First page on Google yet PR0? Please solve my puzzle

There you go again. We start to agree on something, and you go and throw around some horrible untruths like this again.

PR is what Google uses to determine how popular a website is. PR plus other on page and off page factors is what Google uses to determine SERP rankings. PR is the most important off page factor to SERP rankings.

Oh, so you mean their pagerank? Yes, I know that you ony see a PR0 on the Google toolbar, but we all know that that's not the REAL pagerank.

You can't say that serp rankings are related to the huge amount of backlinks in once sentence and say that PR has nothing to do with serp ranking in another.

PageRank is how Google calculates a site's backlinks.

 

PR and back links are 2 DIFFERENT THINGS!!!!! When I say quantity of links I'm not saying PR, they are obviously and clearly 2 completely different things!

Yes I agree when building links PR is one of the important factors but a PR 2 domain with a million links from PR 0/1/2 domains can outrank a PR6 domain with 5000 links from PR2/3/4.

Why do you keep on pursuing the PR concept when the thread is all about a site that is ranking for a HIGHLY competitive keyword with PR0...

PR is an important factors for building links PERIOD! From there on if you have a low PR site it doesn't mean that you won't do good in the SERPS!

Let's talk about the thread and if you want start a new one on the "importance of PR" and I'll be happy to continue our conversation.

Why don't you enlighten us on how a PR0 domain is ranking in the top 10 for so many HIGHLY competitive keywords? If by your standards PR is the most important thing when ranking a site and "PR was invented specifically for determining the order of SERPS."

 

This was mentioned earlier. I know that back links are far more important than outbound links on your own web page. My question is, what role do outbound links play? One poster said you don't want back links on a page that has to many outbound links? So...does that mean that I should limit the amount of outbound links on my page? Could I get some clairification please.

 

PR is what google uses to determine your popularity. Backlinks by themselves have no bearing whatsoever on SERP rankings. Google uses your PR as a way to represent your backlinks.

But what you see on the Google toolbar, or on any of the pagerank checking tools isn't LIVE PR. PR is calculated CONSTANTLY, but the TOOLBAR is only updated 3 or 4 times per YEAR.

My guess is that ALL or MOST if this sites backlinks were acquired since the last TOOLBAR update. Therefor you see a PR0 on the toolbar, but in reality, it probably has a pr3 or 4.

You can confirm that this happens yourself using Google Webmaster Central. Your PR shows up in there LONG before it ever show ups on the toolbar.

 

I just looked up several of the sites backlinks. None of them started showing up until August, which is before the last full toolbar PR update.

For example, one of their better backlinks is from...
lookingforbride.ru/

Using wayback machine, I can see that this link wasn't there at the end of July.
http://web.archive.org/web/20080601180801/http://lookingforbride.ru/

I looked up 3 or 4 of the better backlinks, and this is the case with all of them.

So all of the backlinks are new, and the live pagerank reflects the new backlinks, but the toolbar hasn't updated since then.

Mystery solved.

 

Absolutely keep your outbound links to a minimum. I recommend no more than about 12-15 outbound links per page.

And you should try to get inbound links on pages that have minimal links as well. These will be few and FAR in between, but if you see one that's relevant, you should grab it.

 

You just broke the GOOGLE CODE!

Come on, so now all the website that outrank a higher PR site is because the actually have a higher PR that still isn't showing in the google toolbar? (I know that the PR in the google toolbar isn't exact and updated but this is ridiculous) On the next toolbar update I'd love to see if all the low PR site outranking higher PR domains will magically have a higher PR than the sites they've outranked between the updates.

You are misleading a lot of newbies here that will continue buying really expensive high PR links pursuing to increase their own PR thinking that it will guarantee high rankings. PR is important and it is related to incoming links but it doesn't guarantee high rankings. Having a high PR doesn't and won't mean that you are assured top ten rankings! There are hundreds of factors to rank and PR is just one of them and not one of the most important.

If we are talking about building links than sure try to achieve incoming links from high PR sites for the simple fact that those pages are spidered more often and have a greater trust (trust doesn't mean rankings on it's own) but since we are talking about actually ranking a site first focus on having a great well optimized site and than focus on building links. Having a crappy site, with canonical problems and terrible navigation with scraped content won't get you anywhere even if you get/buy all the PR10 backlinks in this world and manage to achieve a high PR on your own.

So you solved a mystery by saying that a site that has been online since 2005 is ranking in the top ten for a really competitive niche because they started building links in the last couple of months after the last toolbar update. They built 30+ thousand links since the last toolbar update without being flagged? After almost 5 years online they are still PR 0? There are thousands of sites that are PR1/2/3 with few incoming links how come in 5 years they still are at 0 and ranking so well?

