DP Writing absolute crap?

I'm not sure I'd consider myself and my friends "luxury." I think the opposite it true - most of the writers (or those selling written words) are of the bargain basement variety. There is place for that sort of work, but it's not the type that I produce.

My rates are at the very low end of professional. I charge $0.08-$0.12 per word, and specialize in family related topics (parenting, pregnancy, education, etc...) I also write easily and well on many business related topics, and usually only turn down projects that are very "techie." My husband is the "techie" around here.

If you are looking for writers that have been around awhile and who can produce magazine quality material, I'd stick to checking out signatures for websites and portfolios in the Copywriting, Blogging, or Business section. Although you might find some high end writers browsing the Content Creation section or promoting a special offer.

Rebecca

 

How do I get started? I joined DP about a year and a half ago. I found myself out of work with rent due, and I turned to the internet for work. Luckily, I'm smart enough to spot scams and I was blessed to find DP. I obtained a client here who paid me $5 for 300-500 word articles about Las Vegas. I wrote 5 or 6 articles for this individual before I realized that 20 bucks wasn't going to pay the rent. In addition, I wrote a few other articles that I posted in various places and they have since been used by several websites for content. My name is out there on a very small scale.

This is not to say that this small venture wasn't a good experience. The individual I worked with gave me positive feedback and agreed to post the articles under my name. I actually used some of the work to acquire a job that I still have now as a Technical Writer for a large rental company here in Vegas.

Now, I am back. Over the last month or so, I have been feeling burned out with "working for the man". I have wanted to have my own business since I was a young teenager. I have passion for writing and using the internet as my publisher. I have various blogs, a website, and what I feel is a lot of potential to make this my living.

The issue is time. I don't have a lot of time with my current full-time job, and I can't take a gamble and quit at the present time. Do any of you have advice for me? I have evenings and weekends to build a rapport with potential clients, set up a website, and do whatever I need to do. What would those of you who are seasoned copywriters give me as your best advice in my situation? Any information is greatly appreciated. Thanks for reading.

 

I'm not what i'd call a "seasoned copyrwriter" but my advice would be to just have one site, market the crap out of it, make the writing creative but also make it something people want to read. Try and make your writing exceptional, so that people actually come to your blog because they enjoy reading your writing!

good luck.

 

There's some great advice in these threads.

I started out doing the 'posting for pennies' thing a couple of years ago, and worked my way up, building relationships with a few clients, and getting word of mouth recommendations. I still pick up the occasional job on here, but usually not from the B/S/T section.

I look for people wanting long term relationships and regular work - they usually want a higher standard of work, and are willing to pay for quality and reliability.

 

I actually did exactly what you don't want to. I knew for a while that I wanted to go out on my own between my PR and writing work. Yet I was scared to death about giving up the security of a regular job. One day I just did it. Yes, it was a constant struggle in the beginning, but at the same time there's an incredible amount of motivation when you literally have to succeed.

I wouldn't recommend the same course of action for the vast majority of writers though. I'd been freelance writing offline for a few years already, and had plenty of experience and a lot of contacts in the music industry already (I went fully into music publicity in the beginning). If you don't have those sorts of things in your favor, stay where you are until you do. Here are a few things to think about though:

Does being with your current employer add to your credibility within the niche you want to write in? If not, do you have the experience to get another job that would better benefit your long-term goals? Is it possible to work part-time and freelance full-time (you'd still have the extra motivation of needing to succeed, but you'd have a bit of a "cushion" with the income)? Can you charge more for what you're currently doing part-time to help better prepare you financially for making a move to it full-time?

I'd suggest having the following things in order before going full-time:

1. Save enough to pay at least 3 months' rent / mortgage and other basics if possible (you may not need as much if you're in a two-income household - in that case you'll need your spouse's support to some degree though).

2. Have a realistic and thorough business plan in place for the possible expansion (including marketing plan).

3. Have your website and a few key portfolio pieces set up and good to go. If you don't have portfolio pieces, create them for yourself as mock pieces, and just replace them once you have something better to add.

