Stox, I really don't know how I come off - truth be told, I'm not after owning D16, or anyone, as much as getting to the truth. I would hope we all are, and maybe I should revisit my own blinders in place that way. Given the nature of the exchanges between you and me, I can't imagine that was an easy thing to post. I am grateful - Thanks.
To make few things clear, 'Religion of peace' (with both a/the) is widely used phrase to refer Islam, that is why when D16man posted in my thread, I believed he meant Islam. My thread 'Yet another honor killing' had nothing to do with not only Islam (and I made it very clear in the OP) but any specific religion or culture. It was meant to put emphasis on two major issues. 1) Honor Killing 2) Caste system. So I posted a reply to D16, clearing that the Islam is not an issue there. However, D16 said and kept insisting that he never meant Islam and since he is insisting that he never meant Islam but Hinduism (which is also wrong, I'll clear it later in this post) so Paul, as I said in the PM, there is no point in taking this issue any further. You made your point clear, D16 stated his points and now it's open to other members to judge the issue. Now I see an argument over whether caste system is a Hinduism exclusive between Grim and D16. No, it's not. In India or rather Indian subcontinent, caste system is seen in many religions other than Hinduism. Sikhs have caste system, Jains have caste system, even Christians (actually converted Christians) and Muslims also practice caste system in some parts. So although caste system is easily associated with Hinduism, it's not limited to Hinduism only, and that is why I said I suspect that the killer was a Hindu, since I wasn't 100% sure.
Web, as you know, I PM'ed you after your post above, because this isn't what you wrote to me. I wrote because your indicating otherwise heaps further doubt on my character, and frankly, I've had enough of misstruths. It appears that you even posted an additional "yes" vote in the poll above, which contradicts your statement again. (no one had visited the thread since yesterday afternoon, and as of last night, mid-morning, when I was up on other threads, the "yes" had remained at 11. It changed to 12 with your visit). Regretfully, I need to clear things up. I have to dishonor myself by breaking confidentiality, but I can no longer allow lies to be foisted publically against my statements.
I know what I wrote Paul, I also wrote that I don't want to be involved in the issue. I see no point to carry this argument but since you posted my PMs, I have to admit that I believed he goofed up and tried to cover that later. But that is what I think and I can't be 100% sure on that. No one except D16 knows what he actually meant and since D16 is insisting he never meant Islam, it doesn't matter what I or you think. Well, When I say I don't want to be involved in an issue, I keep myself away. That means I didn't vote in this poll. As for proof I'm posting this screenshot that appeared on my screen just before I clicked the post reply button to make this post. So you can see your accusation or assumption is wrong. Well, thats a breach of confidentiality, but I think I no longer had control over my thoughts once I uttered (or wrote) them to a second person. I didn't want to be involved in the issue, but sadly now I have to be involved in an extremely pointless argument.
Yes, I heard the same thing from D16. "You know what you wrote." Except that what you wrote is patently contrary from what you said you wrote, and certainly had no issue with leaving my character hung out to dry. Yep, I regret it has come to this as well. Unfortunately, I would that this would have been cleared up long ago.
Northpoint and Webby, I believe fully you were both intelligent enough to see what was going on I respect you both as posters, no sense in getting upset further on this instance. I know why Northpoint is bugged so much by this, I get it all the time where someone flat out lies, you show them they lied and they smile hopping around the entire time thinking in their mind they are not lying. It is not only irritating as hell, it simply makes me even question humanity at times to be honest that people are out there like that.
Paul, I don't see how my reply left your character to hung out to dry. In my edited post (That you quoted) I didn't point a finger to you. I wrote since D16 is insisting that he never meant Islam there is no point to carry the issue. You should have known if I wanted to be involved in the issue then instead of apologizing to D16, I would have taken the issue as you did. D16 made a post, I believed he meant Islam and made a counter reply, he said he didn't mean Islam so I apologize for mistaking his post and ended the matter there with him. I'm not even taking the issue with you for posting my PMs even when you promised you will keep them confidential. Actually I was ready for it. It wasn't the first time when someone posted the PM after making the promise to keep them confidential.
Web, as you know from looking at the above, there was a considerable gap between my last post and yours. When yesterday you indicated yesterday you would "clear few things" in this thread, and then didn't, I figured you were just too uncomfortable to tell the truth, so I let this thread go, difficult as it was for me. Your post this morning, however, cleared nothing up and only increased the problem. I wrote to you to very clearlyto let you know this was how I felt, and that absent your telling the full truth, I would need to do it myself, in my mind, in order that my own character was no longer called into question. You indicated "you understood my point, and would edit [your] post accordingly." Your "edit" did nothing but increase the problem. I believe I have been patient in a way not many on the forum would be under similar circumstances. I do not feel proud nor happy, but feel what I did was necessary, under those circumstances.
Paul, I had mentioned countless time that I wanted to stay away from the issue. The PM I wrote to you had my personal thoughts about the issue, that I wanted to keep personal. However, I didn't keep them to me once I wrote them to you. The considerable gap is due to one conversation being private and another being public. In public conversation I kept my neutral stance. The post I made I tried to cover two thing ultimately. 1) My stance on this ongoing issue with you and D16man, I kept my neutral stance on the Issue, publicly. I didn't point a finger to your character nor to D16man's character. Never did I say that I would make a post supporting you or D16man. I always choose to stay away from the conflicts those are not mine. However, I mentioned what I believed and why I feel the argument is pointless I expected you to respect my neutral stance, however you didn't and posted the PMs I wrote to you. The another thing I cleared in my post that caste system is not exclusive to Hinduism.