The point here is that when we talk about ranking in the top 10 having a high PR doesn't mean anything, focus on doing things properly and forget about the green bar in the toolbar.

This conversation is useless, since you won't understand the difference between ranking in the top ten and having a high PR. If you don't believe me do a research in any niche you want, now and after the next toolbar update. Let me know after update if you are still believing that to rank in the top ten you need a long green bar. I just hope that newbies stop focusing on building their PR and start focusing on building great sites, great content that will generate free/viral backlinks.

 

Check the backlinks yourself. It's really not that difficult. All of their backlinks were acquired since the last toolbar update. What's so hard to figure out about that? And the PR on the toolbar being updated slowly is an irrefutable fact. And the fact that Google keeps a 'live' PR that isn't always refelected in the toolbar is aso an irrefutable fact

If the site had no backlinks, and therefore no live PR, this site would be no where near the front page, regardless of how good their on page optimization is.

You're the one that's misleading all of these newbies by telling them that PR has nothing to do with their SERPS. I don't recommend anyone going out and spending tons of money buying links. The should work on their link building using proven techniques. Building more, quality backlinks form sites with

That's correct. Nothing is a guarantee.

If you're counting unique, keyword rich, unique title tags and content in your equasion, then PR is the 3rd more important. PR is THE most important off page factor.

Go check for yourself. They're all new. At least, all of the backlinks reported by Google are new.

Google representatives themselves have repeated told us that PR is the single most important off page factor that they use the rank SERPS. You need me to prove that, too?

I agree not to obsess over it, and that if you have a strong link building campaign, then good PR will follow. But PR is what Google uses to represent all of your backlinks when they determine where to rank your page on a SERP.

 

Guys and girls,
Frst of all, let's not go off topic here.
Second, I believe this site was ranking in top 10 a few months ago also.
Third, it's 2.5 years old (not 5).
Fourth, according to Yahoo Site Explorer it has about 6000 backlinks (It shows 30K including links from this domain).

I will not argue how much PR influences SERP but believe this site should have better PR considering it's SERP placement, domain age and backlinks. How did you see the age of backlinks anyway?

And yes, it's possible for PR3 site outrank PR6 site because of the keyword relevancy. If this keyword is more relevant to PR3 site, it will be displayed first. But when I see free dating site with PR0 between two other free dating sites with PR5 and PR4 - something is wrong here.

And I just saw this site ranked #1 for keyword "free dating" beating all older and higher pagerank and more backlinks sites like okcupid, datehookup, plentyoffish and etc...

Something is weird with google search...

 

interesting question my friends

 

There is nothing weird with Google, the simple fact is that PR has nothing to do with rankings, it is completely normal that a a PR0 or a PR1/2/3 will outrank a higher PR site, it isn't anything new and if you can't handle it delete the Google toolbar from your browser so at least you won't see the useless (as far as SERPS) green bar at the top.

If you are building links look at the PR from there on DO NOT WORRY ABOUT IT!

I agree with you that the site considering the age and incoming links should have a higher PR but the simple fact is that unless you are selling links forget about PR it has no value at all apart from the fact that links buyer will pay more for it. As long as you are indexed in Google you have a chance of being in the top 10 no matter what your PR is.

 

The simple fact is that PR has quite a bit to do with your rankings.

While a PR0 may outrank a higher PR site from time to time, YOUR site ABSOLUTELY will rank better as a PR4 than it will as a PR1. That, my friends, is an irrefutable fact.


[Edited - Deleted a section here, I misread the original quote. My apologies.]

The simple fact is that unless you are selling on page search engine optimization, PR is the strongest factor in how urls are ranked in a SERP.

This site ranks well for these SERPs because it's LIVE PAGERANK is 4. You only see 0 on the toolbar becuase the Google Toolbar hasn't been updated since this site gained all it's backlinks. On the next toolbar update, you'll see the PR go to 4.

 

The site has been ranking well since about July of this year. You can tell because of it's traffic in Alexa. Traffic previous to July is almost nothing.

That just happens to coincide with when all of it's backlinks start to appear.

Trust me, this site has a live pr of 4. It has many other SEO factors that help it, but it wouldn't be on those very competitive SERPs without strong PR.

 

Be patient up till next up date. Google takes 3 months to update website PR.

 

the caffein effect really mess up my life ..after 4 years of solid SERP attachment, finally google rip off my sites