Jenn

 

Roughly a year ago I left a high-paying job as a knowledge executive at a real estate development firm to start my own e-commerce consulting company. I left because I was tired of the 80 hour weeks, constant travel, and spending my days convincing people who'd never cracked the cover of a book that there was value to making well-planned, well-researched decisions.

Since I left my previous job I've lost a girlfriend, make about half as much money, work 100 hour weeks, constantly travel, and spend my days convincing people who've never cracked the cover of a book that there IS VALUE in making well-planned, well-researched decisions... and I am happier than I've ever been.

Personally, this issue has been very tough to broach because the intangible quality of "working for oneself" and the tangible variable of "money" seem to be oddly coalesced in modern American culture. This construct, in combination with the global confusion of perceived value and true value, has lead to the market variables we are all seeing here.

How does this all come together? I woke up at 5AM this morning to a beautiful southeastern Pennsylvania fall breeze. I worked on some copy for a client on here who is only paying me $0.012/word with the windows open and the fourth opus of Vivaldi's Four Seasons blasting. I enjoy making words come together in interesting and expressive ways and the fact that I get paid to do something I enjoy while networking globally makes it all worthwhile. Will I always charge this much? No, but I know that every minute I put into developing a brand has an eventual return.

Regards,
Zeke

 

Aint that the truth.

I think it's best to see reference articles, check feedbacks, and question their experience on the topic.

Will they be doing some research or will they write just off the top of their head?

If they're going to just write off the top of their head, they'd better know that topic really well...

 

Thanks everyone for your stellar advice. I see you around the forums.

 

The issue is that when I come to DP I come here for low cost. If I wanted to employ a 'real' writer I would be advertising on the New York Times. I'm not here for great insight, but many of the articles are not even passable.

The types that I am looking for:

Bored teenagers wanting to make some money on the side
Foreigners who knows English pretty well
People who just write for fun and practice
people who live in low cost areas

It's pretty evident that people on DP are pretty lazy and do things only for the money, but still, a certain professional standard should be there... Very lacking here.

I do regularly shell out 50-70 cents a word on specific articles I want written. But a lot of times I just want to fill up my adsense blogs. But these guys can't even be coherant.

 

However, there are REAL writers at DP. "Passable" and "coherent" writing isn't a free or cheap service. If you are looking for bored teenagers, maybe you should advertise jobs on MySpace.

This mentality is nothing new. It's a given across the board. People don't want to pay writers what their services are worth, and then they want to complain about the quality of the work. On the other side though, writers who don't plan to deliver on the demands of the employer and are unhappy with the pay rate shouldn't accept the assignments.

These are simple bartering concepts that neither side can seem to understand.

 

That's ridiculous. Is that what they want to pay around here? I may be wasting my time. I really think that 90 percent of the site owners out there just don't understand the difference between quality writing and cheap content and outsourced broken English. I just have never considered myself in competition with Indian writers. Some people want the absolute cheapest they can get, and they can outsource to India. Other buyers want quality, and I'm only in competition to get those buyers.

I'm guessing you are talking about CC with the $30?

 

There are two other issues that come into play in the webmaster market:

1. Non-native English speakers who do intend to deliver on promises, but who can't, because their skills in the language just won't cut it. In a lot of cases, they honestly believe that they're providing high quality English language content, so it's not always intentional.

2. Many of the buyers are also non-native English speakers, who really just don't know the difference. They might be able to understand an article perfectly, while to a native speaker it might sound like total gibberish. So they pay low rates, get something that they believe is acceptable, and think that's the norm. I think there's a much better market in places like DP for editors than higher quality writers, but you don't see a lot of that advertised. Maybe it's something to look into for some writers.

Sounds like you're on the right path. That's one of the most difficult concepts to drill into newer writers, so you're already well ahead of the game.

