*Wasn't the above picture, but might as well be. Anyone watch it? Thoughts? Video: http://www.exposetheleft.com/2006/05/15/bush-immigration-address/
The whole thing is a joke. Bush is only "temporarily" sending troops to the border, and that is just to make himself look good. He and Mexican president Vincente Fox are best friends, and both have a vested interest in illegals flooding over our borders. It is called the Pan American Union, which will be the equivalent of the European Union. The US will become a third world country, the wages will be driven down, and then Asia will become the Asian Union and the New World Order will be formed. Anyone who things Bush is actually doing something by sending troops to the border is a moron.
The vast majority of the population in both the US, EU, and Asia are hard working people. The problem is the government, and always has been. I was debating a Belgian guy at the yahoo forums about the situation over there. He was saying how "Africans need to go back to Africa." I told him that his government doesn't want them to go back, and has a vested interest in them flooding the country. The situation in Europe is just like the US. Governments allow illegal immigration to occur, and then will take away the freedom of its citizens when riots and fights break out between the citizens and the illegal immigrants. I actually think the plan is for Bush to send troops to the border in order to incite a riot among the millions of illegals in the US. If they can get civil unrest to occur, this will give them the excuse they need to use the military in order to restrict our freedoms.
I think I have a unique perspective on this. I cut my teeth in jobs at hotels and eating establishments. I've lived on farms. I've been out in the fields during picking season - though not for pay myself. I've even snuck people over the border before. There is no legal immigration right now from Mexico. All those bus boys, maids, cooks, yard workers, field pickers, construction workers, etc. had to come from somewhere. This is NOT a national security issue. The idea that you could completely secure a border spanning thousands of miles across multiple states is ridiculous. They couldn't secure Berlin. Besides - the 911 hijackers that came across a land border came in via Canada - I don't see anyone trying to build a fence up there. Those of you americans out there - would your house have been built if not for illegal immigration? Would your yard be mowed? Would your pool be installed? Would your fruit be available? We have installed a permanent lower class in this country based on illegal immigration - they are forced into jobs paying lower than minimum wage. Employers avoid paying payroll taxes and the workers get taxes pulled out of their checks that never go to the government. They pay MORE for hospital visits than you and I. They pay MORE for doctor's visits. They rarely sue. An entirely underground medical system is in place providing substandard care by substandard doctors using substandard facilities. Where americans would go on unemployment or partial unemployment, immigrants get scared away by convenient immigration raids - saving corporate dollars. The latino population is the fastest growing population in the world. As the american economy grows, companies with immigrant based business models grow. They need more workers. It's not just farming. The hotel industry is notorious, as are construction, landscaping, and restaraunt industries. Showing off some shiny new helicopters and guns does nothing to resolve anything. The Border Patrol has about 300 less agents than the FBI and is the second largest law enforcement agency. Of the 20,000 + agents, less than 500 actually investigate companies with immigration-dependant business models. Since more than doubling their numbers, the annual number of arrests has not changed. It's a waste of taxpayer money, and a waste of resources that should be saved for emergency support. You've heard the term wetback. You probably thought that it came about by describing a mexican swimming accross the rio grande to get into the US. It actually comes from "Operation Wetback" - when not too long ago in our nations history, federal agents raided homes and neighborhoods where brown people were known to be. No papers on you? They sent you to Mexico. No trial, no chance to get your papers from your car, your home, or even pick them up from the ground. I'll tell you exactly how this will pan out. There will be some big arrests, some big talk from politicians, and a lot of rhetoric from people who either do not have any ideas on how to fix the actual problems we have, or do not care to implement any. This is an election time push to earn some votes based on good old fashioned american racism. Illegal immigration will not be reduced - although the number of immigrants in the States will shrink from 12 million to 8 million to 5 million to 1-3 million - which is where most of the estimates sat about 8 months ago. IMO - the USA built itself on immigration. If our permanent lower class is a drain on resources (and there is no credible evidence that it is - only speculation and rhetoric) - then raise their status, force the Mexican government to clean itself up, and force them to implement economic programs that fit into our economic growth plans. Now. Repeat after me. Immigration has nothing to do with 9-11. Mexicans did not Bomb the WTC buildings. Mexicans have never hijacked an airplane. If I could sneak a guy across the border at 5 years old - do you really think the National Guard can stop it? Trust me, they can't. These are just Kodak moments for election time.
