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Where is God

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by simplyg123, Aug 13, 2008.

  1. PHPGator

    PHPGator Banned

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    #21
    I don't think it needs a revision. I haven't found any chapter in the bible that is unrelevant to todays times. I'm not saying that living a Christian life is the easiest thing to do, in fact, the bible doesn't make that claim either. Just like it was when it was written, it is not harder or any less hard either.

    However, we can find comfort in it by knowing that salvation comes through grace, not through works. This goes for all people who claim to be christians too, they need a savior just like everyone else. The bible is clear that no one is going to live a sinless life.
     
    PHPGator, Aug 14, 2008 IP
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  2. simplyg123

    simplyg123 Well-Known Member

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    #22
    I agree, the bible must be read in context, and its the idea that is interpreted, not necessarily the exact wording.


    Ahh but the bible does claim that Gods commands are easy or " not burdensome"

    1 John 5:3 >>


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    International Standard Version (©2008)
    For this demonstrates our love for God: We keep his commandments, and his commandments are not difficult,
    New American Standard Bible (©1995)
    For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.

    GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
    To love God means that we obey his commandments. Obeying his commandments isn't difficult

    King James Bible
    For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

    American King James Version
    For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

    American Standard Version
    For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

    Bible in Basic English
    For loving God is keeping his laws: and his laws are not hard.

    Douay-Rheims Bible
    For this is the charity of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not heavy.

    Darby Bible Translation
    For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments; and his commandments are not grievous.

    English Revised Version
    For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

    Webster's Bible Translation
    For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments; and his commandments are not grievous.

    Weymouth New Testament
    Love for God means obedience to His commands; and His commands are not irksome.

    World English Bible
    For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments. His commandments are not grievous.

    Young's Literal Translation
    for this is the love of God, that His commands we may keep, and His commands are not burdensome;


    Yes, the bible is also clear that you must try though. Through works you show your love and faith to God
     
    simplyg123, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  3. lightless

    lightless Notable Member

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    #23
    Sure, then the bible wouldn't be great help for the common man, the uneducated man, the man on the street. Wouldn't it be better if anyone could easily understand and apply the teachings As-Is right now rather than needing them to be interpreted [and sometimes misinterpreted ] by others who have their own agendas.
     
    lightless, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  4. procrastinator

    procrastinator Peon

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    #24
    god is in your heart
     
    procrastinator, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  5. simplyg123

    simplyg123 Well-Known Member

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    #25
    Absolutely, but....if the context is not compared to biblical history, one may not know the true meaning of the context.

    I dont know if you have read the bible, or studied it, but its way deeper than just stories, and lessons. The book is complete genius, i would go as far as saying it contains subliminal, or hidden messages. Its as if every book within it is connected, and by more than just the threads that bind it.

    My biggest problem is that there are commands from God within this book, that seem a bit harsh.

    For example women silence in church meetings. Read 1 cor 14:30 i believe. It is addressed to ALL Saints, this means you and I.

    If you claim the bible is not completely true or accurate, than fine... But most Christians believe that it is 100% accurate, and to be taken literal.

    Those that dont leave a wide door of interpretation possibilities wide open.

    One could manipulate the bible in ways like most user friendly churches have already done.

    If God were so worried about people having faith. Why not show himself and let it be known?

    He expects us to worship, honor and praise him, yet he hides on a cloud and watches without interaction.

    Sorry, but something is wrong with this never ending story. It is flawed and imperfect.

    If God is the perfect being that he is, why has he created an imperfect being?
     
    simplyg123, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  6. lightless

    lightless Notable Member

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    #26
    It could be put another way - We humans are too imperfect to understand god's perfection and his grand designs.

    Everyone has to find their own answers, their own god. There isn't one god or one way to god for everyone. If we all try to follow god in the exact same ways and do the exact same things, we will become sheep, robots. We would fail and never achieve all that's possible. Follow god in your own unique way.

    God is different for everyone. God created many different men. So different men can have different gods. I could be a father at home, teacher at school and a fanboy at a wrestling arena. If man can wear so many different masks, why can't god.

    God isn't perfect. He doesn't need to be perfect. Perfection is a misconception. Nothing is perfect. Everything can be changed and improved in some way.
     
    lightless, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  7. PHPGator

    PHPGator Banned

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    #27
    I am not saying that this is a lie here, but I would say that it is taken a little bit out of context. I personally think you can analyze that verse a little differently when the three that come after are applied as well.

    Here is the remainder of the scriptures with that verse:

    If you are saved, God has the power and will often change the desires of your heart. I'm not saying that Christians do not make mistakes and are not tempted, they are. However, you overcome the world by faith according to verse 5, not by your works.
     
