Ron Paul DP Misdirection - And Correction

This is a quote from a post in THIS thread, from GTech to GRIM.

First of all, this is slander, and an Ad Hominem attack. It also includes a strawman argument, that nutty supporters don't know his position.

I would argue that when his position is misrepresented, by people who use unsourced Blog posts as research tools (and poorly written blog posts at that), it can confuse a Ron Paul supporter.

Here is the portion of the post that contains misrepresentation.

Hmm. So some blogger, wrote about Ron Paul's record on immigration. Let's address it, point by point (pay attention GTech, this is where due diligence in sourcing is required).

2005: Ron Paul voted against the Duncan Hunter (R-CA) Amendment to H.R. 4437 to increase border controls

Rep. Paul voted against the Hunter Amendment to H.R. 4437. The Hunter Amendment would shore up security by building fences and other physical infrastructure to keep out illegal aliens. The Hunter Amendment passed by a vote of 260-159.​

Here is Ron Paul's speech from the House Floor.

Looks pretty consistent to me. Voted against Amendment, voted for final passage of the Bill.

2005: Ron Paul voted against H.R. 418 to increase border controls

Rep. Paul voted against H.R. 418 to strengthen border control by requiring completion of the last 3.5 miles of the San Diego border fence. As well, H.R. 418 would broaden the terrorism-related grounds for inadmissibility and deportability of aliens. H.R. 418 passed by a vote of 261-161.​

This one is funny. Did the author even look up H.R. 418?

H.R. 418 (2005) was not the border fence bill (blog post is a terrible source, GTech should know better, I have already punked Lorien on this type of irresponsible blog sourcing). It was the Real ID Act, and Paul is opposed to national ID cards where your information goes into a database, and shared with foreign governments.
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h109-418

http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2005/cr020905.htm

2004: Ron Paul voted against the Virgil Goode (R-VA) Amendment to H.R. 4200 authorize the U.S. military on the border

Rep. Paul voted against authorizing the Secretary of Defense to assign members of the military, under certain conditions, to assist in the performance of border control functions. The Goode Amendment passed the House by a vote of 231-191.

2001: Voted against the Traficant Amendment to H.R. 2586 to authorize the use of troops on the border

Rep. Paul voted against authorizing the Attorney General and the Secretary of the Treasury to request that members of the Armed Forces assist the INS with border control efforts. The Traficant Amendment passed by a vote of 242-173.​

H.R. 4200 (Amendment) & H.R. 2586 - Explanation? Posse Comitatus Act (18 U.S.C. § 1385).

The military are never meant to be used within our borders to enforce the law. That is the definition of a police state. One day they are rounding up immigrants, the next day, they are rounding up dissidents. The next day, it's Jews. You know where this leads, and hence, the Posse Commitatus Act, which is LAW.



Regarding the Border Fence.

H.R. 4437 was Duncan Hunter's first Fence Bill, and Ron Paul voted for it.
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/vote.xpd?vote=h2005-661

Paul also voted YES, on Hunter's passed bill H.R. 6061 (Secure Fence Act of 2006)
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/vote.xpd?vote=h2006-446

It's a shame that GTech relies on poorly written blog posts to get perspective. I know that if he would just look at facts, he'd see a lot clearer on many issues.

 

No need to research anything when you can easily see what you want to see.

 

Well, I appreciate a lot of the misguided and uninformed posters, because they allow me an opportunity to present Dr. Paul's position, his principles and his consistency.

 

Thank you for the excellent post and clarification on the subject at hand.

 

Thats easily done, isn't it?

Here are some other instances that RP is against securing our border....want the source, look up the vote history, its all there. I do your work all the time, the least you can do is repay the favor:
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]2005: Ron Paul voted against the Duncan Hunter (R-CA) Amendment to H.R. 4437 to increase border controls [/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1] Rep. Paul voted against the Hunter Amendment to H.R. 4437. The Hunter Amendment would shore up security by building fences and other physical infrastructure to keep out illegal aliens. The Hunter Amendment passed by a vote of 260-159. [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]2005: Ron Paul voted against H.R. 418 to increase border controls [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1] Rep. Paul voted against H.R. 418 to strengthen border control by requiring completion of the last 3.5 miles of the San Diego border fence. As well, H.R. 418 would broaden the terrorism-related grounds for inadmissibility and deportability of aliens. H.R. 418 passed by a vote of 261-161.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]2004: Ron Paul voted against the Virgil Goode (R-VA) Amendment to H.R. 4200 authorize the U.S. military on the border [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1] Rep. Paul voted against authorizing the Secretary of Defense to assign members of the military, under certain conditions, to assist in the performance of border control functions. The Goode Amendment passed the House by a vote of 231-191.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]2001: Voted against the Traficant Amendment to H.R. 2586 to authorize the use of troops on the border [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1] Rep. Paul voted against authorizing the Attorney General and the Secretary of the Treasury to request that members of the Armed Forces assist the INS with border control efforts. The Traficant Amendment passed by a vote of 242-173.
[/SIZE][/FONT]

 

d16 did you even bother to read the opening post? All you did was copy and paste information trully making you look really bad atm

I'm honestly embarassed for you atm, especially the part of H.R. 418

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=109_cong_bills&docid=f:h418ih.txt.pdf
there was much more to it than just building some more fence

Can you people do anything more than copy and paste from a blog online?