I agree, if someone thinks immigration has something to do with 9-11, they are insane. And you are also right about the rhetoric. Little will be done to quail illegal immigration. Bush and large companies actually benefit from it, but average Americans and the illegals will suffer the most.
So inaction as the best course of action is frowned upon and action as the best course of action is frowned upon. Sounds like a "no win" situation.
Motion Sensored Machine Guns (think the movie Congo) That would solve the problem in a hurry! Also the solution is simple. Make Welfare a 3 month protection period at which time you take the kids away from the parents and allow the parents to make a choice 1. Get a job or 2. Starve to death That way all the jobs americans "wont do" will get done and we wont need the mexicants in our country filling up our schools, Hospitals, welfare lines, ect ect ect. Anyways whatever Bush will do whatever his corporate cronies tell him to do.
You do realize that's a federal offense? Huh!? It's an average of 263k/per year....28% of all legal immigrants Yeah, I remeber my friend us to work as a bus boy in college. He came from the bay area. And then there's another friend that's an electrician, glazier, plumber...all from the bay area. A cook friend that legally immigrated from central america. And another one whom worked yard work.... *point* Border security and immigration laws have a lot to do with terrorism...perhaps you're unaware that attacks on the twin tower were done by people whom registered under the 1986 amnesty legislation. Yeah, I agree, the great wall maintained the Chinese culture...hey, they may go against your point. Because Communism was retarded as is the Mexican government. I wish we focused more on them then immigration. And then they registed licenses in cities that didn't comply with immigration laws. Terrorism without nukes/chemical weapons does more harm to terrorist causes than anything. I'm more worried that we'll head towards a Bolivia, Venenzuela-like existence of retardation. Last time I heard Canadians have a general moderate sense of government, and the only feasible benefactor of such gifts is central and southern america. Absolutely. 20% of construction workers are assumed illegal, so they're far from being the prime force. No lawn, no pool...bay area. Fruit use to be picked by kids. Aren't you aware they have a machine that is capable of picking better than humans? Without this cheap labor, everyone would be investing in that. Slaves also impeded technological advancements in the 1800's, do you think we should maintained our 'Guest slave-worker' programs? Actually, after slave we were far more efficient due the intiative in technology. Actually I agree with all you had to say in that paragraph. But you must remember that in most cases, people whom don't graduate from high school are a net-loser on most economies--regardless. It's unwise policy to immigrate mass poverty, and uneducated folk as permanent policy. The biggest spike from Europe was 3 million (for only one year), and it went down extremely due to America's refomatting of the European landscape....Japan knows what I mean. Our corporations needs don't justify anything...remember that. These latin countries will be crippled if they don't retain their workforce. Mass immigration does more harm to resolving this than solving this. Awww...but I love them. Let me fly em. I think more money needs to be put in employee sanctions. The border enforcement if all for nothing if laws aren't internally applied. But I'm hoping the supreme court weight good in the opinion coming soon... I know quite a few people that believe in immigration control, and I would say 90% are not rascist in any shape of form whatsoever. I live in the bay area, and know far more 'minorities' whom hate every other race in the world. Actually this is where it's always had faults. It always put politics in it, and was never intended for much of anything else. We only immigrated from western europe, because most of politicians considered eastern europeans backwards...then when germany got invade by socialism, we started seeing an influx of socialism immigrating to America...long story short, we're far too benevolent for our own good. I think America was built due to the culture that made America possible...and that it gets frequently infected by the stupid side of Europe. An extra body doesn't mean anything. Bravo! Now repeat after me...the 1986 amnesty helped terrorist in the country... and the illegal sancturies cities helped the terrorists get indentifications. This is what happens when law is put to the side. Just one example: The IRCA amnesty has been tied to terrorism. Mahmud Abouhalima, a leader of the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, was legalized as a seasonal agricultural worker as part of the 1986 IRCA amnesty. This allowed him to travel abroad, including several trips to Afghanistan, where he received terrorist training.
