how careful will she be when she sends the troop to war. Maybe she would do it only if god told her to do it <evil>what were you guys thinking</evil>
OK, little boy. One more time.... 1) I don't approve of teen age sex. I don't think anyone here thinks that Bristol and Levi were doing the right thing when they were having sex. Are you with me so far? 2) Bristol did not have an abortion. I like that. Says good values to me whether you like it or not. 3) I appreciate the fact that Levi Johnson is doing that right thing and is going to marry Bristol Palin. He is a great example of doing the right thing. Please just read this post again. Let's see if you can understand the small ideas before we go any further.
but its not a big deal her mother said that she chose to have the baby the choice that she wants to take away from the other mothers in the country [/QUOTE] yes he is a man of great character. it is also good to know that a condom or a visit to the doctors could have helped. she not only failed her child but she can do the same thing to a a lot of other families in that situation.
Sorry it took a while to get back to you Grim, been tied up with real work. THE BRIDGE The bridge thing is an overblown topic in my opinion and Palin oughta drop it and move on to more important things. Far better stuff we should have on the table, and both sides are wasting time with silly sniping when there are issues to debate. My only thought on the bridge is that far as I can tell reversing a stance and taking credit for the revised decision isnt new, there's a lotta DNC guys including Biden and Hillary that cant really point fingers... and Obama is running a campaign about Change and Bipartisanship despite a record that indicates that during his brief tenure as Senator he didnt shake anything up or act anywhere near as bipartisan as McCain. Personally I wish we could have an election where everyone running is required to be injected with a truth serum every morning. The debates would be more fun for sure. RECORD of CHANGE vs COOL SPEECHES ABOUT IT The VP put forth by the Dems is the poster child for the good ole boy system. Palin has been known to field dress good ole boys in her own party. Result: Strikes a chord with Americans... she currently has a higher approval rating than McCain, Biden, or Obama. It isnt a small number that are glad to see her enter the race. Bottom line I dont see her as running a campaign of lies, what I see is someone that has caught the opposition so offguard that theyre throwing anything they can and hoping *something* sticks. According to a Wasilla resident my wife talked to the other night (a cousin) who knows Palin, she DOES have a rep there for being a reformer, corruption fighter, etc. as advertised. She does NOT have a rep for being a religious fruitcake that cant function in the real world, contrary to portrayals we see on the net. POLLS AND PIGS McCains-Palin numbers seem to be making inroads, the opposing campaign seems to be getting a little desperate. The comments about putting lipstick on a pig spoken by Obama today would have passed as no big deal had Palin not just made the comment about the difference between a pit bull and a hockey mom being lipstick. In light of the timing it came off as a gaffe that'll be interpreted as mean spirited. Biden did it too, which made it appear worse... but he's *known* for gaffes, Obama is supposed to be the smart one. They may regain their composure, but right now theyre making tactical errors IMO. YMMV. ~ rob
The way the McCain campaign is whining about the lipstick on a pig thing is such BS and anyone with half a brain can see that. What Obama was talking about is that McCain has the EXACT SAME POLICIES as George W. Bush but is trying to dress them up as some sort of "change" when McCain is ANYTHING but a change. Obama wasn't talking about Palin, he was talking about McCain. Palin is nothing but a distraction and it's clear from McCain's response that they will continue to try and use her as a distraction from now on. It's childish. McCain used the exact same "lipstick on a pig" line when referring to Hillary Clinton's health care plan last year. So either McCain was calling Clinton a pig or he's a huge hypocrite by screwing Obama's words ridiculously out of context. One or the other. It's becoming clear that John McCain is intent on running the sleaziest campaign in history and considering recent history that's quite some feat. It's shocking to me that this race is close but I believe that these distractions and baseless smears will only distract people from the FACT that John McCain = 4 more years of the George W. Bush administration for so long. Plus it only underscores how similar McCain/Palin really are to Bush/Cheney. They have the same sleazeballs running their campaign.
Theses comments are suck a joke. The Obama team is smearing 10 times more than McCain is. I just love that Obama was saying leave Palin's daughter alone and he sent two lawyers to talk to her friends. Obama and his pencil thin resume is a joke himself talking out of both sides of his mouth. I guess that stems from his communist up bringing. 4years of McCain has got to be better than 4 years of communism. God has mercy On the United States if Obama is elected. You keep talking about four more years of the same. What has Obama done that is a change? What has Obama done that was creative or different? Nothing!!!