Speaking of flip flopping, I hope you love the irony here.

Huck

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-huckabee11dec11,0,5055587.story

http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071208/NATION/112080054/1028/ELECTION

These are just a few, want more?

 

Are you listening?

H.R. 418 is the Real ID Act

He's against using troops on the border because of various things. As Guerilla stated, Posse Comitatus most of all.

He's against the Hunter amendment, as given in his fucking words, as quoted before you even posted in this thread.


Guerilla basically said "this is why Paul voted against these things, he's for tightening immigration but has legitimate concerns with these bills because of ___", to which you replied "but he's against these bills!". Your argument was defeated before you ever typed a word. Good game, sir.

 

Problem is he didn't even type, all he did was copy and paste from Gtechs 'source'

 

The reason I did that was simply because I doubt any of you actually looked at the site. Seriously, what is the RP stance this week? for or against?


Besides immigration, I guess his stance on foreign policy is liberal as well....check out this video of him being booed...for those of you that don't speak spanish, there is a transcript...

http://hotair.com/archives/2007/12/10/video-ron-paul-gets-booed-at-the-univision-gop-debate/

 

I did look at the site, seriously are those against RP this weak?
That weak that they copy and paste from a blog without looking into why someone voted against particular bills.

I for one am glad someone doesn't blindly vote for a bill.

Of course if you want true flip flopping that would be your boy Huck. You sure jumped up and down when you thought RP was caught flip flopping, however not a word when it's proven Huck is a pro at flip flopping

 

Last I checked, this thread is about RP and not Huck, so are you trying to change the subject to further your agenda?

I noticed that you said nothing about the video of RP...living in denial?

 

Do you even bother to look into anything at all? I mean seriously do you do any research?

He was booed for talking about getting over the way we currently treat Cuba and speaking about Chavez

This does not make his stance 'liberal' it makes his stance going back to what our country was founded on.

BTW Huck also felt we should end the embargo on Cuba, as I previously posted. He flip flopped on that, but he pandered to the audience, Paul however does not pander.

Next lame attempt?

 

Nope, you added the video 'after' you originally posted. You don't expect my response to have that info in it when you yourself didn't have that do you?

As far as this being about 'RP' well 'RP' was brought up in Huckabees thread

Just exposing the hypocrites for who they are

You make it so damn easy.

 

His way of being friends is leaving them alone and hoping they will in turn leave us alone. Hello, we are at war with Islamic Fascism...we leave them alone and they will attack again, just like they did on 9/11.

There was time to look...you responded after I had done the edit...

 

rotflmao

 

Well, they attacked because they were not left alone. That is the gist of the foreign policy argument. It's the same old, same old. You want endless war, then continuing to occupy other countries, and put our military on holy land, then that is the way to do it.

The only solution to your perspective, is ethnic and religious genocide.

Btw, anyone who quotes hotair, they are the ones who exposed Alex Jones getting paid by Ron Paul on their blogs. But wait, he was actually getting a refund, people are just too stupid and ignorant to read an FEC report accurately before posting a blog at hotair. Already called Lorien on this.

Do any of you neocons or neolibertarians actually read anything? Ask any questions? Read sources?

 

He unlike others looks at why the terrorists hate us, and actually follows what our own intelligence officials have reported. The war in Iraq has created more terrorists, great game plan you guys have.

LOL. Yeah you're not taking into the time consideration for when I was making my response!
If you look at the time stamps my post is at the SAME time as your edit.

 

This thread was posted at 9:11 pm

OMG ANTI-AMERICAN!!!!!

 

You didn't read the transcript of the booing, did you? Once again, are you not going to respond?

Furthermore, when I edited, I was the last post, yours was not up yet.

Also, in terms of flip-flopping, I just found this gem about your boy RP:

http://victoriakos.blogspot.com/2006/07/ron-paul-19th-century-man.html

yet in the original post of this thread RP states that the military should never be used....which is it?

 

You have me extremely confused, I did respond even quoted part of the transcript for you.

Ahh did you refresh yet? Or is it that I was still typing and was 2 seconds behind you hitting the submit button, I of course during this time would not see you edit.

Thanks for the link, I'll be glad to look into it.

Still silence on your boy flip flopping? Avoidance, I guess stay blind and things don't exist.