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Advertising: Xrumer

Discussion in 'Digital Point Ads' started by dragons5, Aug 11, 2010.

  1. #1
    Please block advertising of Xrumer spamming and related websites (like the current ad for Xrchat Xrummer Forums).
     
    dragons5, Aug 11, 2010 IP
    robjones likes this.
  2. zipdrive

    zipdrive Well-Known Member

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    #2
    yes
    it is very poor that spammers are being allowed to advertise at the forum, such ads should be disallowed just as you can't post about xrumer
     
    zipdrive, Aug 11, 2010 IP
  3. Serious Workers

    Serious Workers Well-Known Member

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    #3
    Such type of things are not allowed on DP. Just report those threads/posts.
     
    Serious Workers, Aug 11, 2010 IP
  4. dragons5

    dragons5 Well-Known Member

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    #4
    its not a thread or post. its the new advertising system.

    i love the new system, thinking of trying out an add or two myself next week, but they need to watch who uses it for that junk.
     
    dragons5, Aug 11, 2010 IP
  5. Serious Workers

    Serious Workers Well-Known Member

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    #5
    I think Shawn already told about it, he manually reviews them and those who doesn't fit he denies them.
     
    Serious Workers, Aug 11, 2010 IP
  6. zipdrive

    zipdrive Well-Known Member

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    #6
    so he think that ads for a blackhat spamming service with xrumner are OK?
    than why doesn't he allow users to offer same services in BST ?
     
    zipdrive, Aug 13, 2010 IP
  7. mubashirnisar

    mubashirnisar Banned

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    #7
    zipdrive is right,when spamming related topics were not allowed,then how come these ads are allowed now?
     
    mubashirnisar, Aug 16, 2010 IP
  8. zipdrive

    zipdrive Well-Known Member

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    #8
    xrummer ads are still around
    doesn't dp have any business ethics and morals ?
    you are making the web a ugly place for everyone by allowing the promotion of such spamming tools
     
    zipdrive, Aug 28, 2010 IP
  9. digitalpoint

    digitalpoint Overlord of no one Staff

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    #9
    Not sure what ads have to do with "morals".

    1. I never heard of Xrumer before this thread.

    2. I just double checked and Google is serving Xrumer related ads through AdSense, and Google is serving Xrumer related ads. Does Google lack business ethics and morals?

    3. If we were to ban any talk of anything that could be deemed "spam", link sales and link exchanges would be banned as well (spam as far as I'm concerned).

    You can't *really* expect us to go through every possible page that exists within a destination domain and check for anything that might be spam related, do you? What if it's a large site with 10,000,000 pages of content?
     
    digitalpoint, Aug 28, 2010 IP
  10. dragons5

    dragons5 Well-Known Member

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    #10
    well i agree there shawn, and as a website owner I know its hard to make good $$ out there. but xrumer is a software program designed to attack any website hosting a forum, blog, etc.. and to spam the holy living hell out of it with all sorts of content and links. imagine if that was done to your forum. As a webmaster community is that something we really want to support by allowing it to support community? it comes down to that one question. If you're fine with it then realize that at the end of the day there are going to be numerous decent DP members who realize that their website was spam attacked by another DP member who clicked the ad (which you have full control of). Google has a mission to show relevant content to a search, whether or not they agree with it. The ads however, could be something their ad quality team just hasn't checked on yet and i'll be sure to send a note in about how i fell it violates their own company ethics of not being evil.

    Link swapping and manual things like that don't seem to be much of a problem in my book. They are limited by the amount of time, labor and capital resource inputs you utilize. Xrumer is automated and can utterly demolish a new forum, blog or other website owners admission in a few short hours. Just think, those are new webmasters who could have been your users. So is it short term profits or long-term usership you are going for I guess is the question.