Ok, now Obama is a communist Just to add a little more information to this thread. I have taken the liberty of getting the finer points of All the candidates. This can be easily checked and double checked online, on Wik, and both Candidates State Government website. For some of you , it will undoubtedly be the first time that you have actually seen any of this, based on some of the remarks I have seen around here. _______________________________________________ Applicant: Senator John Leslie Mccain (Republican ) Position applied for: President of the United States * 72 Years Old. Born august 29, 1936 * Graduated Episcopal High School, Alexandria Virginia. * Graduate U.S. Naval Academy in 1958, 894th of 899 * Naval Officer and Pilot * Veteran and Prisoner of Vietnam War * U.S. Congressman 1982-1986 * U.S. Senator 1987-Present * Struggles with math while at the academy * Part of the infamous Keating 5. (the Savings and Loan Collapse of the 1980’s) During the 1980s as one of five United States Senators comprising the so-called “Keating Fiveâ€. Between 1982 and 1987, McCain had received $112,000 in lawful[ political contributions from Charles Keating Jr. and his associates at Lincoln Savings and Loan Association, along with trips on Keating’s jets that McCain belatedly repaid two years later. * Senator McCain became a member of the Armed Services Committee, with which he had formerly done his Navy liaison work; he also joined the Commerce Committee and the Indian Affairs Committee. McCain continued to support the Native American agenda. As first a House member and then a senator, McCain was one of the main authors of the 1988 Indian Gaming Regulatory Act, which codified rules regarding Native American gambling enterprises and established a balance between tribal sovereignty and state regulatory oversight over such enterprises. McCain was also a strong supporter of the Gramm-Rudman legislation that enforced automatic spending cuts in the case of budget deficits * The Arizona senator targeted pork barrel spending by Congress, and he actively supported the Line Item Veto Act of 1996, which gave the president power to veto individual spending items. However, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled in 1998 that the act was unconstitutional ___________________________________________ Applicant: Senator Barack Obama (Democrat) Position Applied for: President of the United States * Born Aug 1, 1961in Honolulu , Hawaii * Graduated High School in 1979 * Attended Occidendal College for 2 years * Graduated from Columbia University in 1983 with B.A. in Political Science, specializing in International Relations. * 1983 Worked for Business International Corporation * Worked for New York Public Interest Group * 1985 to 1988 worked as a community organizer. Programs included job taining, college prep, and teneants rights. * Entered Harvard Law School in late 1988 * 1989 editor of the Harvard Law Review * 1990 President of Harvard Law Review * 1991 graduated with a Juris Doctor (J.D.) magna cum laude from Harvard. * Directed Illinois Project Vote from April to October 1992 , registering 150,00 African American Voters * Named Top “40 under 40″powers to be, by Crain’s Chicago Business * Taught Constitutional Law at the University of Chicago Law School for twelve years, as a Lecturer for four years (1992–1996), and as a Senior Lecturer for eight years (1996–2004). * 1993 joined Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland, a 12-attorney law firm specializing in civil rights litigation and neighborhood economic development. * Founding member of the board of directors of Public Allies in 1992 * Board of directors of the Woods Fund of Chicago, which in 1985 had been the first foundation to fund Obama’s DCP, from 1993–2002. * Served on the board of directors of The Joyce Foundation from 1994–2002. * Served on the board of directors of the Chicago Annenberg Challenge from 1995–2002, as founding president and chairman of the board of directors from 1995–1999. * Served on the board of directors of the Chicago Lawyers’ Committee for Civil Rights Under Law, the Center for Neighborhood Technology, and the Lugenia Burns Hope Center. * Illinois State. Senator 1996 * Once elected, Obama gained bipartisan support for legislation reforming ethics and health care laws.[ He sponsored a law increasing tax credits for low-income workers, negotiated welfare reform, and promoted increased subsidies for childcare. * In 2001, as co-chairman of the bipartisan Joint Committee on Administrative Rules, Obama supported Republican Governor Ryan’s payday loan regulations and predatory mortgage lending regulations aimed at averting home foreclosures. * In 2003, Obama sponsored and led unanimous, bipartisan passage of legislation to monitor racial profiling by requiring police to record the race of drivers they detained and legislation making Illinois the first state to mandate videotaping of homicide interrogations. * 2003, Obama became chairman of the Illinois Senate’s Health and Human Services Committee when Democrats, after a decade in the minority, regained a majority. During his 2004 general election campaign for U.S. Senate, police representatives credited Obama for his active engagement with police organizations in enacting death penalty reforms. Obama resigned from the Illinois Senate in November 2004 following his election to the US Senate. * 2003 formally announced his candidacy for U.S Senate. Obama’s expected opponent in the general election, Republican primary winner Jack Ryan, withdrew from the