Rick, If I made a point by point response here, this would get too long, but I'll do my best. First off - you make great points and I'm not sure that I disagree with you too much. I realize that sneaking people over the border is a federal offense, but it's been more than 20 years and I don't even think I was in elementary school yet. I was more luggage on the trip than co-conspirator in a crime, but the insight the experience gave me is important. I knew it was wrong then - which is probably why the whole thing is burned into my memory. But seeing things from the point of view of somebody who doesn't want to cross the border, but NEEDS to is important: 1) The USA first and foremost represents opportunity. A $4/day job can be 8 times the salary of what someone can get in Mexico - when a job is available. Coming to america means that a father can send money home to his mother, wife, and children so they can survive. That's important motivation. It's unbelievable motivation. 2) Being poverty stricken in the USA is 100 times better than being poverty stricken in Mexico. I'm not talking about taking advantage of social programs or benefits to the poor, I'm talking about the quality of life. I've known a lot (not thousands but probably over 50) of illegal immigrants and none that I've met would even think about applying for welfare or unemployment or skip out on a hospital bill. Those are the kinds of things that will get you deported - at least from their point of view (I'm not sure what enforcement actually is). What they will do is have children here so that their children can be citizens and have opportunities that they do not. (which leads into an education funding debate which is a whole new argument). 3) Coming to America for some mexicans is not a choice. They are forced into it for a variety of disturbing reasons. I'll address the subject of restaurant and hotel workers because I've worked extensively in those industries. Management is generally happy to hire non-immigrant workers, but most businesses in those industries rely on illegal immigrants for several reasons - illegals are more reliable than teenagers, college kids, or unskilled american adults who would take those jobs otherwise. They'll stay on during slow seasons if need be and experienced ones that know the restaurant or hotel will come back during high seasons. I can't tell you how many hotels and restaurants I've worked in and I've never worked in one that didn't have illegals on the payroll. I'm not just talking about southern california either. On the legal immigration subject - I wouldn't be surprised if I'm wrong since my sources are various radio shows. I claim myself as an unwitting victim of propoganda. I did some research. The only published immigration statistics I could find are on permanent resident grants - which amounted to 161K in 2005, 175K in 2004, 115K in 2003. Work and Travel visa's cost $100 for an application fee, so I would think that most of the immigrants who come over the border illegally see that as out of their price range. They also require documentation showing that the applicant is likely to return for approval. I'm curious where you got your 263K number. On the subject of national security - terrorists, drug runners, smugglers, etc. will always find a way in and out. If not through mexico, through canada. If not through canada, through sea ports. Drivers licenses and social security cards can be had for $50 in any city. Legal licenses and cards are more expensive, but not that much more ($2-300 range) - and can be picked up in any city in the states. We've been involved with the war on drugs since before I was born and in my lifetime the flow of drugs into the US has neither been stopped nor significantly slowed by anything other than a reduction in demand. The Great Wall of China did not serve to stub immigration. I can't imagine that they ever had such a problem, but I'm uninformed. Building a wall is not merely impractical as a protective venture, it's impractical as a project and I'm positive that a realistic cost benefit analysis would point to the fact that other options need to be explored. Good to see that there are some people out there who have opinions beyond the propoganda.