    PHPGator, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  8. simplyg123

    simplyg123 Well-Known Member

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    #28

    I know the remaining verses, Ive studied this subject quite a bit, and burdensome is translated perfectly. It basically says that God gives you the power to endure.

    Perhaps i was never saved, but if this is true than other scriptures that say that only Gods children will do his will, are wrong, and I assure you i did his will, or at least what i thought was his will.

    While i was reading the word, and praying, and going to church, i was doing his will, i stopped cussing, i through away all of my music, i trashed many dvd's, i ended a relationship with a lost friend. I did Gods will. If i were lost and not saved, i would only do the will of Satan, at least that what the bible says.

    Basically what I'm trying to say is, Gods commandments were burdensome to me, I began to get bored with God, i couldn't find time for the bible, it became hard to get to church, I constantly felt like i was pretending, I felt like my wife was pretending.

    I had faith, but i wasn't getting anything in return, no assurance, no great holy feeling. Sure my conscience became more moral, but only because i was learning how to become more moral.
     
    simplyg123, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  9. PHPGator

    PHPGator Banned

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    #29
    Some christians can take it a little over the top. Personally, I think you have to make your own decision based on the bible on where the line is drawn in the sand. It wasn't 50 years ago that people were looking at Beatles music in the same light as devil worshiping. Sometimes church's have the problem of doing exactly as the Jews did with the law that was given to them. We take some of the commandments given by God and create our own versions of them, often them more difficult to follow.

    Perhaps this is where it got burdensome for you? I noticed you said you threw away all of your music, you got rid of a lot of things, probably felt obligated to dress a certain way when you go to church, you maybe felt like you couldn't hang out with people different than yourself, and you struggled with various things that Jesus Christ himself did not command. Jesus Christ wasn't and is not a pretty boy from a rich family. He hung out with some of the dirty fishermen in the area, he was homeless, and lived far from a glamorous life. That doesn't mean that he commands us to get rid of everything we own or that we are not allowed to live prosperous lives.

    I may be going in a direction that isn't related to the way you felt. But, may I ask, what commandments in the bible did you struggle with most? Keep in mind though, even these dirty fishermen that Jesus hung out with all the time had struggles of their own. I don't think based on the bible that it was meant to be difficult, but it doesn't make the claim that you will not have any temptation or trials in your life.
     
    PHPGator, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  10. simplyg123

    simplyg123 Well-Known Member

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    #30
    Well for one thing, the bible has many commandments, not just the 10 that everyone talks about the new testament brings to the table 53 which can be found here

    I find myself struggling with most, but ill list a few examples

    love your enemy - a man kills my wife and kids I'm supposed to love him?

    agreeing to your adversary, even when wrong for the sake of peace - I'm a mans man, i believe in self defense, this is along the lines of turning the other cheek, my pride fights with this one a lot.

    obey rules, submit to all ordinances of man for Christs sake - This is another pride issue, basically i have to submit to all laws of the land, whether they are right or wrong.

    Deny all ungodliness and worldly lusts - this would fall under the entertainment category

    These are just a few. I know that if i am able to do all of these, id be better for it. But trying to do all of these, leaves me feeling imprisoned.

    And if you think that we are not obligated to try you are wrong, not only are we obligated to try, we are obligated to keep our brothers accountable, which means we as Christians are to keep each other walking down the right path.

    If my brother in Christ starts falling into sin, it is my obligation to help steer him clear of evil obstacles. Its called accountability, and without it, you have a building full of pretenders, that will go home and fall back in the sin that they love.

    Being a Christian is supposed to be full-time, not only while at church.
     
    simplyg123, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  11. PHPGator

    PHPGator Banned

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    #31
    I certainly agree with everything you have there. I'm just wanting to stress the point that just because you are saved doesn't mean you won't have struggles and temptations. You shouldn't give up just because you feel as though you can't live a perfect life. No one has or ever will be able to do that. I'm not sure why you feel as though you are expected to. I just spoke at church to some of our youth about these two verses. To give you cliffnotes, the "saying" and "full acceptance" is something to make serious note of in these two scriptures. Part of the saying is realizing that you are no better, or worse, than anyone else. Part of being a christian is realizing that you alone are not good enough to get to heaven on your own merrit. We all have to have a saviour.

    1 Timothy 1:15-16: Here is a trustworthy saying that deserves full acceptance: Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners—of whom I am the worst. But for that very reason I was shown mercy so that in me, the worst of sinners, Christ Jesus might display his unlimited patience as an example for those who would believe on him and receive eternal life.
     
    PHPGator, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  12. simplyg123

    simplyg123 Well-Known Member

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    #32
    My biggest issue is not the struggles of the flesh v/s the spirit, i understand that that is expected. Its more along the lines of, Where is this loving savior, why must i continue to believe and trust and obey, if he wont even acknowledge that he hears me. He is supposed to be this almighty God that can do anything, yet he cant show his face. This is where my issue lies.

