The SERP Position of this domain seems impossible

Discussion in 'Search Engine Optimization' started by Steven_D, Jun 2, 2008.

  1. #1
    I have been checking a competitors site, and they are placed first in google, yet their site has less than 8 indexed pages and less than 20 backlinks.

    This is the search being done
    http://www.google.co.nz/search?hl=en&cr=countryNZ&safe=off&pwst=1&q=direct+mail&start=0&sa=N

    The top link is
    dmail.co.nz which links to dmail.co.nz/index.php?paid=2

    I am on page 3
    http://www.google.co.nz/search?hl=en&cr=countryNZ&safe=off&pwst=1&q=direct+mail&start=20&sa=N

    and a few pages back dmail.co.nz is listed again under this url
    dmail.co.nz/index.php?paid=3&PHPSESSID=0983bef77f333a2ec2a1ad2502daea6e

    the main sites the domain is listed on is
    wises.co.nz
    yellow.co.nz
    nzs.com
    nzcentral.com

    the back links look like this
    URL Google Yahoo! Live AllTheWeb AltaVista
    dmail.co.nz 1 24 3 24 24

    googlebot last accessed the site on the 30th May 2008

    When I check the spider accessable text this is the result
    about us portfolio client upload contact us Home Mailhouse Services Digital Printing Print Management Online Products Dmail Copyright 2006 All rights reserved { site design by brownpaperbag }


    The site is only a PR3 which is very generous considering the back links.


    This site ranks higher than nzpost.co.nz which has over 5000 back links most of them from governemnt / global postal associations.

    http://www.smartpagerank.com/pagerank-backlinks.php?domain=www.nzpost.co.nz

    Nzpost is a pr6 with 4500 indexed pages.

    There is something here that I am missing. dmail.co.nz has been at the top of the list for more than 30 days.

    Im looking for a response similar to

    They have done (specific technique here)

    thanks
     
    Steven_D, Jun 2, 2008 IP
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  2. Steven_D

    Steven_D Peon

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    #2
    also brownpaperbag.co.nz (the site designer) has a PR5 despite only having 150 incomming links, from a total of 6 different websites (all their clients).

    they have no listings on directories or anything else.
     
    Steven_D, Jun 2, 2008 IP
  3. FPForum

    FPForum Notable Member

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    #3
    This position should not be impossible to hit. How old is your domain? Do you have good quality backlinks? I think this position in .co.nz should not be that tough if your domain ends in .co.nz
     
    FPForum, Jun 2, 2008 IP
  4. Steven_D

    Steven_D Peon

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    #4
    yeah my site is only a few days old. I agree the position will not be hard to hit, im alreay on page 3. What I dont understand is how this little site with 8 back links can be ahead of NZ post which has 5K back links from PR6 and PR7 and PR8 sites aswell as 4500 indexed pages?
     
    Steven_D, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  5. Aryans

    Aryans Well-Known Member

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    #5
    It is happen because this site is have very little wight and have good quality content and I tell you what it will not listing in log terms and these sites which "have 5K back links from PR6 and PR7 and PR8 sites aswell as 4500 indexed pages" they will show you alway on top if they are doing work as they done
     
    Aryans, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  6. Steven_D

    Steven_D Peon

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    #6
    sorry bro, I have no idea what you are trying to say.

    All I want to know is how dmail.co.nz got ahead of nzpost.co.nz

    this has nothing to do with my site.
     
    Steven_D, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  7. Spider-Man

    Spider-Man Banned

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    #7
    Is this post just an April Fools come terribly late? The keyword only has ~78,000 results - you could get number 1 for that phrase just by writing an article or two and submitting it to various portals, all in less than half an hours' work:eek:
     
    Spider-Man, Jun 3, 2008 IP
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  8. sweetfunny

    sweetfunny Banned

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    #8
    nzpost is first for me, but the answer to your question is dmail has "Direct Mail" in the Title and mail in the domain name.

    The Title holds the most bang for your buck on-page, and they have used it and ranked for a fairly non-competitive term.
     
    sweetfunny, Jun 3, 2008 IP
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  9. Steven_D

    Steven_D Peon

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    #9
    so the title is more powerful than the back links (for this low ranked keyword), and potentially also because of the 3 words in the title, 2 of them match.

    Is there not a way to check if a site is doing something sneeky. the page only contains 3 lines of text. It just seems so hard to believe, someone made a site 8 pages all pictures, put it on the net, never advertised it and it got ahead of the New Zealand postal service which has been around since like 1880.
     
