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Should the motto "In God We Trust" be removed from U.S. currency?

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by C a s p e r, Aug 20, 2008.

  1. jkjazz

    jkjazz Peon

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    #21
    Hell, he's just getting started. His athiest blog is a really nasty place. Looks like he spends a lot of time there.
     
    jkjazz, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  2. homebizseo

    homebizseo Peon

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    #22
    It only a matter of time before the bashers show up. They must be the most popular party killers in town. When they show up to a party the party moves to another location.
     
    homebizseo, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  3. stOx

    stOx Notable Member

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    #23
    the phrase it's self is fairly meaningless and trivial (not to mention untrue, What happened to thou shalt not lie, christians?). But the fact that you are paying, by virtue of being a tax eligible citizen, to have religious scrawling over your money is both unconstitutional and unfair. Let the religious write whatever fanciful shit they like on their own property, But public property should be religion free.
     
    stOx, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  4. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #24
    Stox's point is legitimate. I, personally, don't care, but the original national motto - "e pluribus unum," "from many, one," is apt, and appropriate. "In God We Trust" was not established as a "national motto" until 1956, a latter-day creation, and it isn't appropriate, in my opinion. The placement on coins came much earlier, at the behest of Christian constituents:

    http://www.treas.gov/education/fact-sheets/currency/in-god-we-trust.shtml

    Seems to me, very much against the notion of establishing religion, and therefore unconstitutional. With respect to Christians' rights to the free practice of their faith, and yet the separation of faith from public, governmental life, perhaps Jefferson's words can guide:

    Stox, good points.
     
    northpointaiki, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  5. Barti1987

    Barti1987 Well-Known Member

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    #25
    This country was established by Christians and was mostly built with emphasis on Christian values and teachings.

    It is just now that we see Immigrants who think they own this country and was to turn it into a secular country.

    Peace,
     
    Barti1987, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  6. Toopac

    Toopac Peon

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    #26
    lol too true:D
     
    Toopac, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  7. stOx

    stOx Notable Member

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    #27
    No it wasn't. Hardly any of the founding fathers were christian. And even if they were, America is founded on the constitution, An entirely secular document that does not, even once, mention christianity. something which it surely would have done if the intentions of the founding fathers was to form a christian nation based on "christian values". In fact, The only mention of religion in any of their text is there specifically to prevent a religious nation being formed and to give people freedom FROM religion as well as the right to privately practice it.

    I suggest you take a look at some of the things Jefferson had to say about christianity.

    Also take a look at the 1797 treaty of Tripoli which states "the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."

    Thou shalt not lie. Practice it or stop proclaiming it.
     
    stOx, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  8. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #28
    Azizny, firstly, the country wasn't founded by Christians. It was founded by people with a host of differing faiths, or non-faith, and from my read, the prevailing "faith" may have quite likely been a rationalist doctrine of deism.

    Secondly, whether the country was or wasn't founded by Christians, their view on the sanctity of private faith, and separation of faith and public affairs, should guide.

    This has been brought up before. In addition to Thomas Jefferson's thoughts above, please also see:

    James Madison:

    John Adams (Treaty of Tripoli):

    -and on and on. It is a myth that the country was founded as a Christian nation. I will respect your right to your private faith, and belief in the defense of that right to the utmost. I do not agree with unconstitutionally promulgating religion in public life.

    Edit: posted before I saw Stox's post. Agreed.
     
    northpointaiki, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  9. xXKingdom_SEOXx

    xXKingdom_SEOXx Peon

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    #29
    I agree with stOx. Personal faith should have nothing to do with public currency.
     
    xXKingdom_SEOXx, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  10. homebizseo

    homebizseo Peon

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    #30
    How much did the bible play in part in the writing of US constitution?
     
    homebizseo, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  11. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #31
    None, from what I can tell. Sincerely - do you dismiss Thomas Jefferson's, James Madison's, John Adams's views as to what we were founded on, with respect to this issue?
     
    northpointaiki, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  12. homebizseo

    homebizseo Peon

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    #32
    I did not dismiss the views you listed. I have read several articles stating how the bible influenced the forming of the Government.
    How much did the bible play in part in the writing of US constitution if any?
     
    homebizseo, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  13. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #33
    I'd be interested in seeing those articles, Homebiz; if you have sources, I'd appreciate the read.

    I do not see anything in the U.S. constitution that includes biblical teaching. Do you?
     
    northpointaiki, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  14. gworld

    gworld Prominent Member

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    #34
    Probably they studied the bible and noticed all the crazy stories, so they decided to separate government from religion in the Constitution. :D
     
    gworld, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  15. EGS

    EGS Notable Member

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    #35
    I think it should stay. It has more meaning than what the poll represented...
    "In God We Trust" instead of trusting in our own self and greed and money..
     
    EGS, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  16. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #36
    There were many devout Christians at the inception of the United States, who were equally devout in their belief that private faith and public provision for that faith should not conjoin.
     
    northpointaiki, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  17. stOx

    stOx Notable Member

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    #37
    That's fine, If you believe in god, But not everyone does.
    What part of "not everyone believes in god" are people having trouble understanding?
     
    stOx, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  18. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #38
    Side topic, but is there anything wrong with self-reliance, living ethically, with compassion towards your fellow human beings, without reliance on a third party to do it for you?

    In other words, I do not see "god" as necessary to living a moral, compassionate life.
     
    northpointaiki, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  19. jkjazz

    jkjazz Peon

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    #39
    Then whose version of "moral" are you going to use? PETA? Gay and Lesbian Task Force? The North American Man/Boy Love Association? KKK? Skinheads?

    At least with the Bible, we have a roadmap to try to follow.
     
    jkjazz, Aug 23, 2008 IP
  20. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #40
    Gee, Jazz, with such ironclad logic in place, hard to argue. Of course, I previously thought there was at least one or two ways to conduct oneself outside of, on the one side, Christian theology, and on the other, apparently as you see it, pedophilia, racism and violence.

    Sorry - I stand corrected. Thanks for clearing it up.
     
    northpointaiki, Aug 23, 2008 IP