All I can do is look at the sequence of events and make a judgement. Jan, Feb and Mar I was buying links like a madman for Phynder.com, which was a PR5 site. At the next update, Phynder.com went to PR0 and nothing in the index. Any other ideas?
     
    Phynder, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  12. MattL

    MattL Well-Known Member

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    #32
    MattL, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  13. E13 9AZ

    E13 9AZ Peon

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    #33
    You have a vaild point, however would you not say your ban was manual and not algo related, for example someone reported your site?

    If buying links can get you banned (and if I could afford to) I could buy a ton of links for my competitors and get them banned am I wrong?
     
    E13 9AZ, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  14. NetMidWest

    NetMidWest Peon

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    #34
    If Phynder.com had pagerank before, and links other than paid, it would not explain the PR0.

    I have bought links, but not for the PR or even the rankings, but to ensure I got good indexing, that Google would not rank a 302 redirect pointed at my site ahead of me, and to insure that sites such as belahost and a bevy of proxy cache sites that got crawled about the same time as Matt's post would be recognized as the duplicate, not mine.

    The flaw in the logic here is that Matt and Google assume that everyone who buys links is out to get higher PR and rankings. There are plenty of other reasons, especially with the bugs Google has suffered from over the last several years to purchase links for the traffic, both human and robotic. Until they eliminate those reasons, or find a way of divining the intent, downgrading the links is not the answer.

    The links I purchased are one set of site-wide links, as opposed to many from different pages and sites. The anchor text is suffering more than it would if simply disallowed. It seems to be penalized. However, I renewed it with the same anchor text recently until I can check this out further, to see if it will bounce back to a level similar to that I would expect without the paid links.
     
    NetMidWest, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  15. MattL

    MattL Well-Known Member

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    #35
    Did you read the last paragraph?

    "What if a site wants to buy links purely for visitor click traffic, to build buzz, or to support another site? In that situation, I would use the rel=”nofollow” attribute. The nofollow tag allows a site to add a link that abstains from being an editorial vote. Using nofollow is a safe way to buy links, because it’s a machine-readable way to specify that a link doesn’t have to be counted as a vote by a search engine."
     
    MattL, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  16. NetMidWest

    NetMidWest Peon

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    #36
    Did you read my last post?
    rel="nofollow" means nothing to humans. To robots, it means do not follow the link, which means that the robot will not visit the destination. If Google is dumping the wrong sites for duplicate content, which I feel had happened to me when the proxy trash was really heavy, and I know happened during the 302 redirect problems I had, the only solution is to ensure that Googlebot hits my site more often, with more recent cache dates, etc.

    It is my philosophy of late to treat the search engine robots the same as my human visitors. If you will think about something as simple as hidden text, you will see that it does the human visitor no good, therefore you should not let a robot run into the same thing. A rel="nofollow" means nothing to a human visitor, so why feed that to a robot?
     
    NetMidWest, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  17. MattL

    MattL Well-Known Member

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    #37

    Not sure what to tell you about your redirect problems, but I would hope you don't rely on paid links to get Googlebot to visit your site more often.

    As far as showing a bot something that means nothing to human visitor (rel=nofollow) - There are things that they "ask" for and things that they don't want. You can't really compare legit attributes and black hat techniques.
     
    MattL, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  18. HN Will

    HN Will Guest

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    #38
    First of all - Sayles - Regarding the link you posted - you think about PR too much.

    Second, regarding nofollow, I find that G follows them anyway, even put a couple in their index with no cache or description.
     
    HN Will, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  19. MattL

    MattL Well-Known Member

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    #39
    I was wondering that myself...if the bot follows the link but it is simply ignored from a PR perspective.
     
    MattL, Feb 24, 2006 IP
  20. NetMidWest

    NetMidWest Peon

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    #40
    Really just an insurance policy - I was out of it by the time I bought the links. But it helped in the decision, there were few cases of high traffic, high PR sites getting hijacked. This is good reading:
    http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showthread.php?t=16232
    But it was really about having 10 copies of my pages from proxies crawled and included by Google, without much other content... and watching my rankings plummet because of them. When I had a particularly bad one shut down after contacting the host, they began to climb back. Adding the links took care of the rest, and they recovered.

    rel="nofollow" s a decision by the webmaster of the site the link is on. If Google does not want to score a link, or follow a link, or even include a site, they do not have to. And rel="nofollow" has started popping up without a webmaster letting people know about it - paid links, exchanges, etc. including links that should be considered an 'editorial vote', such as in forums.

    I guess what I am really saying is that if Google wants to sort paid links versus spontaneous links versus exchanged links, they should smarten up the robots and the algos, not go to the webmasters for help and penalize them if they don't.
     
    NetMidWest, Feb 24, 2006 IP