    I for one couldn't see upgrading a membership when advertising is allowed for such things as I have had/have several websites that are continuously attacked by this scourges.
     
    dragons5, Aug 28, 2010 IP
  11. digitalpoint

    digitalpoint Overlord of no one Staff

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    #11
    It has nothing to do with profits, morals or anything else along those lines... it has everything to do with the practicality of the review process. I'm not saying Xrumer is or is not spam software (again, I've never heard of it before now). As far as I know, there aren't any ads in our system selling Xrumer software, just one that points to a discussion forum.

    We have reviewed all ads and statistically we have rejected 27% of ALL ads for one reason or another (we reject even if people's punctuation or capitalization is bad). So for you to claim we are trying to maximize profits at the expense of the user experience is well... absurd. All because you saw one ad that you (personally) didn't like. There are far more ads I (personally) think are lame... link selling for example is utterly spam as far as I'm concerned... I would never do it (buy or sell) because it *is* spam as far as I'm concerned. It doesn't mean other user wouldn't be interested in it, and that's the reality of it... I'm sure there is at least one person who doesn't like EVERY ad in the system for one reason or another. The best we can do is weed them out the best we can (again... 27% rejection rate). {shrug}

    You realize of course you didn't want to upgrade your membership for the last year before we even HAD an ad system, right? I'm not saying you should or should have, it's purely your choice, but making an argument that the reason you would never upgrade your membership because you don't like one ad that BARELY has any run time kind of has no relevance. You also should say "you couldn't see upgrading a membership even if there was no advertising". Again, purely your choice, and we don't expect ANYONE to buy premium membership, but the fact is that it was available to you for nearly a year before you saw an ad you didn't like and you didn't need/want it. And now that you saw an ad you don't like, you are saying you still don't need/want it (so no change).
     
    digitalpoint, Aug 28, 2010 IP
  12. Serious Workers

    Serious Workers Well-Known Member

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    #12
    That could be because, the owners passed the system test using some tricks. And if anyone would report that ad then the Adwords account of the ad owner would instantly get suspended.
     
    Serious Workers, Aug 28, 2010 IP
  13. dragons5

    dragons5 Well-Known Member

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    #13
    first i'd like to say that i have a huge amount of respect for you and what you've done here. when I saw the announcement about your own ad system I was thoroughly overjoyed (not a fan of adsense at all). Its your ad system so I guess it goes how you want it to and I really don't have much of a say in it. My only personal experience with xrumer has been a horrific one. I have had to shutter 4 websites now that were taking minimal updates from me until the forum software was exploited by these programs, that content also had me banned from google adsense. In one day over 100k posts were made to a football (american) forum I ran. The xrumer posts were about child pornography and snuff films with random viagra and cialis links. The forum software was not setup to mass delete posts, nor can the shared hosting provider the forum is on handle mass deletion of tables in that amount. The attack continued with 10k plus posts per day. Within days of course the userbase vanished and I was banned from adsense due to the content that was added by this automated software and not me or forum members.

    I I have since sold or just shut down all of my forums except the one with a large enough moderator base to keep up with the junk postings and forum software updates. Since it all began while I was wrapping up my marketing degree the stress was pretty unbearable and that's where respect for denizens of the web like Random Digilante comes in: http://randomdigilante.blogspot.com/

    I honestly don't remember this being available, but I was also banned (not sure why - although im guessing it was for my hardcore stance against forum and comment spam) for a large portion of that time and not until recently returned to DP as a marketer actually working in the field, not studying in a classroom. I merely wanted to let you know in my one instance that seeing that ad brought back the horrors I had gone through with xrumer spammers and blackhatters and weighs in my current decision to click "no thanks" when I see the premium membership pop up.

    again i respect your forum and your own ad system. I am just asking that ads for anything to do with xrumer go into the bucket of the 27% that you toss out. I know you need the system to generate some $$ for DP and I am all for that, but at the risk of destroying thousands of websites possibly owned by DP users, having accounts banned, and adding to a webmasters overall stress. I think that price is too high.

    please dont take this as an argument, just an impassioned plea. best wishes for the new ad system.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2010
    dragons5, Aug 28, 2010 IP
  14. digitalpoint

    digitalpoint Overlord of no one Staff

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    #14
    Well as I said, I'm not personally *for* spam related software... And in fact I didn't even know what it was until this thread.