    The bible tells us all these things about God, yet we don't see it in reality. We can imagine or pretend that God is active in our lives, but in reality we are just assuming that its him and not the natural order of things.

    The big question is
    Where is God and Why wont he show his face

    The only possible answers are, his power is limited, he doesn't care, or we simply have it all wrong, including the bible.
     
    simplyg123, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  13. bluemouse2

    bluemouse2 Well-Known Member

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    #33
    God is everywhere.
     
    bluemouse2, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  14. debunked

    debunked Prominent Member

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    #34
    Hopefully I hear you correctly and I can relate. I have had times in my life I felt He wasn't doing anything or was hearing me, but those times have passed. One time was much longer than the other. My faith has increased because of those times.

    One thing I love about the DP forums has been the challenges that the religious and anti-religious have brought. They make me have to look and double check things and really got me to be more careful of religions and religious people. Like what gator said, there are so many adding their own rules and like Jesus combated during His years talking to the religious leaders of His time. I keep taking "christian" beliefs and comparing them to the Bible and what Jesus says.

    One other thing to ask Simply - when Jesus paid the price for your sins - where were you?
     
    debunked, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  15. thewolf32

    thewolf32 Active Member

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    #35
    Don't know who that God is, must be your imaginary friend.
     
    thewolf32, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  16. simplyg123

    simplyg123 Well-Known Member

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    #36
    Well i certainly hope my lack of assurance and faith will pass, i hope God will speak to me in a way that i would know it could be only him. I hope this will happen. I have not given up at all, just found some doubt thats caused me to feel wrong with my faith, i go to church and wonder, is everyone else here like me, or are they convinced. For the longest time i pretended to be convinced, so i know for sure that the members of my church would only try to change my mind rather than agree that my questions are relevant.

    God is almighty, and i do want to know him, but i don't want to have to guess whats right and whats not.

    As far as where was i when Jesus paid for my sins, i can tell you this much...

    If i knew who Jesus was, and i had the ability to help him, rather than have him tortured by the sins of the world. I would not think twice. I would die for him.

    This is exactly my point. God knows my heart, he knows i only seek the truth, yet i have to jump through hoops, trials and tribulations, and play a guessing game with finding true doctrine, just to get his attention. And even after that, Im still ignored. God should have the ability to change my mind in the same way he claims to change our hearts.
     
    simplyg123, Aug 14, 2008 IP
  17. moneymanus

    moneymanus Peon

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    #37
    What you expect GOD will come to this forum and answer you. Will you trust him? If somebody comes in this forum and appear with username GOD and anwer all your questions?

    Same thing. People not even trust Muhammad or Jesus or any prophet that said we are messenger of GOd.

    Tortured them to death. thrown stones.

    What you expect if God appears to us we will do to him? He will be bombered with questions and cases and all those terrible things that will be big insult to his kinghood.

    God found its better not to be in creation. But stay Above creation. He has given you hands legs kidney lever mother father sex and what not in this world? What you need him for? So many things in this world he has given you you are still not satisfied and want to bother him with questions\.>? He even not forcing you to pray or asking any thing from you. Money or donation.

    Please leave God alone. God is not making products for sale. So you cannot expect customer support from him.
    Everything he could assist he has done with messengers. Jesus Muhammad Messiah Ibrahim Adam and what not have come.

    If you see Gods eyes or legs you will feel safe? All your tension and problem will go? You will start to earn 10x more? Everything will change? Never.

    What if God is Octopus? Happy now?? Forget about God

    Just dont hurt others or dont hurt yourself. And he is with every creation. No muslim No hindu No christian No buddisht. No particular Animal or object. He is owner of us all. And We are all creation of him and have given and taught enough to take care of ourselves.

    And no BIBLE NO QURAN NO religion Can Show you GOD. Because he is not a sales man. And he doesnt even need your worship to sustain. Its for your betterment he released all those books. Read them or burn them.

    We exist because God Exist.

    Think like this . You are a God of your own. You are God to your family your children your wife. And now answer them and solve their problems ok? How does it feel? Do it continously until death.

    And think like this. God has answered all your questions already. If still not get it. Go to answer.com or yahoo answers and find it. Some Gods representative(or mini Gods) are always available next door to you.

    Why you in digital point? Who given brain to humans to create computer internet software forums? So if you humans can make digital point and solve webmaster related problems and arrange discussions. Why bother God?

    Everything is done. And Gods duty is over. Its your duty to carry it. Cant? Suicide. God has made that way also. Dont blame God for that. Say thanks that he atleast made a way for you to quit.

    Just leave God Alone.
     
    moneymanus, Aug 16, 2008 IP