I must say before I even dig into this, I appreciate the level of thought you put into your post...it's not often that I get such a rational response. I understand the motivations, and to be fully honest I don't blame them. If I was in hell, and there was an open path to heaven (even though I'm suppose to follow the rules to get in) I'd would probably think deeply about run straight to it. The third eye perspective is necessary in this, otherwise we all get set into deep emotions rather than long-term consequences. Poverty in America is a joke...it means you can afford rent and tv/appliances...basically it just means you have no job or one that sucks in pay (for the most part). Mexico's taxes are so low for the rich, that they can hardly supply basic education, much less anything else. I'm not really for high taxes, if any...but it's silly how their system is. Please name one...I'm interested in knowing. That was the average durning the Clinton years. I realize it's gone down some,...maybe because Bush does no internal enforcement essentially. I think people see value in not obeying the law...the motive is present and the enviroment for exploiting that motive is obvious. The only think we could do worse is broadcast to Mexico (in spanish) that our borders are purely open in this area... You can't take a defeatist approach when it comes to terrorists. Not that I think Israel is an emblem of 'righteousness' but their wall has reduced terrorism in Israel quite a bit. The terrorist (ie militants) literally had to dig underground for four monthes to do one act of terrorism on Israel's soil. I believe it's been five acts in last six monthes...that's a miracle for Israel. The wall/security fence is doing it's job. That's why we need better identification programs. My sister had her identity stolen, and I know it's absolutely easy to do...we need some good federal action on securing information. If they can do it on my money, do it on indentities. In a way it did...it kept mongols from invading and destroying china. It wasn't till one army convinced the Ming Dynasty to open the gates, that an actual force was capable of destroying the Ming Dynasty. It took that army three days to get itself through the gate and on the other side. Strategically, it was just a factor in impeding force...quite useless once the army was on the other side. Tell that to Israel. I must say I'm more for internal enforcement. An effective fence (like the one in Israel) would cost 2 billion. It could be privately funded...and is on the track to being. Frankly that's hardly a scar on any budget. We spend that much money in Iraq per month I believe or is that each week? Thanks. I hear the opposite many time, though. I started out as an open border folk, but I was very ignorant of the situation at the time. I must say that if anyone looks at the number and maintains that sort of position then they're deluded. I really wish we would conference with Mexico and focus on their necessary changes. There's absolutely no reason they couldn't be like Canada. That said, all of latin america could do so much better, but unfortunately the retarded left-overs of Europe seeped it's way into latin-thought...it will take a while before it fades.
The only country that will benefit from reducing Mexican immigration into the U.S. is Communist China. Why? Because the last bits of American manufacturing capability will be destroyed as our labor costs spiral out of control. I sure hope that everyone enjoys paying $12 for a Big Mac.
That's what I've tried to tell Rick.. Investors will go to China when they need some cheap labour. However.. Immigrants isn't the nicest people you can get, banning abortions will also solve the problem.
If you ban abortion, you get a lot of unwanted children. Those kids do not grow up to be productive members of society.
There's a lot people that are born that turns out to not be productive for the society. Also, I think that we have some great people that are murdered after a few weeks in their life. And those who's not will become cheap labour, which will improve the future tradebalance. It's up to oneself to show the society how good one are, not the society to show how good you are.
Geez, that's a little out there, chief. Are you saying every McD's is operated with illegals only, because you're sorely wrong. At a younger age I recall many situations where I had friends working there, and I knew absolutely no-one that was even foreign there. This is an area that was rich with ilegals...still damn cheap, without them. Have you forgot about the 50's and 60's? Hell, it wasn't even till 1967 legislation that we had laws that made migration from most nations open. For a huge part of our nations history we only allowed migration from western europe....then in the twenties eastern europe. You seem to portray that every industry is just working with illegals, when this is obviously not true...the majority of labor positions in the market are done by American citizens. There's only a handful of industry (e.g fruit picking) that 'need' illegals. The 'sky is falling' sounds familiar within all this..... There are industries that are in dire need of inflation control, such as the medical industry and energy industry which will be raped by this massive uneducated migration. Prepare to pay for all their service both in premiums and in taxes. But of coarse we focus on the industries that have absolutely little credence to the very survival of America and individual American lives. Doctors or fruit? Energy or hotel services?