    Again, I don't know much about it, but if you were getting bombed with child porn and snuff films, it's the operator of the software, not the software itself. The spammers we deal with here are mostly using PHP to attempt their spamming, and 95% of every email we get is spam. It doesn't mean we ban anything related to PHP or email.

    Somewhere the line needs to be drawn... Do we disallow people selling spam tools, do we disallow people talking about spam tools, do we disallow any user who is a member of a site that talks about spam tools, do we ban all users who have friends who ever talked about a spam tool, etc... Obviously that is an extreme example, but you get the point.

    The current ad system is not perfect (no one claimed it is)... All we can do is work to make it better.
     
    digitalpoint, Aug 28, 2010 IP
  15. RectangleMan

    RectangleMan Notable Member

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    #15
    Xrumer is a forum spam posting tool. It can bypass captcha and create accounts in mass quantity. It's a spammers dream basically and the cause of most forum spam. It's well written and updated to bypass the latest anti-spam measures.

    While it's impossible to ask that DP review the service of every advertisers there should still be a TOS/AUP you have with them. Maybe adding an xrumer/spamming clause is appropriate. I just don't see why threads here would be deleted and yet an advertisement for an xrumer service be allowed. Just as posts are reported members should be allowed to report and advertiser. Do you have a link to your advertiser TOS?

    Terrible story and not far-fetched at all. It's probably a common occurance even.

    I'm sure now that Shawn is alerted to the problem he'll take appropriate measures to deal with this. He's not inept.
     
    RectangleMan, Aug 28, 2010 IP
  16. joebert

    joebert Well-Known Member

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    #16
    I have a feeling the entire basis for this thread is centered around a sticky in the advertising forum at Digitalpoint. This sticky, http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showthread.php?t=1766250

    which at the time of this posting states (and specifically mentions Xrumer)

    I can see how that could upset someone. I'm also not a fan of banning guns because a few people have shot themselves in the foot. Banning the person who goes around advertising guns as a way to get rid of your neighbors annoying dog is cool with me though.

    <funny> Didn't you guys know, XRumer is a tool for load testing forums ! </funny>
     
    joebert, Aug 29, 2010 IP
  17. Abhik

    Abhik ..:: The ONE ::..

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    #17
    What's big deal ??!!
    XRumer service is no longer allowed on DP, so no problem with that.
    If any Advert is annoying you, do us a favor. Install a Ad Blocker.
     
    Abhik, Aug 30, 2010 IP
  18. Serious Workers

    Serious Workers Well-Known Member

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    #18
    DP Ads are not blocked by Ad Blocker.
     
    Serious Workers, Aug 30, 2010 IP
  19. noahqw

    noahqw Member

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    #19
    Xrumer has the right to advertise on Adsense. Does it make what there doing right? No, but that doesn't determine if they can or can't advertise on Google Adwords. Hell, think what you want but it's all a matter of opinion and many.
     
    noahqw, Nov 23, 2010 IP
  20. showoffyourwheels

    showoffyourwheels Peon

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    #20
    Not happy with these guys from xrumer or blackhat. I have been running my website www.showoffyourwheels.com.au for the past 6 years and even before I had a CMS system going my forums were under constant attack from sites like these registering bogus accounts just to gain bogus google ranking. I have spent hundreds of dollars on security systems including capcha, add numbers and even removed the link display to stop these assholes from doing this yet they still have figured out ways to get around this and I say this is immoral, wrong and I am even going so far as to say that I am compiling a database of bogus accounts and the dates, times and ip addresses that they were created using these procedures at which point I will be charging a $5 cleanup fee per bogus account. I call on all webmasters to join a class action suite right now to stop this shit from continuing. Users of the web need to stop thinking this is a victim-less crime and accountability must be enforced !
     
    showoffyourwheels, Feb 14, 2011 IP