Man when i read some of the diatribe in these forums I feel like a complete outsider in what passes for western democratic debate these days. As somebody who is non religious, and doesnt have much time for the verbal spat between muslims and christians, where can I get some peace? In Australia now, I listen to a christian conservative like Howard pouring fuel on the fire on a daily basis, stoking up a christian v muslim debate that could quite easily come back to bite everyone, even though Australia is probably the most secular, and disinterested country in the world. The way Howard and Costello carry on you'd be confused for thinking the Muslim community here have blown up half of Sydney. Im sick and tired of these religious nut jobs, ranting and raving...in whatever form it takes. Dont think Atheists like myself are going to take up the agenda of the Christian right any time soon...we couldnt care less. Im not in denial, I know there are fundamentalist Muslims out there, just like there are fundamentals christians, catholics and the "chosen people". Christians that set about living a morale life, going to church, and helping people via the various christian charities are worthy of respect. Those that seek to set up some sort of new crusade in which we try to "democratize" the Middle East need a reality check, and need to overlook my invitation when there handing them out. Are there any other atheists out there totally feed up with all this? Havent we got anything else to talk about in the political arena these days.
Hell no, I'm still here! Actually we are the rising "breed", in time as facts triumph over bullshit, people will realize the absurdity of their conventions & beliefs & hopefully humanity will change for the better. -John Dunphy
It sometimes seems that every liberal I meet is either an athiest or barely religious. Not all the time, but there's anti-religious perspective within the modern liberal movement. People talk about relgious nuts, but personally I've never met any of them....sure met some people with 'insane' foreign policy, but I've not yet met a person that's religious a zealot...and I've been around.
There is an anti-religious movement among intelligent and educated people To me ever person who wants to base a law on a religious ideal is a nut. I think you probably think that because you believe in the invisible big sky daddy just like they do, so they don't seem werid to you. Honestly I would love to believe in god and heaven and all that, I want there to be something after I die, but just seems so rediculous. Its All based on fantasy, and the only reason anyone beleives it is because there parents told them to, or they need something to help them deal with the inevitablity of death. There is no proof moses existed, and they didn't even realize Jesus was the son of god till like 2-3 hundred years after he died , come on, those people thought they could drill peoples heads and get the bad spirts out them back then. The church is crock, pope is BS, do you really think god comes and talks to that guy? Do you think he's got a special phone to god? Its just as crazy as there is going to be 30 virgins or whatever for muslim martyers. Christians laugh at the rediculousness and they can't even see how crazy the stuff they believe is. You might as well beleive in scientology, its just a likely to be true as the other religions
Frankly the idiot christians and jews who want a holy war are as bad if not worse in some ways then the muslims. At least the muslims, come from 3rd world countries so maybe there is bit of an excuse for their crazyness.
Skepticism is an educated attribute, not absolute views on the unknown...that's a matter of ignorance. Agnosticism is the best position for those of intelligience, not athiesm. Obviously you haven't been reading correctly...I've said many times I'm agnostic. I'll give you a definition, because it seems you don't know or your just not listening. agnostic:a person who holds that the existence of the ultimate cause, as God, and the essential nature of things are unknown and unknowable, or that human knowledge is limited to experience. Geez, what a needless rant.... These questions don't apply to me. I'm not catholic, and frankly I'm doubtful of the bible god, but I do find the teaching of Jesus as great...much like I believe other philosopher are great. Spirtuality to me is important, and private, and not for ridicule. It's obvious you got a bone to pick, as you're just ranting about a circumstances that doesn't dictate my position or beliefs. Get over it!
Yeah, haha, I call myself a "thiest", but everyone either gets confused or thinks thiest is the same as athiest, so now I just say "christian" to sum up my core values and relative beliefs. Then I'll explain I don't believe in any of the historical parts of it, like a "chosen people" Jew god that ordered his Jew people to throw babies over towers, or Moses who was disguisted with his generals who spared the women and children. But that my belief system in a God, Angels, Deamons, who interact, is roughly similar. Agnosticism is the LEAST acceptable level of religousness from an intelligence standpoint. (Since humans can only know of things through interaction, God and Aliens must and do exist, though the details may be off) Really religion and science are partners, but modern science has decided to BECOME a religion of nothingness. Science can only describe what things DO, not what they ARE. I.e. Jane is an honest (tells the truth), caring (cares for others), loving (loves others) person (bunch of mass that thinks and talks)! Science has proof without knowing what things are, and religion knows what things are without proof. Also, Mohammad COMMANDS his followers to KILL or CONVERT all non-muslims. Islam means "to submit", a muslim is "one who has submitted" the goal of Islam is to dominate the world, and force all christians, hindus, buddhists, athiests, alike into submission. Muslims who say otherwise are following Mohammad's command to lie to infidels.
well don't post on religious threads, if you don't like critisism, besides nothing I was talking about applied to you anyway.
What are you talking about!? I don't speak about my spirtuality (in real great detail), so there is no criticism of it. I speak of ideas that I welcome criticism of. And if nothing applies to me why use such language (below)? We are still using the same language here, are we not? It would be very hard to interpet this in a different fashion...almost seems like you're lying now. from a comment.... me:'I've not yet met a person that's religious a zealot...and I've been around.'
Don't sweat it with ferret - he is goes on like a drunk - he will keep trying to make you look like the fool even if you didn't say anything related to his rants. I personally respect your views because you don't agree with me, yet don't make everything I say sound foolish just because you don't believe in what I do AND you don't attack others beliefs either. I think what many of these guys view as "christian" is either some loony on TV trying to make money of christianity or catholics whose beliefs have some similarities. I personally don't have any respect beyond any true love for God, for the pope. I don't respect any man-made rituals and customs that have to do with religion, but I won't going bashing it (I will however correct it when it comes to the Word of God) - oh no, I must be a zealot, cause I belief in God and the Bible.....
no you are not zealot because you don't try to force your views on anyone else, or think we should have wars between religions
Thank you, I feel better now. But, I do vote, so doesn't that make me "forcing my views on others"? Just like your vote does to me? What laws do you agree with? (serious question, are there laws that you do?)
No big deal. When writing or asserting something about me, try to be careful with what you write. If it's true (and absolute), I might not like it, but atleast it's true. In any regards I'd rather you ask a question than assert (or write something) based on comments I'm making. Understanding each other and come to a better conclusion of things (even if we disagree) is ten times better than back and forth rhetoric.
No insult to either one of you, but I sometimes think Ferret and yo-yo are the same person. But I'm probably completely wrong to even consider that. I think it's important to get along as much as is possible. I generally like people that are Christian (they're very forgiving and polite), and I think they're portrayed in a bad manner by some. Not all of them are great, though. I think some Christians take their thoughts too far, but they're not unlike any other form of beliefs.
And you dont think constantly pushing forward the idea that youve been "chosen" somehow doesnt reek of discrimination? LOL. Ah hypocracy at its finest.
Add me to this list, I am the only Atheist I know. Everyone around me from work, friends, to even my significant other is religious and I have nowhere to express my opinions! I hate it that all my coworkers can talk about what they believe, but I can't open my mouth for fear of a lynch mob. I have one chick that already avoids me like I'm the devil at work, just because I'm an atheist! Arghhhhhhhhh!!!