    Steven_D, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  10. sweetfunny

    sweetfunny Banned

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    #10
    They are ahead of the NZ Postal service for 1 non-competitive phrase from thousands that the postal service does rank for, it's hardly an accomplishment.

    I rank ahead of Google for a bunch queries with Google in it also.

    Backlinks and Pagerank isn't everything, if it was the PR10 and PR9 sites would rank for every term you type. Exact phrase matching is highly important, and so is the page Title and this site has simply matched the exact search term in a short descriptive Title plus have half the phrase directly in their domain.

    I'm not sure why you find this so unbelievable, the search term only has 80k results.
     
    sweetfunny, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  11. Steven_D

    Steven_D Peon

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    #11
    I know the number of results is small, but from what I am reading from this post is that seo is completly irrleevant. all you have to do is

    pick a niche (small and geographically small) - so this is like anywhere outside of the US.
    Buy a domain with the niche clearly spelt out in the domain name.
    Write 4 lines of text.

    Considering how cheap a domain is (less than $15)
    you could just pick 25 domains (less than $400)
    create a few pages for each (100 pages)
    rank first in google with 25 domains
    Sell these domains to the competitors for say $1000 each ($25,000)
    pocket the $24,600 as profit.

    You could do this 5 times a year and that would be around $123,000 pa

    so if what your saying is true, then I have just found a new hobby, all I want to make sure is that they are not doing something 'blakhat' to get there, because that means that I would waste the $400 and time making the pages.

    does that make more sense?
     
    Steven_D, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  12. sweetfunny

    sweetfunny Banned

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    #12
    Your plan is slightly flawed, you're assuming competitors will pay $1,000 for your domain.

    You will be ranking for low competition keywords, if i was your competitor and you contacted me about buying a domain that ranked for "Direct Mail" on a locality search with 80k results i would just make a page targeting that term and beat you myself for free and say thanks for the keyword idea.
     
    sweetfunny, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  13. johnnie

    johnnie Peon

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    #13
    You're overlooking the fact that the #1 page might be well-optimized for this keyword. It's not all about PR you know.
     
    johnnie, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  14. Steven_D

    Steven_D Peon

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    #14
    The one thing I have learnt is that business owners are predominantly stupid, especially things with internet and computers. Selling a domain to a company you can visit would be as easy as giving them money.

    And there are 10,000 results so at least 25 companies would be interested.

    I dont plan on doing it at the moment, im just thinking about how they got there with 0 effort.
     
    Steven_D, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  15. sweetfunny

    sweetfunny Banned

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    #15
    Maybe so, but they own and operate a business and understand (hopefully lol) things like investment and returns on that investment.

    You would really need to monetize that term, and show them they can buy it for $x and make their return in x months.

    Because they are predominantly stupid with computers as you say, buying a domain when they own a brand just won't make much sense unless you put it in to dollars and why it's a wise move to their business.

    If you can rank these domains for profitable terms, you are way better off keeping and monetizing them and have them earn a passive stream of income that goes in to your pocket.

    Typically businesses won't buy sites out unless it poses a threat, can bring something to the table in terms of an idea, concept or technology or the people working for the site comes along and they bring specific skills.

    It's not often they will buy a site because it ranks for a keyword, unless of course that keyword brings "substantial" profits. If it does that, you are far better off keeping it yourself.

    But all the best with it if you try.
     
    sweetfunny, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  16. Steven_D

    Steven_D Peon

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    #16
    might give it ago, I am sure that selling it to business owners will be easy. I own two companies and deal with all sorts of different companies so I already know who i would target I just dont think I can be bothered @ this stage.

    But to answer my question, doesnt seem like they are doing anything wrong, just a lack of info, so the terms on their page carry more weight.

    Thanks for all your help guys.
     
    Steven_D, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  17. edual200

    edual200 Active Member

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    #17
    i see nzpost #1
    anyways nzpost "page" thats listed for those terms is pr0 the other is pr3, the actual page thats listed is what matters as far as PR goes... for 90k results it should be very easy to get there with no optimizing, i have about 10,000 pages listed #1 for they keywords i wanted with no optimizing.
     
    edual200, Jun 3, 2008 IP
  18. Steven_D

    Steven_D Peon

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    #18
    Steven_D, Jun 4, 2008 IP