race in June 2004. * Obama voted in favor of the Energy Policy Act of 2005 * 2006, Obama supported a related bill, the Secure Fence Act * Obama introduced two initiatives bearing his name: “Lugar–Obama,†which expanded the Nunn–Lugar cooperative threat reduction concept to conventional weapon * “Coburn–Obama Transparency Act,†which authorized the establishment of www.USAspending.gov, a web search engine. * Obama held assignments on the Senate Committees for Foreign Relations, Environment and Public Works and Veterans’ Affairs through December 2006. In January 2007, he left the Environment and Public Works committee and took additional assignments with Health, Education, Labor and Pensions and Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs He also became Chairman of the Senate’s subcommittee on European Affairs. As a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Obama has made official trips to Eastern Europe, the Middle East, Central Asia and Africa. __________________________________________ There is more about each candidate, but let's be real about the records. No one is a communist. The facts speak for themselves. They cannot be faked, there are too many documented sources including state and Government websites. Mcain has 30 years in the Senate, and he does have a good record against a lot of pork barrel spending, but if you look closely, most of it comes after George Bush was elected for a second term. Mccains record and experience match up more with Joe Biden, who has been around the Senate just as long. If you match Obama with Palin on the area of Experience and education here is what you get: __________________________________________ Applicant: Gov. Sarah Louise Heath Palin ( Republican) Position applied for: Vice President of the United States * Born Feb 11, 1964 in Sandpoint , Idaho * Graduated 1983 Wasilla High School, Wasilla, Alaska * Head of Fellowship of Christian Athletes * Point Guard on High School Basketball Team * Won Miss Wasilla Beauty Pagent in 1984, 2nd place in Miss Alaska * Attended one semester Hawaii Pacific College * Attended North Idaho College * Attended University of Idaho * Attended Matanuska-Susitna College * Graduated University of Idaho with Bachelor of Science degree in Communications-Journalism. * Worked as a sports reporter for KTUU-TV in Anchorage, Alaska. * 2 terms Wasilla, Alaska City Council * 2 terms Mayor of Wasilla, Alaska * Unsuccessful bid for lieutenant governor of Alaska in 1992 * Appointed to the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission, where she served for one year. * First Female Governor in Alaska in 2006 * After resigning from Alaska Oil and Gas Commission, Palin filed formal complaints against the state Republican Party’s chairman, Randy Ruedrich, and former Alaska Attorney General Gregg Renkes. She accused Ruedrich, one of her fellow commissioners, of doing work for the party on public time and working closely with a company he was supposed to be regulating. Ruedrich and Renkes both resigned and Ruedrich paid a record $12,000 fine. * During her second term as mayor, Palin hired the Anchorage-based lobbying firm of Robertson, Monagle & Eastaugh to lobby for earmarks for Wasilla. The effort was led by Steven Silver, a former chief of staff for Senator Ted Stevens, and it secured nearly $27 million in earmarked funds. The earmarks included $500,000 for a youth shelter, $1.9 million for a transportation hub, $900,000 for sewer repairs, and $15 million for a rail project linking Wasilla and the ski resort community of Girdwood. Some of the earmarks were criticized by Senator McCain. _______________________________________ Applicant: Senator Joe Biden (Democrat) Position applied for: Vice President of the United States * 1961 graduated from Archmere Academy in Claymont, Delaware * Graduated from the University of Delaware in Newark, with a double major in History and Political Science in 1965. * Receive his J.D. (Juris Doctor) from Syracuse University College of Law in 1968. * Member of the Delaware Bar since 1969. * U.S. Senator 1973-Present * Committee on Foreign Relations (chairman) o As chairman of the full committee Biden is an ex officio member of each subcommittee. * Committee on the Judiciary o Subcommittee on Antitrust Competition Policy and Consumer Rights o Subcommittee on Crime and Drugs (chairman) o Subcommittee on Human Rights and the Law o Subcommittee on Immigration, Border Security, and Refugees o Subcommittee on Technology Terrorism and Homeland Security * Caucus on International Narcotics Control (co-chairman) * Involved in crafting many federal crime laws over the last decade, including the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994, also known as the Biden Crime Law, and the landmark Violence Against Women Act of 1994 (VAWA), * In 1981, Biden received an honorary degree from Saint Joseph’s University. Since 1991, Biden has also served as an adjunct professor at the Widener University School of Law. He teaches a seminar on constitutional law. ____________________________________________ Since all of the candidates have served in Public office on a state or National Level, there is obviously more voting records than I can post, but it does give an overview of what they really have done. When you get down to brass tacks Sarah Palin has the least amount of education and experience of all of them. Barack Obama has more Education than All of them. John Mccain has more hands on experience, and the second amount of education, yet is a Veteran. Joe Biden has all of the