 

Oosha says,"As Denise pointed out, there certainly are well-paying clients on DP, but very few". I am sure they are. But how to identify them? Should we know them in advance? Perhaps this will help all of us.
DaniseJ further mentions,"It will save both the client AND writer time and frustration if a budget was announced beforehand. That will save writers the trouble of applying for a job they realize isn't worth their time and the client will get responses from people who actually want to work within the rates set forth in the beginning". I appreciate this concern.
I wrote on another thread about this. Chant also writes here in the same voice,"...I also believe that since it is incredibly easy for anyone to call themselves a writer and begin trying to earn some extra side money writing articles...". As a matter of fact writing appears to be an easy task.Generally people think that it is just about making pertinent sentences.Using some keywords here and there and checking the gramar makes a nice article for many of the "Writers". It may be good for those who are targetting the 'Search Engines' and 'Page Ranks'. I have started looking at page 10+ on Google Search now. These SEO techniques are affecting the real objectives of the technology in many ways.
But then what a 'Writer" does so specifically? What is the difference between just putting sentences together and writing? Any visitor who is keeping pace with this thread, may wonder as why these people who call themselves as 'writers' are not happy with the 'peanuts' !
I have no well defined answers to these questions. But I think "A WRITER HAS A UNIQUE CAPACITY AND STRENGTH TO PUT A SOUL IN THE WORD. Words speak themselves. Thats what a writer can do.Can everyone who puts words and sentences together, grant a soul in the same way! Absolutely not. And that is why everybody can not be a writer.
I remember a discussion on"firing the client" a few days back. It was interesting to read views of some DP members.One fine morning I observed an eye-opener flash. "jhmattern" wrote something extra-ordinary in a very different tone. She gave "soul" to the discussion. I subsequently found a brilliant article on her own website. She wrote an unparallel article on the same subject. Thats what a writer can do with words and ideas.
Those who are looking for quality, uniqueness, and many more related aspects should also respect the writers and their efforts.Prices will improve automatically.

 

The people who pay more than peanuts on DP often don't advertise when they are looking for writers. Why? Because they don't want to be bombarded with every unqualified "writer" in the book. That's why it's harder to find them here.

Everyone can write... but not everyone can be a writer. You attempted to illustrate that point Ash, and I'm glad there are people who realize that writing isn't a task EVERYONE can do.

 

I completely agree that the writing on DP is terrible (for the most part). When I don't have time to research and write my articles myself though, I'll pay someone on DP to write them for me, knowing that I will not be getting quality. When I look for a writer though, I make sure find someone who at least writes good content. I then rewrite the articles I buy so that I am happy with them. There are plenty of writers on DP that I use just for this "research" and I feel that they are worth what they charge. That being said, anytime I want something done right, I do it myself. There are some writers on DP who, as somebody said earlier, don't know what their worth and write good articles at low prices

Just my 0.02

BTW, those of you who write elsewhere, where are the best places to sell writing services?

Chris

 

Chris, the best "place" to sell your writing services is your portfolio / business site. You need a business site to look as professional as you can. Then you need to network (with other writers, in potential client groups based on your niche, etc... that doesn't necessarily mean webmaster forums are the right place). If you focus on building a professional reputation and showcase a professional portfolio, you'll get better gigs than advertising for them on places like DP.

 

I am a little late plunging into this discussion. But if you think DP has garbage writers (or buyers) you should hop on across to getafreelancer.com.

Having said that, I think DP buyers (definitely not all, but most of them) either don't recognize quality when they see it or have fantastically lower standards for the content on their sites. There's a thread by a writer advertising his services here and it seems to have elicited a lot of response from buyers. Even the post itself is so badly written - chockfull of grammar errors, and uninspiring to say the least. If I was a buyer with even an ounce of business sense I wouldnt want writing of that calibre anywhere near my site and yet it astounds me to read some of the feedback he gets. One buyer even claimed he was the best writer on DP. If you had any respect for your writing wouldn't you at least make sure the advertisement for your services was worded perfectly?

I think it's not just that people here are willing to work for peanuts, but also the fact that many buyers have lowered standards of what they want or expect. Again, this doesnt hold true for all here - I've met a couple of great buyers here myself - but unfortunately, DP seems to be a place where a majority of such people - both garbage buyers and garbage sellers - meet.

 

And Jenn, there must be hundreds of writers getting their portfolios and webistes up because of your advice!

 

lol I'd hope so. Of course they'll only help if they put together quality portfolio pieces and a decent site.

 

I had positive experience.
Rebecca (internetauthor here) is consistently producing outstanding articles for me. Speed and quality are guaranteed.