Major fast food chains hire surprisingly few illegals from what I have seen. It's the smaller restaurant chains that hire them in big numbers - chains like Ruby's Diner. I wouldn't say that restaurants are dependant on immigrant labor, but without it, the lives of many managers would be a lot harder. They don't complain about long hours or short weeks. They don't demand performance or longevity raises. They don't go screaming to the labor board about violations. Maybe things are different in SF - the restaurants in general are different there (better) than most places. In my road travels, I see pretty much the same thing I see here in So Cal - bussing staff and kitchen staff is mostly non-english speaking Mexican. That's not to say they are all illegal. Most places I worked there were many guys who would not admit to being illegal and a handful that would. The handful was always there though. In every restaurant that I've ever worked in. It's kind of like landscapers. The big surge I've seen is a cheap weekly Mow and Blow job. None of the guys speak english, and they work crazy hard for very little money. Are they all illegal? Definitely not, but I guarantee you there are a good portion of them that are. That's neither here nor there, though. As I've pondered this more and more, and as I've made observations - I get the general feeling that immigration is definitely on the rise right now - and just like anything else - there are good guys and bad guys involved. For every 10 hard workers, there is a drug smuggler, or a puppy smuggler, or something like that - or who knows, maybe the numbers are reversed - for every 10 drug and puppy smugglers there is one hard working good guy. I honestly don't know, but my whole life I've seen that Mexicans are the hardest workers who complain the least wherever you go. Most of the illegals I have known are great people who work hard. I've known guys who got in car accidents and have worked literally for years making weekly payments to get everything paid off for fear that a missed payment might bring immigration around. None have signed up for welfare or unemployment or anything like that. And that's really what irks me about this whole propoganda campaign. They blame illegal Mexicans for school budget crisis, hospital closures, welfare fraud - anything and everything. And I've been around to observe this up close and in all my life I've never seen it. The problem with my position is that I don't really know everything. I only have my life experience to draw from. Are things different in big cities? Maybe. I don't know. I haven't seen any hard statistics on anything. I've been to the local schools and I don't see an inordinate number of illegal Mexican kids sucking up resources. I find it really hard to trust the word of a group of rabid talk show hosts and guys from impromptu immigration reform organizations with obvious bias that nobody ever heard of until this propoganda campaign came around when it flies in the face of everything I know to be true. I just don't know though. And I'll never really know, and you'll never really know until there is actually a real accounting of border crossings. I really don't think a fence is the solution. I think a realistic immigration policy on both sides of the border is - and I don't think it's something that would take entirely too much effort to put in place. Does the Mexican border need better monitoring? I think so. Smuggling isn't just limited to drugs. Explosives, sex slaves, and any number of other problems come accross the border and that needs to be stopped. But a drug smuggler isn't going to be stopped by a fence. You probably can't stop smuggling altogether. But beefing up intelligence and enforcement resources and coordinating and cooperating with resources on the other side of the border can probably establish a tight bottleneck. But really - is this the issue that is most important to you or me right now? I know it isn't for me. It's a political quagmire much like drug enforcement, abortion, terrorism that is used to heighten emotions during an election period that people won't make noise about much after elections are over. No politician will be held accountable for a failure at the border - because every politician knows that he can do a few TV and radio appearances and explain away that the failure wasn't his fault, but the fault of his colleagues or an organization that he has no influence over. And they also know that all they have to do is say that immigration numbers have been reduced as a result of their actions and the public at large will beleive them - because there are no real statistics to be had. Shouldn't we be more concerned about long term financial strategy regarding the war? What about plans for turning unskilled laborers into information age workers? How about restructuring accountability requirements for politicians? They talk about stopping class action law suits or limiting awards to individuals - but what about stopping massive and abusive retirement plans for government workers? What about defining parameters surrounding privacy concerns in modern society? There are a lot of questions I want answered by our "leaders" - a lot of things that I would base my vote on, but this issue just isn't anywhere near the top of my list of concerns. And frankly, I consider most of the stuff I hear about this issue to be propoganda or well intentioned bullshit at best. Man... I need to learn how to make shorter posts.