above, and more experience than ALL OF THEM. Since the President is responsible for understanding and upholding the laws of the U.S. and it's constitution, I would think Bidens and Obamas P.H.D's in constitutional law would be a finer point, but most Americans don't even know what the constitution says, just a few lines here and there, and what others tell them. This is not picking on anyone...this is what they bring to the table. There is no measurement for trustworthiness and "hoodspa" You don't have to take my word for it, but all the slinging of "communism", "Muslim" and other nonsense is just ridiculous and the only thing it does is make arguments and then people start getting personal with insults. It's just starting to get laughable. Just stick to the news, and the issues. I know there are more intelligent people on this forum than just name calling and threatening to kick peoples ass. No one is going to do anything to anyone so everyone can stop boasting how bad they are...we are all spread all over the country and the world..So get over the personal insults and discuss the issues that are at hand. If you are going to make an accusation, at least back it up with a link, or documentation. Just spewing mud and falsehoods make you and this forum look like a bunch of nerds who were picked on in high school, but have enough guts to pick a fight online, to the outside world. This forum is for Adults isn't it?
Hmansfield, Great resource - thanks for posting it. It may be ignored by some, as they have ignored everything else of substance, but it's great information nevertheless. And by the way, belatedly seen, thanks for your service to the country as well.
Thanks, and I will be the first to admit I get sucked in to personal spats as well. I don't take personal insults very well. I am a grown man. Very resourceful, well trained and competitive. I could totally see myself getting so involved that I contemplated a short road trip and I had to back up and take a look at myself. I may not agree with everyone's opinion, and I don't expect everyone to agree with mine, but I'm not going to insult someone for having it. I would rather post proof of my side of the issue. That is what intelligent people do. It doesn't take a lot of maturity to call someone a name. It actually requires the least amount of intelligence. Fact. Proven Here. I would like to hear people's intelligent opinions without the juvenile chest thumping, and I will promise to behave and act accordingly as well. And that is Change you can believe in.
No it is nothing new, it does not make it factual or correct though. It's a huge part of what she supposedly brings to the tables making much of what she brings false. Approval ratings in a state for governorship versus senators honestly can not be compared. To even attempt you'd need to look at their local districts and not national polls. ---not sure what approval ratings you're talking about? For the election of the President, or Senate V Governor BTW much of her 'strong' points from my readings are flat out lies, lets see how long lies can carry her. I would disagree, she is being carried on the corruption fighter 'of which she appears guilty of the same thing, if not worse' of the 'bridge to nowhere' that she originally campaigned on. Talking to cousins proves nothing, I have watched many relatives of murderers state 'they just couldn't of done it', they are the worst people to ask for an unbiased view of things. Obama was not speaking of Palin, the right has spun it. I don't see what this has to do with anything I posted though in all reality. Read above.
I appreciate your posts, Hmansfield. If I ever came off as a holier than thou prick, I'm sorry (I say this to the community as well), because I am the last guy to preach. There are a few things I don't take well at all - mostly, what I would call game playing when posting, or sheer idiocy and obduracy masked as a bona fide point of view. And I have lost my cool, way more times than I'd like to recount.
Please let me say my own words. That is the problem. You seem to think that I am saying that it is OK. I keep saying it is not. Why won't you listen? I thought that you didn't want to talk about abortion? You really have to stop this. I know what Governor Palin believes. I do not know if she supported any anti abortion legislation in Alaska. Do you or are you just talking out your ass again? Great. Now leave him alone. Since Bristol did not abort their baby, does that mean anything to you? Do you know that Levi did not use a condom? I'll bet you don't. Please, since you are sooo open to learning new things, please learn to think before you speak. We've already talked about Governor Palin's supposed guilt. You have no children, yet you continue to profess yourself as the leading authority on raising children, which is idiotic. ===================================================================== Actually, when I heard the "lipstick on a pig" referrence, I thought it was a cheap shot. I knew there would be hell to pay. Was I offended? No, but I don't wear lipstick either. How about "wrap an old fish in a newspaper"? If you were to list keywords for McCain, I think "old" would be near the top. If you were to list keywords for Palin, I think "lipstick" would be near the top. Given the fact that Obama was not stuttering and stammering, we can assume that he was reading his prepared speech. Don't think for a second that both referrences were accidental or coincidental. His every word is scripted and calculated. Guilty as charged!
Obama is typical.....When he makes a sexiest remark he gets a free pass. When he makes racial profile or slurs such as fathers day he gets a free pass. It is the typical free pass given to him on everything..
Nice to see those resumes are so unbiased... but I notice they entirely leave out the part where Obama healed the sick and made the blind to see. ==== Speaking of Disengenuous As for the lipstick comment... sorry, but the biden/obama protests of innocence were patently disengenuous. I'm familiar with the analogy... I have used it myself... but the quote by itself would be innocuous had it not been immediately in the wake of her speech where she made the lipstick comment, which was the biggest applause line of the speech and widely reported. That both Biden and Obama are using the lipstick/pig analogy immediately thereafter to the snickering and applause of their audience of supporters is frankly sad and transparent, and it speaks to their desperation. All it accomplished was to get the press to ignore anything substantial they might have said in their speech and gravely sit around discussing whether or not they meant to take the shot they took... and the snickers in the audience as they got to the word lipstick spoke volumes. They wasted a news cycle... rookie move on their part. === What do the People that KNOW Her Think? Nonetheless Palin has by all accounts shaken up the campaign. Most of us never heard of her until 2 weeks ago, but her rep in her own state is high. Bush has a low approval rating among his constituency... which is frequently cited by the Dems (who conveniently fail to note that both of the candidates are from the only branch of government with an even LOWER approval rating than Bush). If those approval ratings mean *anything* when hurled as a criticism of Bush... then Palins approval rating of 82% among her own constituents in Alaska ALSO means somethiing. The people who know her BEST think extremely high of her. We dont get to consider it as a damning factor where Bush is concerned but a matter of inconsequence when applied to Palin. Logic doesnt work that way. Reminds me of Sigmund Freud. He told people THEIR cigar is a phallic symbol while saying HIS cigar... is just a cigar. ==== Grim - The cousin I referenced in Wasilla was my wifes cousin, not Palins. I'd agree with your point if it'd been Palins cousin. I was just saying we have talked to someone that actually knows Palin and she says Palin fits her own campaign bio better than she fits the smears that have been generously thrown her way. That's anecdotal, but the plural of anecdote is "data"... and it is obvious based on her personal approval ratings in her own state that it is not a lone opinion. Obviously it is a feeling shared by many who know her well. I'd take their word over that of the Democratic faithful that hadnt heard of her 2 weeks ago. Again... we cant suggest that Bush's low approval ratings are meaningful, but Palins high ratings are meaningless. She is also now receiving higher marks in national polls than the other 3 candidates. She has definitely changed the dynamic of this campaign... and that's change you can believe in.
the republican party seems to think that it is not such a big deal and my criticisim is at them. you are not important to me. It is up to you to support this kind of behavior or not. i had better things to talk about ,her morality. i was being sarcastic but i guess among the rest of the republican fools, crooks fools and child molesters he seems like a stand up guy. No having the baby does not give them a pass. It seems that republicans have become a one issue party. I think Failin family's belief in regard to these sort of things had a lot to do with the girl being unprepared for sex. I measure her with her standards not mine. She has failed to raise her child to her standard. and so she has failed her. Also isn't supplying minors with alcohol a crime in Alaska. It is in NY, So did she commit a crime if she allowed them to drink in her house. Once she start giving interviews and taking questions then we have other things to talk about. It is so crazy that republicans have candidate for vP and they are hiding her. so how rer we to judge her. just by one speech that she is repeating all over the place. It seems that the republicans are trying to con us int electing Mcsame/Failin.
High ratings or not, does not take away from the fact most of the hoopla is built on lies So what is Obama's ratings in his district, Biden's and McCains. You can not compare a republicans ratings in a very republican state versus that of a senator's ratings in the entire nation. Many who support Palin have no clue about the reality of her stances, when I bring them up 'such as the bridge to nowhere' they look like dear in head lights' they don't even know how to respond. Both parties suck, both choices suck big time.
You are a waste of time. You cannot stay on topic even for the simplest of conversations. The best thing about you is that you won't procreate.
The last time that somebody pushed a lie and half truths in their speech got us into an unnecessary war. What are they trying to get us into this time? Aren't you sick of them trying to con us into things? why are they hiding her if she is soooo good It goes to her character again. @AZZ Why don't you accept that you have been coned by the republican party for the past 8 years and are being coned again. It is the republican party that has become a waste of time